Bergmann

Check out testimonials at the bottom of the page.

Back in early 2000s I made the mistake of buying a Bergman 911 styled shroud.

Here's my synopsis:

Bad points:

1.  It was a bitch to install

2.  I had to used a center pull linkage

3.  I couldn't use the stock mounted oil cooler

4.  It was expensive  $1050 + $100 for paint)

5.  I had to cut the hood's center air intake so the fan would clear the hood

6.  There was no airflow flaps for quicker warmups

7.  Overall cylinder air flow was a mess-no vanes to direct air flow to individual cylinders

Good points:

1.  the shroud looked awesome

Bob-

Listen to Ron. He's like my Canadian brother. He (like me) has made nearly every expensive mistake there is to make.

They do look really cool though.

Stan:

A shroud would be way down my list at this point, as you know. Bergmann's wouldn't make the cut. But, they are pretty!

There are people that claim great success with his engines (aren't there a couple of guys here?), but a lot of people (if you look up Bergmann in the Samba's feedback forum) have really not got what they paid for....

As already mentioned, his new site is pretty slick.  I do like his air cleaner setup.  I plan on fabricating something similar that will clear my stock shroud.  Unlike most pan based replicas, I have 3 inches clearance between the shroud and the firewall. 

Unfortunately, because of clearance issues (gain 3" in the back, but lose 3" in the front) I'm not able to run stock sized air cleaners.  The much smaller cleaners I now use work okay, but I want something better.

Bergman modifies CB's pressure cover for it's turbo kit.

And ends up with this:

My present setup:

I have no idea if the Bergmann setup is an improvement, but it is pretty trick looking.

I need to post a pic of my air filter setup. It uses the CB turbo end pieces and two cone air filters. I got everything from CB. Much quieter on cruise. Same power at full throttle and almost the same noise level. Major quiet at cruise though, which was the point of my mod. The car was fine with the top off, but unbearable with the top up. This has helped greatly, along with my active earbuds.

Anxious to see it, Danny! So you don't see any performance difference across the power band with your set up?

None by seat of pants. Just quieter.

I re built/reworked/got the bergerman out of it. 2386 for a 912 about 3 years ago. it had about 800 miles or less when it came unglued then came to my shop. what a effing mess to be nice.oh so much not right. the big valve heads were small valve heads with big valves stuck in the small seats, seating on the swirlpolish of the valves,how it seated at all is a wonder to me. the welded up crank had 3 of the 4 oil holes(rod throw gallys) almost compleatly welded closed,yes the rod bearings were dead. the crank had massive slivers hanging off it from the machining opps that were not finesed off or deburred. the duell gally(duel relief case) had been disabled, the pressure relief in the case was afu, the oil pump cover had a pressure relief recirc ballvalve that leeked internaly oh so bad. rod caps ground way to far on the caps for stroker clearancing,some pushrods assembled with cocked ends,some not pressed i all the way.the stock vw shafts had been drilled and washers bolted to the end,1.1 rockers on a cam with .328 lift. probably a lot more crap that I cant recall right now. but the shroud was pretty!!! but it took about 3 days to make incerts for it then glass them in about a week total on the shroud to get it right inside( I also had to make a mock up engine the same width as the one I was rebuilding for it so it would fit& have the correct cooling gaps in the correct aera.and fit as it should. I dont have a clue as to why the cooler is not in the shroud there is plenty of room for it. the cooler block off was also some what of a restriction,so some ball milling of it corrected that. the oil pump cover also had 1/4 out let  fittings on it.min is 3/8".  

 from what I understand it was supplied with a dyno sheet of 160 hp,( Ive heard all his stuff gets the same dyno sheet)the owner said it was a turd.the owner now says he needs some stickey tires as it just kills the tires and is oh somuch fun to drive,I told him he probably shouldent be doing smokey burnouts but he said he isant trying to do them.I think it's the most he has smiled in years. I basicly reworked everything but the heads that had been hemi cut(junk)they were replaced with cb cnc miniwedge ports, with 1.4 cb rockers on it.&new pushrods.new aluminum pushrod tubes, it had stock ones with a machined spacer for the longer stroke....what a joke.

 yes I would have one of his shroud assys if the price was right....but I have 3 new 36 style shrouds hear& 75 amp alt so I dont see that happining.

Wow!

yup, wow.If I had not tore it down my self I dont know if I would of beleaved it. whats realy sad about it is all the good parts,a few sort of parts, and nobody that knew what they were doing or that cared about it.I just dont get it, this **** is big bissness,and it's ****. no exscuse for it at all,none. and it seems that all of the stuff that comes through thier doors is like this.why??? it dosent cost more to do it right.But it does cost to redo it and the lost consumer base. yes there are plenty of his engines still running around,but how well? how many miles? mpg?how much power? the guy that I redid his went for a ride in my mild 2028 and was surprized that a small motor made more power & ran better than his big high dollar motor. So to sum it up....****  happens....time and time again.try not to step in it. I hope one day he will hire somebody that cares about quality and knows something about engines other than how to paint them.

 on another note he left cali for oklihomer....now back in cali. please hire somebody to run&build your stuff mr bergerman.(Im kinda a chicken&turkey guy)

sounds kind of like berniemeister.

Danny, waiting for a photo of your air cleaners.....

Pearl is running a Bergman engine - There......I've said it.

I had a very demanding work schedule back in the early 1990's and wanted to save a lot of time by having someone else build my engine, so I ordered a long block from him, was very specific as to what I wanted for build components and got that all rolled into a contract.  I received it in a few months and then it sat under my bench for well over three years before I got it built up and installed.  Remember, I was working a lot of hours and traveling a whole lot, so my build process was almost as slow as Wolfgang's......counted in years.

As I was building it up on an engine stand, I thought that it turned over by hand a bit hard, but I attributed that to everything being new and dry so didn't give it a second thought.

When I finally started it up, it ran nicely for 20 minutes at a fast idle and then I shut it down.  Fifteen minutes later I re-started it to drive it back into the garage (about 20 feet)  and it ran for about 15-20 seconds before the engine seized.  THAT was pretty dramatic - running one second, totally stopped the next.

Several phone calls to Bernie told me that he would fix whatever was wrong for free (even after close to 4 years) but I had to pay about $350 in shipping each way to get it back to him and then returned to me.  By that time things had slowed down a bit at work so I decided to do the rebuild myself.

When I tore it down I found that the #4 main crank bearing - a full-circle bearing closest to the flywheel - had been installed slightly cocked so that the dowel pins holding it in place were angled to the holes they fit into, thereby squashing the bearing onto the crankshaft journal.  After even a short runtime that squashed bearing expanded from excess heat and seized to the crank.  Coulda happened to anyone, but the original builder should have caught it when he turned the crank over by hand.  

I got the seized bearing off of the crankshaft with gentle heat from a propane torch (it fell right off).  There was no visible damage to the crank journals, but I had the crank journals polished by a machine shop, just to be sure they were OK, then re-assembled with a new set of bearings spec'd by the guys who did the polishing.

Actually, I was OK that I had to do a rebuild, because I found that, except for the squashed bearing, everything else was assembled well and clearances were right on the money.  It also let me do some hand - porting to the heads and intake manifolds to make them match better.

The rest of the engine had all of the parts I requested and I found nothing of inferior quality for parts.  The only thing that has died in there was one of the stock, rocker arm shafts (at Chris' wedding), so I replaced both with solid racing shafts from Gene Berg.  No problems since.  I'm running single, HD valve springs so I was a bit surprised that a shaft broke, but they ARE pretty stiff so what the heck.  Replacing the shafts was an afternoon job made long by futzing around getting the shims just right.

OBTW:  When I was re-assembling the case halves, I got a cam bearing out of place and broke a boss off of the inside of the case.  I had to get it welded and machined and then align-bored to make it right, so that just goes to show that assembly mis-haps can happen to anyone.  Things have been fine since, but from all of the negative news I hear about Bergman's workmanship (and what was all that about moving from SoCal to OKC and back to SoCal???) I would be hard-pressed to recommend him.

That's the thing Gordon; there are people that have had great experiences with him. And then there's Mark's story (for those that missed it, see his posts above). Unfortunately, the list of people that didn't get what they paid for is way too long. Mismatched engine case halves (something that should never even be considered, as they are machined as a pair bolted together), stock instead of big valve heads or no porting, the wrong cam, stock instead of higher ratio rockers, and the list goes on. And even when all the parts you paid for are there, quite often assembly isn't right. For a good read, go to the Samba, click on Forums and then Buyer/Seller Feedback near the bottom of the page and search for Bergmann as a title. Al

He does have nice magazine ads though!

Sounds to me that at this stage Pearl has a Nichols engine. Good for you!

Tomorrow Bob, it is 15F right now.....

But I cribbed these off of CB's site:

Order one left, one right, a pair of gaskets come as one part number, and two filters.(Hover your mouse over the photos to get CB's part number)

I had to get shorter velocity stacks, I think they are 1 1/4" high instead of the 2" ones I had. And the air cleaner studs are a little long, but I didn't trim them in case I ever go back to the other air cleaners. $97 plus shipping. My shorter stacks were 30-something, I can't remember but I know I got them on ebay from a west-coast or Midwest VW supplier.

With respect to the 911 shroud, I have an actual P-car fan, ring, and alternator. I got the shroud kit from Greg at Vintage Spyders for $500 if I remember correctly. It may have been free, I got a bunch of options free as my chassis was late in arrival, the later it got, the more "free" I got!

I had the alternator professionally rebuilt and changed to an internal Japanese  regulator, the term is "one-wired". It really has two, one for the idiot light and one for the charge wire. That was cheap as I've known my auto-electric guy for years.

I mailed the whole thing to Jake and he machined the ring down for me so the whole thing would fit. My motor was dynoed with this shroud and alt. in place. I sealed it up better with foam weatherstrip as it really didn't fit all that well around the case, there were too many leaks. I took my time around the spark plugs and fit the airseals around the wires, leaks there can roast your heads. There aren't any holes in this shroud when you get it, you have to make them all. Also, the oil fill and breather was CRAP so I fabbed something better. It was a bit of work, as Ron says, but not any more difficult than anything else on this car.

I run 260-270F most of the time. It hits 300 in SLOW traffic when it is 90 plus out, but it cools down once traffic is moving. This is more a factor of hot air recirculating under the Spyder's open decklid than the shroud.

The worst thing is you can't even see the fan on a Spyder! 

I do like the looks of the bergerman "shroud of turin"...cars, looks more like porsche....but not 356, 356 looks more like vw....thus the vw 36 style doggy style shroud I have for mine.wide "B" fan, new oe vw cooler 75 amp alt,aluminum alt pully,and many mods to all the cooling system will be exicuted to ensure cooler heads will prevail. curently I have superflow heads for this build, they will get major mods and the tins will be one off items for them only.

      there are many things that can be done to make these things more reliable.just remember these cars&engines were a low cost low power ,real low power,production cars(the vw) and we want oh so much more.well that oh so much more is easy and can be done reliable...if it's all done and done corectly.that meens all done as in cooling,timing ,fuel,clearances,seals,coatings,even oil and fuel.and much more.

Danny

I gather you mount the turbo air boxes and then attach the conical air cleaner to the opening pipe....what a great idea!

This will definitely be in my future plans, although I will have to have one end of the turbo air boxes cut down to clear the engine hood.

Ron:

So you are going to cut down the pipe or the boxes for clearance?

The boxes.  You can see, in the photo below, how close the short air cleaners are to the body.

you can also route the filter to just about anywhere you want it ,tie them togeather or have 2 filters.if you do so I would recomend having the filter hang down, so If any water gets to it it will not run into the carb&into your engine. but remember restrictions eat power&mpg.I wish they had a biger tube than what is there.and wish that hat was made for better flow,not just to addapt&cover the crabs throught.

I get it now, Ron. Thanks

I havent seen any of those hats in a long time,so Im  not sure as to how they mount,like the filter on the inside of the lower lip or if they mount on the lip or outside the lip so any debris just falls down and dosent collect inbetween the hat&the lower lip(dirt,sand, water,crap etc). it would be nice if they were like thier "C" chanel valve covers and sat on top the lowerbase's lip with the "C" channel gasket on the lower lip for the upper to seal agnist. or would that be too much to ask for....remember sheet happens, and when the sheet is piled between the sheets, something is getten sheet on, when the sheet is removed, and some sheet falls in, not much, but just enough sheet to hit the fan...or jets..or seats...or cylinderwalls. It dosent take a guy with the last name of ted and a first name of sheet to figure out his car isant running so good after some tinkering and dirt indigestion.

Danny says:  "I run 260-270F most of the time. It hits 300 in SLOW traffic when it is 90 plus out, but it cools down once traffic is moving."

Really? 

Yes Mark, really. My sensor is in the FI boss for warmup sensing, not under the plugs. And that is what it reads, but I never verified the accuracy.

The turbo hats fit inside the lip on the bases, on the gaskets. They seal just fine, in fact, I haven't had a single plugged jet since they were installed. I have no "jet doctors", just stock Spanish Webers. Makes me think that maybe the standard K & N style filters might be the reason jets clog.

Ron, exactly, just make sure water can't get into the filters. Not a problem on Spyders, the decklid covers the whole thing.

Thanks Danny.

For Bob and Ron

Danny:

Very trick! That was how I envisioned the setup as you explained it. Thanks.

No problem, Bob. I think it would be fairly easy to fab aluminum water shields for Speedsters. They could either go under the air filter hose clamp or bolt through the tops. Unless they are already under the decklid enough, unlike regular filters.

I'm sure some will start worrying about restriction, but the surface area of the 2" opening is more than the 36mm vents AND only one cylinder is drawing at a time. Like I said before, no power loss, only intake noise loss has been noted, which was the point of the whole thing in the first place. Also, no change in AF ratio noted on my Innovate Wideband.

Do you know that the FI boss only really tells you when the head warms up, and isn't capable of registering the moment to moment changes like under the plug?

Yes. I use it for trends, plus it will let me know when the belt is slipping. I have an identical sensor on the other side too, it is a warmup sensor for my ignition, timing is a few degrees advanced until engine is warm at idle only. Really helps with cold running, no chokes needed

I was meaning when the tops were pulled off the crud could be an issue faling into whatever it wanted to. as far as the filters those are about the same as k&n,Ive run those too.I did this last week have the 2nd pluged idle jet I have ever had in 12 years or so. I use the outer wears on my filters, the filters stay clean. and nothing gets past the outer wears.I would put some on your's. I have always planed on running alumunim tubing from the crabs to the filters,possiably a box.and the carbs may also be in  box's,with a dummy single 1bbl....na probably just do that on my bug if I ever redo it.(there are lots of experts around hear with realy fast bugs....atleast thats what thier muffler tells them.

Thanks Mark. I know the crap/dirt can fall in. As far as how fast it is? Never been beat on the street by a car, bike yes in a straight line. My buds here who have ridden in it, driven it, or been beat will back me up. We are not talking drag race here, although I have done that a couple times with this car. We are talking roll-on TORQUE and a super wide powerband. Thanks again, Jake Raby, for a great lump!

Don't doubt Danny!  That car absolutely FLYS!  Ask Danny for a demo at Carlisle.  A Suby- eating type1. Yep.  

Thanks, Danny

With a CHT sensor in the factory FI sensor position you're seeing a 40* reduction in what you'd see under the plug. Thats the data I gathered directly testing the two positions back to back. That position takes longer to warm up and longer to cool down which is what the factory wanted for the factory FI system.

Oh, and yes, looks kill. I tend to run a technology based company, not a fashion company. We call the 911 shroud "just another dumb blonde".