Question on a type1 with type 4 oil cooler

I am no fan of external oil coolers and remote oil filters kits they do work but many tend to leak.

as one more upgrade Im in the design faise of a new kind of incase oil filter. with full flow lubricaion.

But more important??

How big can you build a Type -1 with this setup How big a cylinder would you dare run for street?

Im temped to say 94s but maybe 92s should be my limit?

This may wind up a turbo motor In that case 74 by 92 would be the limit and Im thinking 6.5 to 1 compression with a waste gate set at 3 ft,lbs something around 120 hp minus the boast. with the boast i have no Idea. But that means a 5mm deck hight.

Right now this is only a idea. Im playing with So the clubs input is invited. But with the new R&P steering on the D, and now how wel it handles ..I feel its ready for the next step a bigger engine.

Barry...My understanding is that the 92mm cylinders fit into the case bores for the 90.5mm units....This would indicate a thinner cylinder wall, therefore a cylinder more prone to failure.....Some one tell me if I'm wrong, but I beleive the 94mm cylinders have thicker walls than the 92mm units.........Turbocharging is a great way to impressive torque, but if very radical, will tend to reduce overall reliability and life span of the engine. Most gasoline fueled turbo motors are not aimed at fuel economy, as you appear to be.....

Hope this helps....

Barry, we desperately need to find you a "spell checker" :)

In my opinion, you're thinking is off the well beaten path and in some instances can ultimately become very costly

VW air cooled Type 1 engines don't really need an external cooler when used as intended. They were limited to 1,584 cc's (1,600) and a maximum of 53 HP and could be driven hard all day without too many issues arising.

Porsche's original 4 cylinder engine for passenger car use didn't have an external oil cooler but, their race engines did have a cooler. Porsche realized that once an engine is stressed, maximum cooling was needed to make the engine live. Since no more air could be delivered to the cylinders, they opted to cool the oil.

When the 911 was built, Porsche realized that the extra 2 cylinders and more spirited driving caused higher engine temperatures thus, an external auxiliary cooler was added as an option. As their engines grew in size, Porsche eventually made the external oil cooler a standard item.

Regarding oil filters, It has always been my opinion that a full flow case with a large "screw on" canister filter such as a WIX 51515R was the absolute best option you could add to any VW air cooled engine. The WIX filter is far superior to a FRAM HP1 but, a FRAM HP1 is better than no filter. Another reason I recommend a large filter is because it holds almost 1 quart of oil. That's almost 2 quarts of extra oil when combined with an auxiliary cooler and accompanying AN oil lines


Your theory of having 5 mm of deck height will cause you more problems than you realize.

By increasing the deck height to 5mm or 1/5 of an inch, you create a combustion problem and increase the chances of a cracked cylinder. When combustion occurs, it will occur both in the head and in the .20 of an inch deck height. You'd be much better off having your heads relieved by having someone raise the valve seats and add some "dome" to your cylinder head. More than likely, you can't raise them enough to achieve a 6 to 1 compression ratio but you will be able to relieve them enough to run a lesser deck height.

What is a WIX 51515R and where do you buy them?

A spell checker a new lamp to type by and a new pair of glasses, and a new key board that as larger buttons.

But not in that order.

You guys a very helpful thank you

Things to look into for sure before the first part is ordered so I should concider 88s or the 90.5s OR a set if nickiees 94s Holey moley.

If i were to use a remote oil filter.. Is there a bango fitting kit for the main galley I have fixed a leak on the beetle there 3 time and guess what. Its back again a slow weeping leak at the thread boss where it screws ito the block.

Id much prefer to avoid that again or if their is a better fix just tell me
I do have ss braided hoses, the teflon core type. they are fine Im having problems at the case.

Hence my distain for anything remoted.

So from what your saying a different set of hig chamber heads will be needed and Id want the pistons dish cut also,

I was told a turbo with the waistgate set a 3 was very low mild boost??

A 2 part reply.

A WIX 51515R is a full size Oil Filter. If you're currently using a Fram HP-1 then switch to a WIX. WIX is by far the best commercial oil filter on the market. Available at NAPA. Some NAPA stores may have the part number as 1515R as WIX makes all of NAPA's filters. If they do have the NAPA brand 1515R, it's exactly the same as a WIX 51515R only different packaging

Three pounds of boost is pretty minimal but better than no boost at all

Go here and look at the photo with the blue background. THe bottom right fitting is the one everyone uses

http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=1013

If you install that fitting into a dry, clean threaded hole in your engine case using a little Loctite, it won't leak. Never run Banjo fittings to supply oil. Too restrictive.

i agree on the wix 51515R. couldnt find them locally so i got them on ebay. had to buy 12 but the price wasnt that bad really. they are sealed in wrapping inside the box.

It has one on it al ready Thats the rabbit desil filter (right)?I will most likely have to reclean it again But I may tr to have fitting machined with a sealing washer seat and sand the case surace flat so i can improve the seal even more.

That the 295 loctite of the 795 loctite?? That is the same fitting. I have something i found at work in mind ,but it will have to be monified a little.

This was dicussed a bit to day at work But if Jake wilnot sell his t-4 poller lifter and finding as et if ceramic is a waite of time I should be repairing the T-4 I have and just use it in the D
I going to check around some and see what I can see. i need to check in with my freinds ant the macine shop Biut i havent had time to grt down there sence last spring.

I don't believe that the WIX 51515R was ever intended for at Rabbit Diesel but it may be used by consumers???

The WIX 51515R probably has several applications one of which is severe racing duty. It can be cross referenced with FRAM HP1 and Morotcraft FL1A Racing filter.

The WIX is probably overkill but it's rated at a high bursting pressure and it has an enclosed rubber sealing gasket. Also, the internal filtering element is one of the best on the market. I wish they would pay me for advertising their product!!!!

It has a much thicker case and extremly over enginered filter If they are one and the same one don't see how one could ever fail

Wix makes the oil filters for NAPA. A NAPA 5151R is the same as a WIX 51515R

gn

I posted that information 6 above

Which locktite,, should i be using /

Use the "mild" version of Loctite. It will allow you to remove the fitting when necessary. Any of the loctite versions will seal up the thread spaces betweeen the case and the fitting and make it leak proof.

I agree with everything Larry said. I would get a threaded pipe to AN adapter, clean everything, and install it with liquid oil-resistant thread sealer. Then you never have to remove it, just take the AN connection off which is easy. Do the same on the oil pump cover.

I am in the process of changing all my fittings to AN-8 from Gates push-loc. One of the push-locs blew off on startup(in 2004), and I backed them all up with hose clamps, not the best look. Less than $300 for the whole thing from Jegs. I decided to use the nylon braided hose instead of the steel, it will lessen abrasion problems. I like the powdercoating to stay ON the frame! I am also changing the fuel lines to AN-6.

I always special order the filters at NAPA. When I use the last one I go order more, takes a couple days. The last time I bought some the filter number has been changed to 51515R, to coincide with the WIX number.

Im running the stainess steel teflon core hoses that are (Im told) the best. If i use a straight in fitting with a copper oil plug washer . can i re place the line fitting end witha short 90 bend end or is that not avalible?

I liked Danels idea but i think i will improve on it just a schose.

If I can?

Yes, AN ends are available in straight, 45, 90 and 180 degrees. Check out JEGS or Summit online. Jegs also has the Weber to AN-6 fittings by Earl's for fuel.

I forgot to say that the WIX is the ONLY filter I use.

Im running all the 40 hp rear apron tin n his engine i may have to trim it again but i think that would be a sure fire permanent fix.

Thanks Daniel .

Im running all the 40 hp rear apron tin on this engine i may have to trim it again but i think that would be a sure fire permanent fix.

Clearing the Aluminum pully is the only remaining concern

I haven't had much success with TIV coolers in TI fan housings..

The reason for this is the loss of pressure the larger cooler creates with the added surface area of the TIV cooler.

The added surface area of the larger cooler demands more volume from the charge cavity in the shroud.

I monified the shroud to increase the discharge and it has performed fine plus Oil pressure has remaind constant at all temps from 55 hot to 65 cold. Oil temp at its hottest has been 195 but this is still farely cool weather , The true test will come in late summer heat.
So I must have hit it pretty close,on this one bearing in mind its only a 1700. 74 X 85.5 StxB

The taller tires and automatic in the bug have realy help lower the rpm ranges and with the longer stroke it has manged to still have pretty good getty up. Milder in the lower rpm range but gets much stronger above 3,000.

all this and still getting 38 mpg . You don't have be a PRO engine builder to know this ones right.

So Jake back to the first question How big would you go ? and still have a little play room on the head temps. This does mean Nickiees... So if you had to pick a displacement what would it be ??

1835 1900 2053 ??????????????

The shroud has had the heater outlets removed and outer veins trimmed and redeverted to let the air go to the heads..The rear outlet to the oil cooler has been opened as far as I could get it and the vent slot around the fan increased in length aned weigth ..

AND

I do have a spare complete shroud made up for the next engine same mods using all the factory style tinware..

If you didn't know it you would not catch it..

It looks that stock

If you pull off the fan and alt you can see the new slot extends under the fan to include the dead area right on top of the engine case.

I waisted nothing

"I monified the shroud to increase the discharge"
At the cost of an elevation in #1 CHT. Been there, done that.

There are no free gains, every action will spur another equally opposite reaction.

The #1 CHT is critically impacted when the oil cooler cavity has a volume increase.

Thats why the DTM doesn't use an air charge from the #1 clinder to feed the oil cooler cavity.

Well DTM or not I am well pleased with how this one is doing.

Gentlemen ?

You don't have to buy a DTM for a slightly monified engine. but I pretty sure you can go bigger than 1700 cc's with this one.

I wouldn't make any statements until I saw what your mod did to the #1 CHT. Assumptions don't count.

Testwd it 3 days took readings from all 4 On the warmest day heres what i got.


1 ,325 degrees
2,, 318 degrees
3,,, 324 degrees
4,,,, 321 degrees .

I feel they are resonable. and on a cooler day they read less and even less than that on the day it was raining

How did you attain these temps? where were your sensors located?

ring senders at the plugs from westash

ring senders at the plugs from westash, And due to the longe stoke and lower rpm i had to have a smalle alt pully to get the fan speed right

i been driving it for 2 months now and it just keps getting stronger and stronger I will admit to a little carb tunnig to refine the chokes But it Nt bad at all for a near stock engine.

Gas milage is now just a schose over 40 Mpg. what doya think of that Jake