1915?

Forgot to ask, should I also go with a freeway flyer tranny? 

Talk with Al Merklin about some of the 1776 and 1915 cc engines he has used with single carbs on some of the cars he built.  Either of those might be just right for what you’re looking for, a reliable, peppy engine that is simple to work with and live with and will use your existing heater boxes and exhaust system to give you cockpit heat.  Nothing says you need a dual-carb setup.  I ran two different dune buggies with a small Holley/Autolite 2500 (same as used on Ford Pintos) and it was great.  I would recommend an external oil filter on either a 1776 or 1915, and an external cooler on the 1915, although for that size engine it might be optional as they don’t usually get THAT hot.

There are a few good engine builders out there, but you can’t go wrong with Pat Downs at CB Performance.  For the freeway flyer transaxle, I would recommend Rancho Performance Transaxles in Fullerton, CA.  I have one and they do a great job.  Going to a freeway flyer with a 3:88 final ratio and .89 (stock) fourth gear will bring your rpms down to 3250 at 70 mph at the cost of a slightly less peppy engine.  You might not notice that difference on a new engine/transmission combo you’ve never driven before, and that’s ok.  Come to think of it, I would be leery of a freeway flyer with a 1776 engine - the higher gearing might make it kinda sluggish in all gears, but I’ll defer to anyone else on here who is running that combo to comment.

Safety Jim posted:

I am considering upping the performance in my little red car.  One of the gurus of this site suggested a 1915cc.  Has anyone dealt with Blodgetts in CA? Good experience or bad?  Also, what would the down sides be to that big a displacement? Over heating?  Will I sacrifice performance or reliability if I keep the heat exchangers for the cool Buffalo spring and fall?  How about the carb?  Can I really run a single with electric choke? (Empi 34?)  I hate to start the "dreaded motor thread", but inquiring minds would like the expert opinions of you "masters of the madness!" 

I can address three items, Jim. I ran a 1915 cc motor from Sacramento down to La, up to Vegas, down to Route 66 straight across to Carlisle in early to mid May years and no overheating...no external oil cooler either. 

A single Weber 32/36 carb with electric choke ran very well on that engine. Set it and forget it. Easy starts hot or cold in any weather and it pulled smoothly through all ranges. 

My gear ratio was stock with the 4.125 R&P and I found it useable but a Freeway flyer would be nicer. The 3.88 Freeway Flyer  is only 94% of the former so I'd bet it would be pretty good for the $$ spent. A 1915 engine does not make a beefed up transmission mandatory in the first place though. 

A lot of this will depend on what you are satisfied with. More performance will simply cost more $$$. Where do you want to start and stop ? Tricky question, I know. 

To make the most of a single barrel stock type carburetor on that displacement it really needs a bigger venturi; on a Solex 34-3 it can be removed and enlarged, but I don't know if that's possible with the Empi version. What will happen with a stock carb is it will run great and seem really powerful until the carb can no longer feed the rising rpm's, at which point if will fall flat on it's face (3800? 4,000rpm?).

The term "freeway flier" means different things to different people; it's better to talk about specific gear ratios so you exactly what you're getting and don't end up with something that's not that drivable. Stick with stock 1st through 4th gearsack- 3.80 or 3.78 (early or late first), 2.06 2nd, 1.31 or 1.26 3rd, 0.89 4th. Using a 0.82 in 4th instead of the .89 widens the 3-4 spacing and drops the recovery rpm in 4th to the point that trying to motor up a long hill with the gas to the floor at that lower rpm (2300?) in 4th could actually cook the engine, as the fan is not turning fast enough to cool the engine at full throttle if the rpm's aren't advancing. When I first started driving Beetles 45 years ago everyone would warn me against "lugging" it.

For a 1915 in such a mild state of tune, either the 3.80 or 3.78 will work. The 3.80 is the earlier version and not as strong as the 3.78, but unless you're wailing on it like a raped ape ALL THE TIME I don't think you'll ever break it, so either will do. 2nd gear is the same through the years. I think VW went to the slightly longer 1.26 3rd (starting in 1967?) so there was less chance of lugging it in 4th, so if it's what's already in the car or you have the opportunity it's a good way to go, but if the trans you're rebuilding has the 1.31, again, no big deal. The .89 is the same whether it's early or late, so no concern there. 

If most of what you do is just rip around town with very little highway driving, then stick to the 4.125 ring & pinion. If getting out on the highway and going places is more important then the 3.88 r&p is what you want. If  both is really what you want, talk to Gene Berg Enterprises about their 5 speed conversion and be prepared to open the wallet (no, bigger. really, BIGGER!). The Berg 5 will run 4500-$5500 (or more if the need for a Quaife or ZF limited slip is there), and take about a year by the time you send in the parts to be modified, wait 6 months or more for there to be 9 other customers (they only do the pinion shaft and mainshaft lengthening in batches of 10 to keep costs down) and then wait for a competent trans guy to put it together. But oh, will it be fun!

Here's the difference between the 2 ring & pinions- 

 http://www.teammfactory.com/ca.../0/0/3600/3600/1/0/2

I'll say it again- don't let anyone talk you into the 0.82 for 4th- it's a big mistake! Oh- do you know what year the trans is (or the gearing) that's in the car now?

Hope this helps. Al

  I have used the Weber Progressive 2bbl  (shop for best kit price)  on both 1776 or 1915 with great success.  As mentioned set it and forget it and it has an electric choke too. A dual carb set up will give you a couple of additional HP that will almost go unnoticed.  ( I use the baby Weber knock off's complete kit for $260...up to 1915cc. ) If you go the progressive route you need to use a thin air cleaner to clear the deck lid..they also make an adapter to run a remote filter ( K&N style off to the side of the engine. IMHO a 3:88 R&P trans with 165 15 tires and your just fine.....everyone has their opinion :~)

All righty then! Thanks to you all yet again.  So, I have the original 1971 Stock Super Beetle Tranny in this baby and I believe it is oozing a little bit of fluid around it's main seal.  So, if I drop my stock 1600 motor, that seal will get replaced along with the 10+ year old fluid.  What is the final in that gear box?   I can now cruise at 85 or so, (GPS SPEED measured) with pretty high rpms on flat highway.  I am also leaking a slight amount of oil from the old 1600.  I can easily drop that motor and fix the leaks, but as always there are temptations! Would I really notice an improvement with a 1776? I am old, grumpy, I drink a lot of bourbon and beer, and I am surely not out to win drag races or dirt track ovals! 

How about the "new case" vs. the "rebuilt case."  I have a rebuilt in there now and it has made it about 15 years or so. I am not sure what it was bored out to.  

Let's hear your thoughts as there are a quite a few newbies weighing in lately that must be facing some of the same, TEMPTATIONS! 

Thanks again in advance.  

If your trans is stock it's a 4.12 R&P and all you'd need is a new Erco 3.875 R&P set. $350 for the part and at least that much again for the install. (Which is why doing an exchange for a Rancho Pro Street box at like $1200 probably makes sense).

Chico Performance in Arcadia Ca. does high quality engine building and ships world wide. He has been featured in Hot VW Magazine numerous times. His products are equal to Pat Downs products. I think they both are as good as it gets out here in So. Cal. and would not stray over to someone else. Plus they both will back up their work.

That's my two cents on that................Bruce

I had forgotten about Dave's old VS engine and BOY!  That was a very good mill for him.

Most likely (and you never know until you actually check it the hard way by turning the engine over 1 revolution in 4'th gear and seeing how much the rear wheel turns to get an idea of the gearing) I would think you have a stock set of gears and ring and pinion in there, with a 4'th of .89 and a final of 4:11.  That would give you 80mph around 4 grand IIRC.

If the transaxle input shaft is weeping, I would not only replace the seal, but replace the input shaft bearing, too.  Otherwise you're just band-aiding it.

You would notice a slight improvement in a 1776, transaxle being unchanged.  Go to a 3:88 transaxle and the gear 1 - 3 performance would be about the same as your 1600 (because the final gearing would be higher, making the engine work a little harder).  Going to a 1915 with a 3:88 would bring that performance back plus a little extra and make it a bit more fun to drive in the twisties.   IIRC, the cost difference between a 1776 and a 1915 is mice nuts.

Cases:  Al Gallo's engine builder, here in Massachusetts, went through 5 or 6 old cases before he found one he considered useable for a rebuild.  They don't have to be "bored out".  Cases distort over time along the journals where the cam and crankshaft bearings are and it is getting hard to find one straight enough to use in a build (let alone straight enough NOT to leak when assembled).  That's why so many new cases are being used.  Let's be honest - I don't know your engine from a Hot Cross Bun, but if it was rebuilt 15 years ago from an original VW engine, it may have seen better days but only your engine builder will know if it is good or not - He'll check the cam and crank bearing journals for alignment and then check the case for straightness where it mates in the middle and a few other key measurements.  If it doesn't make it they usually are leery about trying to make it "right" for re-use as that can cost more than a new case.

And when you start totaling up al the costs of a new drivetrain, that Bourbon might come in handy.......

On the  east coast I highly recommend Bug Stuff in West  Brownsville PA . I've bought new and good used parts as well as quality and reasonably priced rebuilt engines ( 1641, 1776, 1835 and 1915cc) I believe at least a dozen plus from Jack for over 25 years. 

There you go.  Save a bit of transportation costs from the builder.

Al, do you have a transaxle guy East of the Mis-a-pippy??

Safety Jim posted:

A Would I really notice an improvement with a 1776?

My experience with torque, to quote Elizabeth Imbrie in The Philadelphia Story when asked if she would like more champagne, "I've never had enough."

Gordon Nichols posted:

There you go.  Save a bit of transportation costs from the builder.

Al, do you have a transaxle guy East of the Mis-a-pippy??

Sorry, Gordon, that's a little out of my locale...

Not you, Al.  The other Al....    

The one, from "West By-God Virginnie" !  

The "Dr. Clock" one!

Besides, you're way west of the Mis-a-Pippy........   Heck, you're probably west of the Fraser/Pitt, too!

I would inspect and reseal the used trans that would come with most project speedsters or when needed, buy a reman w/ a 3:88 R & P also from BugStuff

~ Alan …. I left the "AL" name in New jersey when I moved in .99 :~)

Gordon Nichols posted:

Not you, Al.  The other Al....    

The one, from "West By-God Virginnie" !  

The "Dr. Clock" one!

Besides, you're way west of the Mis-a-Pippy........   Heck, you're probably west of the Fraser/Pitt, too!

I was wondering...and yeah, way west of the Mississississi...(you know where I mean!) doesn't begin to describe it! And you know Fraser and Pitt? Very good! Pitt's all of 1/2 hour east, but Fraser's just down the hill...

Jim, as Gordon stated, used cases are not always what you want if you're going for a new build.  I used a new mag. case out of California that was cast in Brazil, probably a long time ago, but it was fine.

When I was trying to find out what engine would be the best for me where I drive I called and talked to Chico and Pat Downs.  I wanted something that would run cool and strong on the roads where I live.  I thought something like a 1776 would fit the bill.  Pat said that for just a bit more work I could get a 1904 cc that would do what I needed. He was right , of course.  Pat and Chico have a great reputation but I was uncomfortable about being 3,000 miles away from my builder, so I found a local guy with a great reputation only 100 miles away and he is a CB Performance dealer as well. 

So , long story short , I ended up with a 1904 with baby Webers, remote oil filter , no oil cooler and it runs strong and cool. Pretty much what Pat was going to build and I could not be happier.

The transmission was oozing from everywhere and I found a few chunks of metal on the magnet so that was next. I called Rancho and ordered a pro-street transmission with super diff and all the other stuff they do.  When I asked about the freeway flier R&P the guy asked how much highway driving I do.  Basically none,  unless you call 50 mph highway driving. The Mid-Cape Highway starts out at 55mph and by the time it gets to my end of the "sand bar" its 40mph, and the back roads are lower.   So torque is more important to me than top speed. " It's more fun to drive a slow car fast than it is to drive a fast car slow. "

Wish you luck with whatever you do.

Wow!  Great info again and always.  Thanks to you guys who have time and talent to live in our world of madness.   I am digesting and considering the wallet, quality and availability along with the serviceability and longevity of this decision!  It is amazing that as a first time engine builder, I modified a 12 year old 1600 into a pretty good running 1850 when I first built the speedster.  Years after, one of the old rod bearings went and so did that motor on a short trip to the grocery store.  The replacement, a rebuilt Fisher Buggy 1600 has served it well since then, but now I am in a position to upgrade and your help is amazing. Thanks to all as I contemplate the choices over an, "old man winter" draft from Southern Tier Brewing! The bourbon comes later! hahaha 

Since you've done it before maybe your best move is a CB "Builder's Choice" kit engine. I was going to do that for the Spyder before a Carey Hines offered a nice, very lightly-used 120-horse 1914 for sale here and I grabbed it. 

Come to think of it, maybe that could work for you too. Since some of these guys can't wait for their old mill to break before getting a new one (usually a Soob these days), a fair number of really nice, low-mileage, green-oiled Type 1s get posted for sale here. 

edsnova posted Since some of these guys can't wait for their old mill to break before getting a new one (usually a Soob these days), a fair number of really nice, low-mileage, green-oiled Type 1s get posted for sale here. 

 

U talking about me, young Man ?   

Thanks guys.  I like the idea of the kit engine.  I got the 1850 stuff from CIP 1 back in the day, (I think I remember that right...)  I ordered it over the phone of course from an ad in Hot VW's... The twin pipe exhaust lasted less than a year! The heat exchangers turned to dust the first year and the gasket set was pure garbage. The motor itself lasted about 10 -11 year. (Again, I think I remember that.)  And, I picked the Fisher Buggy motor up in person during a winter trip to FL.  That motor has lasted very well! 

I am guessing with the CB performance reputation, the components are top quality?  Has anyone else in the group built one of these from the case out? 

Next questions:  Should I pay the extra $160 to have them balance the components? Also, will the Weber 2bbl, 32-36 or, the 34 work well with the 1776CC motor? 

Thoughts? 

Several of us have CB Performance built motor and the quality is very top shelf. @aircooled Bruce used a Builder's Choice kit and built a very nice motor. And yes, I would pay the extra money to balance the components. I don't know enough about carburetors to expertly answer the last question but I believe it should. I had twin Dellortos 36 DRLA's in my 1915 cc motor and it ran very well.

Safety Jim posted:

 Also, will the Weber 2bbl, 32-36 or, the 34 work well with the 1776CC motor? 

Thoughts? 

 

I know it will work well. I ran one on my 1915 VW Speedster and 1800 Subaru in an airplane years ago. It will also run quite well on a 2.2 and 2.5 l Soob too. Allstate Carburetor 143 Brightside Av. Central Islip, ny 11722. Ask for Jim. Google it and you'll see the 32/36 comes in several configurations...throttle on left or right, choke on front or back etc. You'd want the one with the throttle on the left side and the choke right in front of your face when you're looking into the engine bay. About $215 new.

Safety Jim posted:

Next questions:  Should I pay the extra $160 to have them balance the components? Also, will the Weber 2bbl, 32-36 or, the 34 work well with the 1776CC motor? 

Thoughts? 

 

Unless someone knows different I say yes, get the stuff balaned! More later....

Yoda out (for now but back you know I will be!)

 You might want to call Pat at CB and discuss your options with him

 Then again you could always drop a Subie in 

Hey!!!!!   MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU ALL!!!!

Thank you gentlemen! 

Ray, I know you love the Subaru! I just don't  have the cash as retirement looms closer and debt must be clear for me to hit the 7 day weekend stage of my life.  The VW is still my favorite for simple economical workable motors.  I am looking forward to the motor build and will certainly be asking for more advice! 

David, Thanks for the lead on the carb.

Alb, thanks for motor building advice! 

@Safety Jim    Wrote:  debt must be clear for me to hit the 7 day weekend stage of my life.        

This too was my successful plan prior to my " every day is Saturday" retirement..... I sleep well at night ~

Actually Jim I am simply pointing out you should run the numbers for both before you make your jump.  

Everybodies budget is different and choices as well 

You seem to have a lot of engine skills so acooled works well for you

glad to hear your getting closer to retirement

Safety Jim posted:

Next questions:  Should I pay the extra $160 to have them balance the components? Also, will the Weber 2bbl, 32-36 or, the 34 work well with the 1776CC motor? 

Thoughts? 

 

Yes. Always get the internals balanced. I haven't done it but would definitely buy a builder's kit from CB. That way I would know exactly how it was put together. And CB does have quality components. The kit's parts are all designed to work together. I'd go for a 2109. It's a 76 stroke crank and 94mm barrels. The 76 crank slips in with no clearancing required and gives you 200cc for not a big dollar difference between the 1915. Power and torque are nice to have, but a light foot on the throttle will return nearly the same mileage.

Others love them, but a center-mount 2 bbl. is not the ticket IMHO. You'd be better off with dual single barrels. I installed a set of Solex 35s with electric choke on a 1835cc customer sandrail, and he couldn't be happier. Two pumps, turn the key, and let it warm up. Blip the throttle, and it settles into a nice idle. Driveability and torque are way better than the old center-mount 2 bbl. Good linkage and it's a set-it-and-forget-it deal. I got jets from John at aircooled.net, and they were spot-on.

If you go Solex cabs, buy a new mechanical fuel pump and a stack of gaskets. It took seven or eight gaskets under the pump to get the pressure DOWN to 1.5 psi where Solexes like to be. No more than 1.5 psi.

Every time I talk to the sandrail owner, he raves about how he owes me and is so very happy. I did other work to it, rewired the dash, and lights. Basically re-terminated and re-wrapped the entire harness. Removed some household wiring and replaced it with automotive grade. Then I installed some gauges in the little aluminum binnacle, and fixed the shifter too. 

If you don't go Solex(which I really like with electric choke in the East) the baby twin single-throat 34 Webers or Dells are good as well. I believe Solexes are also know as Kadron but may be incorrect.

2110cc is a sweet sized engine compared to a 1800-1900 IMHO.  

If the budget can handle the larger size I would pick that engine for power and reliability and long term sustainability.  

I installed a rotary gas pump on mine and I had 44Webers.  Good power, good low end torque and you can drive at 70mph pretty much all day.  

Someday you can put in a 3:44 tranny on your rebuild and be away with a long term enjoyable engine without the constant want of more power or concern that it will blow up " 

I ordered the CB engine kit and will call Allstate Carb and order the Weber conversion kit on Monday! Merry Christmas to me!  HO HO HO!   I'll analyze the tranny once I drop the motor...  Hopefully this week as work is slow between Christmas and New Year's.

More to come....    

Merry Christmas to Jim.

Jim:  Once you get the engine out, replacing the seal for the tranny input shaft is a snap.  Get a seal removal tool from NAPA and the old one'll be out in 30 seconds:

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7769235

Once the seal is out (assuming it is the tranny seal leaking - it might be the Mainshaft seal on the engine behind the flywheel so the same tool might come in handy again!) You can grab the tranny input shaft to see how much side play it has.  Usually, there is a very small amount of play unless the bearing is very new - you decide.  Installing the new seal is pretty straightforward - even Danny can do it!    

Mainshaft seals on T-1 engines tend to be weepy little buggers, so that may be the source of your leak, too.  That should go away with the new engine   

David:  New engine kit and engine bay make over will be a surprise at Carlisle! Let the suspense build!  

Gordon: Thanks for the advice.  I actually have the seal tool in my shop. I also have the rings for a small press that work well to seat the new seals for the tranny and the motor.   I am actually looking forward to this project! The CB Perf guys seem very confident that i will like the hardware, gasket and seal quality that come with the kit.  I have not felt great about some of the stuff that has come in from various countries lately.  So, I am hoping that the extras with the kit are at least as good as the OEM stuff.  We'll see in a few weeks! 

Do you guys change the tranny/clutch  release bearing while you have the engine out of the car.  I would change it while I am there.

 I mean the squeak can drive you crazy if it starts.  

I started this earlier and just finished it now, so if you've already made decisions, oh well...

You guys are bringing up some good points here. Jim, if you can be pulled away from the single carburetor, a set of small single barrels are not any harder to tune/take care of, will deliver better fuel/air mixture and give more power throughout the rpm range of whatever engine you build. A small plus- this will also translate into better mileage (when you're not taking advantage of said newly found power of course!). While this isn't necessarily a huge cost consideration, with the small tank that's in these cars it's always nice to go just that little bit further before having to fill up again!

I don't believe the Solex 35's Danny speaks of are the Brazilian Kadron carburetor kit- they come with 40 mm throttle plates. Any of the dual single barrel carb kits will work here, whether it's the Kadrons, Solex 34 or 35 PDSIT's, or Weber 34 ICT's. The thing will be to decide engine displacement and tune before buying a carb kit, as while these will all do well on a 1776 and probably 1835, but a 1915 (depending on heads) and anything 2 liters or over may need more flow/volume than either the PDSIT's or ICT's can provide. 

Going bigger is always a good idea, if you can manage the budget. Anything 2 liters or over is a lot of fun in these cars, as it's really easy to hit 120 hp (Engle W100, 110 or similar cam and 1.25 rockers, with some ported stock valve heads and 1 1/2" exhaust, all in by 5500-6,000 rpm) with even a mild combo. That's 10 hp more than a '58 GT Carrera engine (at 1,000-11500 lower rpm's), and a way better torque curve! This is too much engine for PDSIT's or ICT's, but Kadrons will work well here, although I don't know if they'll need to be upgraded to 30mm venturis (stock is 28?).

A stroker engine, built with care and how I described above would be as reliable as a stocker (and be waaaayyyyy more fun!)

The only question is how much do you want to spend?

Yoda out (for now, but back you know I will be!)

Ray: You are right on and between the posts and in the net, shooting and scoring with the new throw-out (or oot) as you guys say. LOL... Hockey talk for the rest of you!  Yes, absofinglutely! 

And Alb,/ Yoda: Thanks.  My reasons for calling Allstate carb Monday, is to get their opinion on my motor for the right carb/carbs/orifice combo. So, thanks again David Stroud for the lead. I have a set of dual Kadrons from the early 80’s that were on my 1850 back then. No electric chokes, but, believe it or not, I fabbed up mechanical chokes with a pull cable from the cockpit and it made things much better at start up when cold. And, you may assume it is cold here often! So, I am out to make this car as easy and driveable in 3 seasons as possible without the hassles of long warm ups and rough running when it is chilly in my hood!  Therefore, the kiss standard is coming into my equation.... “keep it simple, stupe!”

Dual Kadrons from the early 80’s, they are decent carbs for a mid range 1915cc engine. I would try them with fresh rebuild kits, just be sure to check the throttle shaft bushings.