Jet question out to T-4 ers

What venturi's and main jets are most of you folks running. I am going to borrow a very exspencive O-2 set up that belongs to a good friend and he will be a active part of the loan. I have a pretty good assortment of jets . but need to get more to make sure we have it covered I think it's way to lean and we are going check everything again (square one)

Barry, search the web for "dawes devices"
a/f meters are nothing more than 02 sensors and millivolts.
very handy to have your own----bruce

With two 44IDFs my notes say #155 mains and #175 air. That's on a 2367 with mild cam,mild compression, and a 4-1 BAS merged header. Last air-fuel on dyno readout was 12.5 to 13 throughout the whole range.
You mean mere mortals can actually adjust these things? Has my Weber man been lying to me again?

There are CO sensors out there for $150 that a re pretty accurate - I go one and it really helps. Shove it up the tail pipe and read the digital output.

Mike

Your Weber man may not have fibbed .I just finished another tear down and left the 175 correction jets alone, main jets are know 140s and idle jets are know 60s and replace the bypass jet with the ones supplied by weber in th jet kit. as they suggest .It starts better but no cigar. 1&2 are still lame on this 2056
Im rechecking the valves and the plugs and the compression the weekend before Ernie checks it out. he use to work at VW
Whatever happens this is it If it fails Im gonna pluck this turkey. and build a T-1 MY WAY

Mike - What brand co sensor and where did you purchase it?

It is a Gunson Gastester...I just started using it. I like it.

www.aep.bigstep.com/digital.htm

Mike

Ernie made it by this evening,he was here only 30 minutes. 5 mintues of checking it over an 2 mintues of talk an the rest.

THE T-4 TURKEY HAS BEEN PULLED!

Ernie made it by this evening,he was here only 30 minutes. 5 mintues of checking it over an 2 mintues of talk an the rest.

THE T-4 TURKEY HAS BEEN PULLED I HAVE WASTED TO MUCH TIME ON THIS THING
I will do what I do best A T-1 single carb duelport ,I can use my DTM on it I made a second set of head tins T-1s of course .

I will proceed to dry out the carbs an crate up the T-4 for storage. I still will get back to the t-4 but later as money,and time will allow . as I said earler I need this car on the road, Push has come to shove

KISS............ Keep It Simple Stupid
I should have never got this Turkey

And to The next question NO !!!!

I spoke with Charles Navarone this weekend, and I first need to say Im sorry If I got to long winded. He feels I should pull it down and check it out to see what went wrong .

One thing is for sure I don't have the money to spend on it at this time . best to dismanlte and clean the carbs & parts for a over winter storage .Untill Income tax time. I have NO Choice

It should not be that difficult.
CB sets up their carbs way too rich for me out of the box! I order them with different jets.

If you carbs are 44s, try this, iot works 99.95% of the time for me.

36mm vent
135 main
55 idle
F11 emuksion
200 airs

2 turns out on the mixture controls.

Thats what almost all my engines like.

I think one reason you have had a more difficult time is because you have tried to reinvent the wheel and skimp in alot of areas... I never have issues like this. Don't be suprised if your exhaust system did not kill a valve or a seat! I have seen it WAY too many times.
What goes in MUST come back out!

Jake they came with almost that very set up . Just 125s instead of 135s , and correction jets 175s. venturi 45s .But I have low compresson problems on 1&2 I will have to pull it down.

This thing was giving trouble even with the Sebring muffler on it from the very start. So the more I think about it I suspect a cylinder or ring problem . to soon to say for sure.

If the cam is wiped out,It not showing on the valve clearances. but what do I know about T 4s

I have seen clearances just fine but the cam be gone....

chances are that you have a carb issue on 1-2, do a compression check before anything else. This sounds simple.

I'd be willing to walk you through it if you want.

That was one of my kits, and he did everything to the "T" very meticulously.

I almost bet the exhaust was the Sniper in this one.

Thanks, The heads will go back to flow masters before they go back on. i will be giving the seats close inspection

Would you say it's to low restriction or to high that kills the seats. Sounds like I will have to have the CSP exhaust system for it to look and work right. I need the heat exchanger to work.

Cylinders test
(1) 72 psi
(2)64 psi
(3) 100 psi
(4) 100 psi

That sound like a compress chamber problem to me

With a choked up exhaust, the heatcannot escape....simply. The heat kills the seats.
Did you have the throttles open for that compression check? All the #s are low.

If you have a leak down tester you can find the issue now, easily.

Barry,

You are in excellent hands with Jake. Don't fall on your sword just yet. Jake is fantastic about lending an ear and offering helpful advice. Knock-on-wood all will be well shortly.

Thank ya..

Well I been sharpening my sword.
I will try hooking it on to the spare tranny,robbing the starter , borrow a better tester, and go again
I will also see if I can find a pair mic's I have and try to measure the valve spring travel, That should give me a idea of the present valve lift on all 4 lobes, without any tampering.

Barry,

Despite his bark Jake is a softie. And the guy that assembled his engine kit is said to know his stuff.

Just as a suggestion, why not personally call Jake and see if you pulled the engine could you drive down to his shop for him to look it over and make suggestions. There was a guy from Charlotte that had problems with his T4 engine (he built it himself); Jake bent over backwards to help him sort it out. Before you tear into the engine too deep see what Jake says first. You are three or four hours from his shop. As the kit was Jake's, if the cam went flat I reckon Jake would take that up with his vendor. Just my two cents, Jake will do what he can.

I.d Hate to bother Jake when I know. I don,t have the funds to do the engine right, at this time .
If I do have to redo it I may take Charles advise and up it to nickies and go to 101s The cost would not be that much more and it would pull better.if T took the car in to the montains of NC,
That is ,If I ever get to take a decent vaction. They just told me this morning I may have to go in on Turkey day.

And I do appreciate the help.

Fact is, there may not be anything wrong with it.

My number to my desk is 706 865 1963, I'll be here till 3 Am. Call me.

I enjoy working on Holidays. damn phone doesn't ring!

Fact is Im to imbarrished to work on it with the famly all hovering in this week. I would rather not open that wet can of worms.

But I will say it did spit back a bit when I first started it up. I never heard any excessive valve rattle or any burnt valve type noises , no lose head leaking noise It just sounds like a 2 cylinder at idle .(Awful)
It smooths out on exceration but still sounds rough at a 2,000 rpm hold.

The last time I had a T-1 that sounded this bad it had a cut doenut seal on the intake. Ok if i have a intake leak a spray can of ether should find it. ( Right? ) Nope ,nadda, zilich, No cigar ,

But if I had a cracked head, that might make explain low compresson and the rough running, This was a cheap NAPA compresson tester So I will recheck it with a better tool

Perhaps the advance was set too high, just like I mentioned when you said it had a hard time firing up......High timing can do justabout anything to the engine.

The aircooled engine's worst enemy is to be out of tune! TUNING IS EVERYTHING!

When I changed out the distributor the other week I bumped it before I got it locked ,when I reset it to .05 btdc it was fine.

When I changed out the distributor the other week I bumped it before I got it locked ,when I reset it to .05 btdc it was fine. It only spit a time or two.

I was woundering what would be the result if Mr Hegerson had never blocked of the egr vent at the head, how would that act.

Heres the other things I know he missed ,the cable roller hole was not pluged, also he had 2 push rod retainers not holding the tubes in , and a pinched O-ring on #2 exhaust push rod tube at the case end. I had to order flywheel shims fron Stoddards they were missing. No rear main seal . missing , The inner O-ring behind the fan hub not there,
The oil pump surface leaked,and the center stump plate leaked , Caused by unmachine surfaces, I surfaced them , per David Dowlings suggestions. They were most likely the machine shops fault.
The inspecton plate was my fault. I should have never tried to install the temp sender there. I replaced that plate. thats All that i know for sure at this time.

The more I think the more I feel I better take it down. before It throws a rod and breaks the case . I,d bet he didn,t stake the rod studs eather which has allways been my standard practice on any kind of engine. I have drilled and wired the rod studs on one engine I knew the the guy was a lead foot.and his friends would talk (S) thats the El-camino my other toy.

Okay, do as you wish...

As for the rods, the last set of rods that I "Staked" were on a 40 Horse a few months back. TIV rods don't even give you the slot in the rod to do the procedure- Its not needed.

I'd trust your work with my life . Because I know you have built, and serviced , aircraft engines ,to the Highest standard.

If I could afford you . It would be a No contest ,No question in my mind, The best possible build,out there.
I realLy wish I could But alas I am just a poor man who went all out to have his dream become a reality. IF fate is willing, I wish to finish this.
Its not over . I am gonna try to raise the funds to do it OUT of pocket. And maybe into your hands but without any more loans.

I work in a textile mill. and I sure you have heard all the poop about textile manufacturing , and busnesses going oversea's. In a year from now, I may not have a income. The company where I work is not imune. I need to try to stay out of deat. and stay ahead of that kind of trouble .

I do intend to check it anyway just as you said I came in form work this moring and have not took any naps This mess has me wired and I have had to go out and about today.
I am NOT mad at anyone, Not even John Helgerson. And I know I am not infailable. I make mistakes everyday If it checks out normal the second time.It would be a prayer anwsered. . But if I don,t feel confident with it. I will leave it alone for now. and start saving up.

Highest readings from 3 compression test using Conway Vestal's equipment

(1) 135
(2) 168
(3) 140
(4) 150

note 1&3
I tested one 5 times. Carbs Off

I,ll make my best guess now. Its a combonation of head seats and chewed cam lobes .

Barry,

I'm no Type 4 guy or anything, but that motor should run with the compression figures you have. It would be great if your compression was more constant across the cylinders, but you're over 100 psi on each of the four cylinders. I think you've got another problem. I know you are shy about calling Jake, but isn't it less embarrassing than posting here? I'd call him if it were me...

That engine sounds solid.... One cylinder has weird compression, but it will still fire.

The issue is somewhere else. swap carbs from side to side and see if the issue follows suite....

I am not the least bit worried about.what people think of me. I could care less.

I concidered the carb swapping. What the heck ,everything else has failed.
However! If the compresson is not fairly even ,would that not be just as bad as a poor balance job that would sooner or later tear the thing appart.
Make it right, and it will last.
I have other issues with this engine as well.
1) I would like to be able use cheaper fuel 8.5 compression is a bit high for that.
(2)The torque band is higher than needed for a automatic car. If what Charles has reported on his car ,is correct! It needs more torque in the lower end to pass traffic well.
That brings up questions about valve sizes, CC'd, and even the cam configuration.
I am not planning to race the thing. It will never be driven at higher speeds than 90 . Well at least not that often.
(3) I wanted Nickies in the thing from the getgo. They run cooler and last a lot longer than stock cylinders. This will be my last custom. I doubt if my heath will allow me to build any more.

If the carbs prove to be the problem. Thenwhat ,I have completly dismanled the one that shows to be giving trouble. and carb cleaned and blew out all the passages epecally the 4 tiny holes at the bottom inside both the barrels.

Don't worry about the compression. 8.5:1 is childs play! I run 10:1 on 93 octane.

Try 89 or 87, the timing might need to be adjusted to compensate.

It sounds like no matter what you want to take it apart- So, do it!

That engine was one of my kits, so its balanced very tightley.

No after a long discussion here at home. I am debating on putting it in your hands as soon as I can afford too. Where you can work your magic. As you see fit.
But it will be a while , and I know you have a full plate.

I will even remove the oil cooler kit and leave it on the engine, exhaust, carbs and all if your gonna blow one because of the exhaust I'd rather it was mine and not yours or a customer.
I will try to include enough funds for nickies IF it comes to that. If there is a cam problem I,LL leave any spec changes for the cam in your hands,.Talk to Charles at L&N about his T-3 w/t the T-4
A lower torque range may be needed for the automatic eather that or bigger cylinders.
If you want me to load it up and drop It off,I will but I,d hate for it to take up space on your shelf for a year,or worse be sold.

Just keep it there........Buy some LN 102s and we'll tear it down when they come in...
want power? Got Power!