TC, check out Tony's folder (username LVWOODGOD); you'll see lots of good pictures of the conversion there.
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TC, check out Tony's folder (username LVWOODGOD); you'll see lots of good pictures of the conversion there.
First off, I have to bring myself to realizing you are really thinking of doing this with a real 356SC. O'well it's your car!
The fronts are a bolt on, with bearing changes to the appropriate axles (ball joint and or link pin styles). Don't know that part #'s anymore.
The rears can only be swapped from 1952ish to 67ish Porsche 356 swing axle to VW short swing axle, ending 1967. 1968 beetle swing axle and later IRS axles have a longer axle spline section. This doesn't mean as an example, that you can't put 356 drums on a 1972 IRS VW rear end, it simply means you have to do a little more home work.
I wrote this joyously read..., a few years ago, just never posted it anywhere.
________________________________
- Putting Porsche 356A Aluminum Drums on an VW type1 IRS axle -
First off, this is just an idea and hasn't been built yet, this is all in my mind, and very little if any is on paper. My intent
is to put a set of 356A drums onto the back of a VW IRS axle. In doing so, the following is a list of the problems that I
can think of as follows.
Drum nose length to short for the IRS axle -- Since I was unable to source / locate anybody that is manufacturing a
VW IRS axle roughly 1" shorter than stock. A 1" thick X 3" Dia. spacer will be needed. The 3" Dia. is just a number,
it well match the width of the nose / bolting surface of the 356A drum which is bigger than the nut, and then will step
down to the nut. What I came up with for this, was to take a VW type1, 4 lug drum and cut it down to my 1" thick
spacer that will have the axle splines already in the middle of it. This will look far more aesthetically pleasing than a
stack of washers on the axle against the drum. This center section serves a couple of purposes, it gives a little extra
Axle-to-Drum-to-SpacerWithSplines-to-Axle-to-Nut grip. This is a concern of mine. I say this only because I've seen
356A drums, cleaned of all of the splines that have been used, on semi high hp VW swing axles before. I also choose
the location of the spacer to be on the outboard side of the drum against the axle nut surface because the spline length
of the drum is very short and prone to loosening of the nut. Putting an additional spacer on the axle at the CV flange
end, before going into the bearing housing, might look better from the outside, but again, my feelings are that with the
outboard spacer matching the bigger outside dia. of the drum-to-nut surface, this I felt would keep the hole unit more
securely in place, and be less prone to loosening.
Last -- The fact that I'll piss a few Porsche purist off, that just don't want me to do this with these brakes, like anything
else, that's a to be expected. So my question to you the reader is. What else can you think of, that I haven't in tackling
this problem..., If you've done this conversion, I'd love to hear from you.
________________________
Heres a link to a better pic.
http://community.webshots.com/photo/526070220/541629385JJymSb
David
The fronts are a bolt on, with bearing changes to the appropriate axles (ball joint and or link pin styles). Don't know that part #'s anymore.
The rears can only be swapped from 1952ish to 67ish Porsche 356 swing axle to VW short swing axle, ending 1967. 1968 beetle swing axle and later IRS axles have a longer axle spline section. This doesn't mean as an example, that you can't put 356 drums on a 1972 IRS VW rear end, it simply means you have to do a little more home work.
I wrote this joyously read..., a few years ago, just never posted it anywhere.
________________________________
- Putting Porsche 356A Aluminum Drums on an VW type1 IRS axle -
First off, this is just an idea and hasn't been built yet, this is all in my mind, and very little if any is on paper. My intent
is to put a set of 356A drums onto the back of a VW IRS axle. In doing so, the following is a list of the problems that I
can think of as follows.
Drum nose length to short for the IRS axle -- Since I was unable to source / locate anybody that is manufacturing a
VW IRS axle roughly 1" shorter than stock. A 1" thick X 3" Dia. spacer will be needed. The 3" Dia. is just a number,
it well match the width of the nose / bolting surface of the 356A drum which is bigger than the nut, and then will step
down to the nut. What I came up with for this, was to take a VW type1, 4 lug drum and cut it down to my 1" thick
spacer that will have the axle splines already in the middle of it. This will look far more aesthetically pleasing than a
stack of washers on the axle against the drum. This center section serves a couple of purposes, it gives a little extra
Axle-to-Drum-to-SpacerWithSplines-to-Axle-to-Nut grip. This is a concern of mine. I say this only because I've seen
356A drums, cleaned of all of the splines that have been used, on semi high hp VW swing axles before. I also choose
the location of the spacer to be on the outboard side of the drum against the axle nut surface because the spline length
of the drum is very short and prone to loosening of the nut. Putting an additional spacer on the axle at the CV flange
end, before going into the bearing housing, might look better from the outside, but again, my feelings are that with the
outboard spacer matching the bigger outside dia. of the drum-to-nut surface, this I felt would keep the hole unit more
securely in place, and be less prone to loosening.
Last -- The fact that I'll piss a few Porsche purist off, that just don't want me to do this with these brakes, like anything
else, that's a to be expected. So my question to you the reader is. What else can you think of, that I haven't in tackling
this problem..., If you've done this conversion, I'd love to hear from you.
________________________
Heres a link to a better pic.
http://community.webshots.com/photo/526070220/541629385JJymSb
David
Attachments
Images (1)
"The fronts are a bolt on . . . "
Really?!?! I can simply unbolt the 356 discs and calipers from the front of the car and replace everything with Ghia discs and calipers and it's a done deal? With MAYBE a change in bearing races to fit the spindle to rotor relationship difference?
Terrific ! ! !
I've already sourced out the VW parts necessary to make the conversion from the original Porsche trans and discs to VW trans and drums in the rear, so . . .
Thanks!
TC
Oooopppsss ! ! My mistake. I just checked the pics. It's a 356B drum conversion, not a 356 SC disc conversion as I was expecting
Really?!?! I can simply unbolt the 356 discs and calipers from the front of the car and replace everything with Ghia discs and calipers and it's a done deal? With MAYBE a change in bearing races to fit the spindle to rotor relationship difference?
Terrific ! ! !
I've already sourced out the VW parts necessary to make the conversion from the original Porsche trans and discs to VW trans and drums in the rear, so . . .
Thanks!
TC
Oooopppsss ! ! My mistake. I just checked the pics. It's a 356B drum conversion, not a 356 SC disc conversion as I was expecting
I just heard that Tony Garc
If you need any more pics or details, let me know and I will be glad to help. I might have extra parts too for trade or sale. The fronts can be an easy bolt on using the backing plates or the whole spindle assembly. Using the whole spindle assembly is better since it will provide you the actual steering geometry based on the "Ackerman steering geometry" (do a Google search on this subject). The Porsche and VW spindles are "exactly" alike and even share part numbers. The only difference is the steering arm have been moved a little bit. If you use the Porsche spindles, you'll have to change the steering rod lengths.
The rears are basically a bolt on and even the brake cable can be used! Look at my folder and you have to realize one thing that i had to learn that the 356A and 356B backing plates are not interchangeable due to an extra lip on the B plates.
The rears are basically a bolt on and even the brake cable can be used! Look at my folder and you have to realize one thing that i had to learn that the 356A and 356B backing plates are not interchangeable due to an extra lip on the B plates.
Attachments
Images (3)
Tony,
Would you know if the 356C discs are as interchangeable as the 356B drums are? As I mentioned, I'm hoping to get rid of my front 356 SC discs and substitute VW Ghia discs or VW Beetle drums instead on an old rusty 356SC. I have mountains of VW brakes parts of every description to work with.
Would you know if Ghia rotors will fit 356C spindles? Or Beetle drums (four or five lug) fit? Or Ghia spindles fit the 356C arms/ball joints? Or VW drum brake spindles fir? Or would the VW arms fit the 356C torsion bars in the beam? Or can the VW torsion leaves/bars be substituted for the ones in the 356C front beam? Or anything of the like that, any combination at all that would enable me to run VW brake components in a 356C (not B)?
Short of knowing the answers, do you know if 345B drums can be upgraded to 356C discs? If the discs fit on the drum front end, and the drums fit on the VW front end then . . . maybe everything can be done in reverse with a few extra steps and make everything work?
I donno, I'm just trying to get a rusty 356SC up and running using what I have on hand and not go into debt trying to hold onto originality for someone elses sake.
As a last resort I figure that I can just torch the Porsche beam out of the bulkhead and weld in the Beetle beam with a couple of outboard strengtheners like those used on the Thing or Type III. Or even cut the ends from the Porsche beam and weld on those from a Beetle to enable me to use the beetle drop arms and seals. I'm just hoping to try a bolt on possibility if one exists first.
Any help at all? Thanks ! ! !
TC
{RADIO EDIT} I can see that this thread is confusing because I'm kind of all over the place with my questions. EVERYTHING that I'm asking iis in reference to fitting VW brake components (of any year or model) onto a '65 356SC. NOT a 356B. (Although if C fits B and B fits VW, then I'm interested in the infor, but only as it pertains to the C.)
There . . . Now we're REALLY confused. All that cleared up NOTHING.
Would you know if the 356C discs are as interchangeable as the 356B drums are? As I mentioned, I'm hoping to get rid of my front 356 SC discs and substitute VW Ghia discs or VW Beetle drums instead on an old rusty 356SC. I have mountains of VW brakes parts of every description to work with.
Would you know if Ghia rotors will fit 356C spindles? Or Beetle drums (four or five lug) fit? Or Ghia spindles fit the 356C arms/ball joints? Or VW drum brake spindles fir? Or would the VW arms fit the 356C torsion bars in the beam? Or can the VW torsion leaves/bars be substituted for the ones in the 356C front beam? Or anything of the like that, any combination at all that would enable me to run VW brake components in a 356C (not B)?
Short of knowing the answers, do you know if 345B drums can be upgraded to 356C discs? If the discs fit on the drum front end, and the drums fit on the VW front end then . . . maybe everything can be done in reverse with a few extra steps and make everything work?
I donno, I'm just trying to get a rusty 356SC up and running using what I have on hand and not go into debt trying to hold onto originality for someone elses sake.
As a last resort I figure that I can just torch the Porsche beam out of the bulkhead and weld in the Beetle beam with a couple of outboard strengtheners like those used on the Thing or Type III. Or even cut the ends from the Porsche beam and weld on those from a Beetle to enable me to use the beetle drop arms and seals. I'm just hoping to try a bolt on possibility if one exists first.
Any help at all? Thanks ! ! !
TC
{RADIO EDIT} I can see that this thread is confusing because I'm kind of all over the place with my questions. EVERYTHING that I'm asking iis in reference to fitting VW brake components (of any year or model) onto a '65 356SC. NOT a 356B. (Although if C fits B and B fits VW, then I'm interested in the infor, but only as it pertains to the C.)
There . . . Now we're REALLY confused. All that cleared up NOTHING.
I know of a couple of 356A speedster owners that converted their cars over to the 356C disc brakes and wheels. The swap was relatively easy but I do not have the specific details reagrding the swap. If you the 356A and B brakes fit a VW, then the VW Ghia/Beetle assemblies should also swap back with minor work.