Authentic looking Engines

I just uploaded a file of my engine and thought there might be some interest in authentic looking early 356 engines. Note that I could probably spend a lot more money and make it look even closer to the original . . . but I am happy with the way it is. And . . .yes, I know it shouldn't have an alternator . . .the decals are not exactly right . . .and Porsche would have never put their name on the fan shroud -- but they should have!

I welcome all comments and suggestions.

Regards,
Alan

Oh yes . . .the link: https://www.speedsterowners.com/files/view.asp?sf=VonTrips&f=IMG_0003.JPG

Generally the "tell" is the oil filter on the fan housing. I think Dusty Johnson has one on his (for looks) as well as a couple others. Other than that the VW and Porsche engines were difficult to tell apart, as said, generally.

Well, at the expense of bursting your bubble, aside from the it having the wrong fan shroud, the alternator as you said, no oil filter, the wrong carburetors, the wrong air cleaners, wrong distributor cap, wrong linkage, wrong engine case, wrong alternator/generator stand, it looks exactly like a 356 engine only totally and 100% different.

Looks more like a typical VW engine with Porsche script on the fan shroud.

You asked for comments so don't get angry

I here ya Larry,, set um straight! I am by no means a athority. on this stuff but I have been to a real porsche rally,,(ONCE) That photo Made it all come rushing back

I have been known to be a little heavey footed. But Im not like that crowd,, No THANK YOU ..

I am glad I had my camera, a Vid recorder and a list of questions I had compiled in a notebook before i went. All In all I made a good reseach project out of it back in 2000. to collect info as I had started my build of the Speedster D that spring. I was not critial on the engine But more so on the Interior .the trim ,bumpers and ride hieght.. But I did get to see and document a few of the cars. back then.
It was a real education. in more ways than one..

But one thing is for sure,,This puppy is staying on the porch... I did have a good time, but some of it was scary.

Alan,

Here is what you need to shoot for if you want your motor to look original. This was my wife's 65 SC matching numbers fully documented car. I gave it to her for our 25th Wedding Anniversary. She sold it to buy her 86 Carrera which she sold to buy her Honda Civic Hybrid.

Talk about going backwards but we are coming up on our 32nd Anniversary........;-)

Here's one did for AL Shapiro's Street Beasts...it has the look but no way replication . ~Alan

Alan, I think the Porsche decal on the shroud is a little high on the left.
I kind of agree with Larry, also. Honestly, it's a $50.00 shine on a $5.00 shoe -- these cars are what they are, and if you're willing to shell out the very large wads of cash it takes to make a true reproduction/clone/replica that fools folks, it will take more than a few stickers. For example, I don't know where the gold script on your car's body came from. I've never seen one like that on a Speedster before; I've always seen them like the one on your engine, which is slightly different.
My two cents is to just enjoy what you have, and maybe over time improve it cosmetically with ideas and experiences that allow you to grow with the car. Seeing what other folks have done at shows and events is a great way to get started, and this is sooooo the right time of year.

I would never, ever attempt to diminish what Dusty and others have done, either. His car -- talking about Dusty's -- is absolutely brilliant. By way of comparison to my own, I have a dump truck.

A 86 Carrera to a Honda Civic Hybrid....Wow!
Mind you, back in 1975 I had a pristine 1967 MGB that I sold to buy a 1972 VW Type 3 station wagaon.

Alan,
Here is the radio

Alan,
Nice try but you need to do a few more things. I am attaching some pics for you. I also have fixed my radio to look original and have even put a Porsche VIN plate and Paint Plate in the door jamb. I am not trying to mislead anyone but I am a professional magician and I enjoy making my car an "illusion". It is great fun to show it and then tell that it is a reproduction (i.e.: "move the decimal point two places to the left!"). You should pick up a couple of books telling how to restore a 356 and use that as a guideline. (I cheat. I have a real 356 Coupe that wins shows in Colorado) Most importantly just have fun.

Happy Trails,
Dusty

That radio trick is slick, Dusty.

alakazam. very cool.

Here's a REAL motor!

Alan, yours is about as close to authentic as these....

Now THAT would be a REAL motor in a Speedster!!!

Well, I have to agree that Alan's engine does not look like an authentic 356 at all.

However, Alan, you have done a very nice job on that engine and engine compartment. Looks very sanitary. Nice job. Wish mine looked that good.

Alan, looks good, but I've never seen a "Porsche" name plate on the shroud before, but if you like it that's why we own them... Good for you..

Ernie,
That engine ROCKS!!!!

Regarding the "Porsche" tags, I believe it it goes as follows:


* Chrome "PORSCHE", 5 studs, 215mm (8 1/2") lenght. Fits 356, some early 356A.

* Gold "PORSCHE", 5 studs, 215mm (8 1/2") length. Fits Speedster and 356A.

* Gold "PORSCHE", 5 studs, 215mm (8 1/2") length. Fits 356 BT5.

* Gold "PORSCHE", 5 studs, 254mm (10") length. Fits 356BT5.

* Gold "PORSCHE", 2 studs, 200mm (8") length. Fits 356BT6, 356C.


So, basically, first all was chrome, then gold-plated, then enlarged, and then, in the final years of the 356, became the version you have (incorrectly) in the back of your speedster (the lettering you have on the engine shroud would also be period-incorrect for the speedster, as I believe it's a BT5 part).


While I share your idea that Porsche should have included the name in the engine shroud, it would have to be something much smaller than that... :)

I have seen Dusty's engine in person and it is breath taking and deserving of that "Best Engine" trophy.

Dusty's engine was prepared as the pictures show to resemble a "real" Porsche 356 Speedster engine---and it certainly does.

Chrome loaded, garish colored engines and radical "hot rod" engines in Speedsters may be interesting and exciting biut they are far from being a replica of a Speedster engine instead of a replica of a Porsche Speedster. The original post talked about "authentic looking 356 engines".

Different strokes, etc.

Somehow, I think that the word "Replica" is pretty key, here.

For ANYONE familiar with VW and Porsche aircooled engines (and I count myself among them) we can spot the difference between a real Porsche engine and a "replica" from over 50 feet away. Yeah, it's that easy, even with a "real" Porsche oil filter hung back there. So then the question becomes; "What's the point?" If you have a VW engine back there, display it for what it is. Nothning wrong with that.

You may get the replica's body lines more or less right (they're close, but not perfectly duplicated) and you may add accents that may or may not have been on the originals and even use some "original" Porsche parts or colors or stickers - all they do is make it look more like YOUR car, not necessarily an "original" Speedster.

Go to a few PCA meets where real 356's show up. You'll be amazed at how many differences you'll find between them and a replica, and it's always the little details that count.

So Alan.......You've done some interesting "upgrades" to your VW engine. It looks nice, really! If you're happy with it, that's all that counts, 'cuz YOU'RE the one who sees it every day, right?

Besides, YOUR engine is about as close to an original 356 (not counting the 4-cam, here) as anybody else on here, including the type-4 guys: Neither a T-1 nor a T-4 is the same as a 356 engine, once you really look at them, so enjoy your engine upgrades and go drive your car - THAT's what you should be doing with it, anyway.

Gordon
The Nomadic Speedstah guy from Beaufort

How about an authentic looking battery? I just received my 356 Registry magazine and there is an ad for "Optima Cloaking device" A 6 volt looking case to hold an Optima battery.
I'll bet Dusty has one!

Did you see the Flat4 mesh air cleaner kits?

http://www.flat4.co.jp/english/dtail-eg.html#CA-026D

They should be shipping in 45 days or so.

I am thinking of how to reproduce the oil filter housing and use it as a breather box. A coffee can or maybe some kind of fancy food container could be the start?
Here is an espresso can!

Bill,
I DO have one of the 6 volt covers for my 6 volt Optima battery. I use in in my 1962 Coupe. It is allowed for Concour competition at the Porsche shows.

No, I don't have one in my Speedster :-)

Happy Trails,
Dusty

If I had a choice between buying a replica that was 'Porscheized' (is that a word) or John Leaders' car, I'd choose John's car every time. To me, anyone who tries to pass of a fake as an original is a phony.
Ron

Let's talk about badges.....

Mickey?

;)

Hey -- thanks everyone for the replies and suggestions. Yes . . I understand that this is a Mexican / Brazilian VW engine. And, yes, I realize that I could change a LOT of things about it and spend a lot of money on authentic old parts to hang on it for looks. I could pull the engine and maybe spend a few thousand dollars on real shrouding, match the paint exactly, etc. I might even spend the same amount as it would cost to buy a real authentic rebuilt 356 engine! I doubt I'll do that.

As an aside, I make it a point to look at the REAL speedsters that drive through my town of Durango, CO every summer on the "Colorado Grand" Rally. I ask each of the owners to open their engine lids to see what a REAL 356 engine should look like. The "Grand" organizers take pride in only letting authentic historic vehicles enter the event.

When I look at the engine bays in MOST of these cars I see new Chinese alternators, after-market EMPI branded carbs, incorrect paint jobs, etc. I suspect that some of these REAL speedsters are running around out in the world with 1600 VW engines as well. Anyway,compared to my woefully in-accurate VW engine, these REAL 356 engines look absolutely awful. And these are in cars that cost their owner's maybe $150K!!! So . . .I think it is a matter of perception and just how incredibly anal one wants to be about it. Maybe it is the difference between an enthusiast and a snob/geek? I've heard it said that Porsche snobs hate our replica cars, but Porsche ENTHUSIASTS love them.

Finally, I wanted to thank Larry Jowdy in particular for his comments and suggestions. That really added a lot of value to the thread and it is much appreciated. Thanks again.

Alan

But WAIT . . . .I just noticed that Dusty's engine is in a car that has Carrera script on it!!!! Horrors . . . that engine suddenly looks AWFUL. It looks NOTHING like a Carrera engine at all!

See how silly this could get? Trust me, I'm not angry -- I just think that the flamer e-mails I got are a bit humorous given that I initially posted several disclaimers that I wasn't trying to re-create an exact engine replica, but simply try to get a bit more flavor of the real thing. This, versus having something like a full chrome shroud, etc. etc. in an otherwise nice replica.

Oh, and before someone reacts to the first paragraph inappropriately . . . I think Dusty's engine (and car) are spectacular. Nice job!

Regards,
Alan

Oh oh. In the words of the attached...

"When you find a big kettle of crazy, its best not to stir it."

(just been waiting to use that....)

Alan,
Now I believe you are a real enthusiast !!! MOST do not catch the "Carrera" vs. Normal (or Super) engine. Good catch! You would be surprised how many "real" Porsche fans do not know the difference. (like Elephants and Giraffes). Keep up the good work and keep those eyes sharp. You are OK in my book.

Happy Trails,
Dusty

GORDON,
NO MATTER WHAT U POST OR THE EMAILS U REPLY TO,
U R A CLASS ACT!!!!

Alan, from the tone of your sentence "thanking me" it's relatively obvious that your thanks is facetious in nature.

Your initial post alluded that your engine looked like an authentic 356 engine. I carefully warned you that it would burst your bubble and proceeded to point out the more obvious differences.

Later, you indicated that many Speedster owners are driving their cars with VW engines.

OK, what does that have to do with an authentic 356 engine? I've seen numerous 356, 912 and a few 911's with VW engines, just because it's installed in their car doesn't make it authentic.

When I pointed out the differences, I suspected that your reply would be one of anger and defensive in nature.

Sorry but YOU asked for comments. If you don't want to read an opposing opinion then don't ask the question, especially here.

I guess my point is that nowhere in my initial post did I say that I had posted a picture of an EXACT freakin' replica of a 356 engine. I believe my words were "authentic looking" . . . meaning that the average NON-porschephile might think it was a real engine and might think it was original. This because it kinda looks like it COULD be an authentic engine to the untrained eye.

It might shock some people, but most folks don't make a it a point to memorize every bit of minutia about old Porsche engines. I actually DO . . . having numerous technical references and the intelligence to do a google search for "356 engine pictures". I know what they look like -- any search engine will turn-up hundreds of images. It was never my intent to make an accurate replica engine. To do so would be a fun project, but at the end of the day there'd be some snob that would look down into the engine compartment and go "I hate to burst your bubble, but this is just a VW engine). There's no disguising the engine case! Then they'd point out that the car was made out of plastic. But, I can't afford a $200K car, and few of us could afford to drive the real thing on public roads.

I am sorry if I misled anyone and wasted their incredibly precious time by opening the link to the picture.

My intent was to get ideas in a constructive way. Comments like "I hate to tell you . . but (insert 'your engine sucks' phrases here)." Or comparing it to chromed-out American hotrod engines . . . those comments aren't really very constructive or useful to anyone. They really only serve to allow angry or or otherwise unsatisfied people to vent. Worst case -- they hurt someone's feelings. My feelings aren't hurt at all, but I do find these forums an interesting social experiment sometimes. And, if I do take offense, I take solace in the fact that the more intelligent readers probably see things as I see them.

Just when I begin to have faith in my fellow man, or believe that our public schools are doing a good job of teaching people to spell . . . I post something on one of these forums. It brings me back to reality. That said, I think I'll refrain from posting anything here for quite some time -- if ever again. After all, I'm tired of typing.

Cheers,
Alan

Wow. Just.... wow.

Like I said...this site offers the best entertainment value in town! Sorta like an automotive 'Roast'. 8-]

Alan,
You're entitled to change the meaning of authentic
if that makes you happy

"authentic"

Alan, really appreciate your interest and expertise. That said, I have huge respect for the Larry and what he contributes. He has a tons of knowledge and shares it freely.

Don't like the idea of you taking your ball out of the game and going home, stick around and share. Enjoy your enthusiasm.

It's all about learning, wrenching, and fun.

"My feelings aren't hurt at all"....Oh really...Have a set of balls dude....
sounds like Alan came to the party unprepared...