Your right Anthony, speaking of sense, sometimes it is non sensical, but we appreciate everyone 2¢ especially if you have experience to back up your information. We live in the age of teaching concepts, but few have the Experience to back up their statements. Experience is everything. 
Ray
I am the first to say there are many good engine builders, I guess you are talking about engine builders? Talk with the engineers at Hendrick (spelling) or Roush Racing who build engines to run at 9000 rpm for at least 500 miles in hot weather conditions and get their input on oil to use. See, I keep saying I am not the smartest cookie on the block, but I know to talk with those, whom are paid high dollars to know this stuff.
There are many good engine builders and you will get different opinions on what type or weight of oil to use. I think, money aside, if you find some that works good for your engine combination and the oil pressure is good and oil temperature is good, keep on using it.
Where was I when the discussion on engine cooling was going on ? I read all the post, but had not joined yet. I enjoy reading what others have to say and sometimes, agree with their statements. No, not set in my ways. I have the "new" flip open cell phone. See, progress. Just did not need the smart phone, had the money, but no need. My cheap cell phone can hold up xxx pictures, so I use my digital Nikon which holds only 4000 images. Oh my, new tech stuff ?
There are many good engine builders and you will get different opinions on what type or weight of oil to use. I think, money aside, if you find some that works good for your engine combination and the oil pressure is good and oil temperature is good, keep on using it.
Where was I when the discussion on engine cooling was going on ? I read all the post, but had not joined yet. I enjoy reading what others have to say and sometimes, agree with their statements. No, not set in my ways. I have the "new" flip open cell phone. See, progress. Just did not need the smart phone, had the money, but no need. My cheap cell phone can hold up xxx pictures, so I use my digital Nikon which holds only 4000 images. Oh my, new tech stuff ?
I have to ask... Based on what George is saying above is this article on Nascar dot com just a bunch of B.S. to sell Mobil 1 products?
Please read and comment. Personally I use synthetic oil.
http://www.nascar.com/en_us/ne...n-racing-nascar.html
Here is another article supporting synthetic:
The article stated 50% of the teams either use synthetic or Mobil 1. It was not clear what the others use in their engines. Now, we all agree that the car manufactures strongly suggest waiting until you have 7500 to 10,000 miles on their variety of engines, before going with synthetic. Why? Because, the parts need to "break in", as we should all agree on. The break in time frame depends on how long you want you engine to last. 7500 miles is long time, before using synthetic. So, race engines ? They test run them for perhaps one hour , at 1/2 speed for some break in on the new parts and to test each engine's horsepower on a dyno. Two engines, with the same parts ; one produces more HP than the other one and this baffles most engineers. On paper, they look the same. Back to oil - so, with the VW air cooled engine, VW , not me, followed the process of demanding people bring back their cars at 300 miles or there about, to have the car checked and valve clearance re-adjusted, oil changed, etc. To let the engine 'break in' as they say or VW would not honor your engine warranty. On speedsters, if you have a new engine, based on what the car manufactures follow, you should be putting 250 miles of easy driving on the new engine, then having it re-adjusted, as needed. Oil should be petroleum, not synthetic to best allow for the parts to 'break in'. And, you want special "break in" oil, with "break in" additives which is not synthetic. So, I guess, following this train of thought, after I get 7500 miles on my new speedster engine, then I switch over to synthetic and watch the oil temperature closely. I mentioned the synthetic does not pull out the heat from the engine parts, like the petroleum oil does. Ask engineers and we agree synthetic can run hotter, so old oil breaks down and synthetic does not. So, it can let your engine get so hot and the synthetic will still be just fine, but your old air cooled engine is frying in heat. I cannot gamble with having less friction and oil which last forever in exchange for an engine running hotter. You know, NEW water cooled engines run hotter to burn off pollutants. You cannot do this with the already hot running air cooled engine, so I avoid doing any changes which MIGHT increase my engine parts on temperature. Buy a good temperature gauge and watch it with your synthetic and if you drive in stop and go traffic, as I do, I bet the temperature reading will surprise you. Put in the dino oil and check it again, under same conditions. There is the personal test all should do and there are too many factors and variety in speedsters to compare apples to apples.
George kinda reminds me of another George. 
15 years of experience and I have to say this site is almost 90% funded by oil preference.
-=theron
"George, George, It's George of the Jungle ". Love that cartoon. Better watch out for that tree ! That's me, tripping over parts inside my shop, not quite running into a tree in the jungle, but close.
I do not like the song " Georgee Porgee" and heard that enough when a young child. You know, actually, it was about the King George in England and a political song. This has nothing to do with speedsters.
Well, friends, my project chassis is now complete, so onward to putting the body bolted to the chassis. Somehow, I just remembered we did have a small jungle with vines hanging off large Oak trees, when I was young. Wow, good memories. I probably ran into a tree , swinging on the vine and reason my logic on oil and other topics is strange.
I am doing an updated research on what NASCAR really uses in their race cars, for OIL.
I do not like the song " Georgee Porgee" and heard that enough when a young child. You know, actually, it was about the King George in England and a political song. This has nothing to do with speedsters.
Well, friends, my project chassis is now complete, so onward to putting the body bolted to the chassis. Somehow, I just remembered we did have a small jungle with vines hanging off large Oak trees, when I was young. Wow, good memories. I probably ran into a tree , swinging on the vine and reason my logic on oil and other topics is strange.
I am doing an updated research on what NASCAR really uses in their race cars, for OIL.
Time to talk about blinker fluid.
My head is spinning...
Final comments. I looked as hard as possible on the Internet and asked this question - " What type of oil is used most of the time in NASCAR engines?" As we wonder about that Mobil 1 commercial shown on the Internet. And, looked for answers about synthetic compared to petroleum oil and found almost no discussion. In Wikelicks ( spelling) that site does not address what race cars mostly use. They do not discuss what NASCAR really uses in their engines. In the write-up about synthetic, the web site stated that MOSTLY petroleum oil is the standard in use, due to 100 years of development and improvement. So, most people and most engines still use the old stuff and there is no discussion about use of synthetic in race engines. I liked the research on top fuel engines and their use of oil, their 150 plus PSI oil pressure and so forth. I think I read they use 70wt. oil. Well, we are not running 10,000hp engines in our speedsters, so back to reality. What is unanswered in this discussion about oil is does the synthetic carry off the heat from the engine to the oil cooler and therefore help to keep the engine run cooler. VW said 40% of the cooling of the engine is based on what the oil does. They did not test results using synthetic. Are there any auto engineers or perhaps mechanical engineers who own speedsters, whom can answer these questions ?
Originally Posted by Stan Galat, '05 IM, 2276, Tremont, IL:
I love "oil wars".
Let's talk about GL4 vs GL5 gear lube!
Originally Posted by George4888:
VW and Porsche, in their owner's manuals, on the old cars recommended ONLY GL5. Go discuss that with the German engineers. It is a military rated number. Government listed number 5, used by our USA military. So, go discuss that best gear oil with the US Government, not me. If good enough for the military and good enough for VW and Porches, it is good enough for me. Forget the GL-4 stuff.
I wasn't being serious, George. There's nothing (and I really mean nothing) like the holy wars that get started over oil. Car guys LOVE arguing about this stuff.
Check this out:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/for...ewtopic.php?t=276529
That's 42 pages of gear-lube love. Pages and pages and pages of smart guys going to the mat for their particular gear lube. It'd be comical, if people weren't so foaming-at-the-mouth adamant about it.
FWIW, it was GL4 that was recommended by VW. GL5 is a better for hypoid gears. There is a fair amount of concern about GL5 attacking the yellow metal (brass) used in the syncro rings. I've used GL5, I think the fears are overblown and it's a suitable replacement... but as far as I know, it wasn't the VW factory recommended lube for manual transmissions.
There's a trade-off with everything. GL5 is better for the hypoid gears, GL4 is better for the syncro rings. All things being equal, I'll take my chances on GL5.
Another George used to say, "you pay your money and you take your chances".
I keep repeating that I am not smart, but believe what I read in the Owner's manual I had, with my VW Bugs and with Porsche cars. I am sure the factory engineers had it right. So, not my opinion, just repeating what the manufacturer wanted the owner of the new car to use. Ever go into an auto parts store and ask for GL5 gear oil ? That is fun !!! Like looking at a deer staring into the headlights, with the counter clerk. The clerk is frozen , behind the counter as these people don't know what they are selling. IT's on the label ---- if they would read what they sell. Duh !!
Short parts person story. This is funny. Not being sexist on this, but it was a "girl" who waited on me. Went into the auto parts store and asked for a pressure plate. She had one for a VW Beetle and brought a
reconditioned one to me, in a box. I opened the box and the fingers were all NOT even and it looked bad to me. Here is the funny part. I told the young lady the part she was showing me was not good and she said " Sir, if it does not work, it is warrantied . " At that point, I asked to talk with the manager. Real true story .
Short parts person story. This is funny. Not being sexist on this, but it was a "girl" who waited on me. Went into the auto parts store and asked for a pressure plate. She had one for a VW Beetle and brought a
reconditioned one to me, in a box. I opened the box and the fingers were all NOT even and it looked bad to me. Here is the funny part. I told the young lady the part she was showing me was not good and she said " Sir, if it does not work, it is warrantied . " At that point, I asked to talk with the manager. Real true story .
Originally Posted by George4888:
I keep repeating that I am not smart, but believe what I read in the Owner's manual I had, with my VW Bugs and with Porsche cars. I am sure the factory engineers had it right. So, not my opinion, just repeating what the manufacturer wanted the owner of the new car to use.
I'm unclear why you keep saying that, George. The image I posted above is from the Bentley VW official factory service manual. I've got the latest edition of the same manual, and the recommendations haven't changed. The factory manual plainly recommended GL4, both when the vehicle was new and with the latest service manual.
I'm not trying to be contentious, just pointing out that the manufacturer "wanted the owner (and servicer) of the new car" to use GL4 in a manual transmission.
I'm running GL5 in my car (Swepco 201) because I believe it's better. I'd rather protect my (really expensive) gears than my (relatively cheap) syncro rings. I'm not smarter than the old German engineers, but time has moved on. You seem to agree- at least I think you do. You're strongly advocating for GL5, even though it isn't the factory recommended oil for old VW transaxles.
So, back to engine oil- I run Penn 10W30 in the engine (at $7.50/qt, no dancing lady) because it's got an additive pack that I believe is better for flat tappet engines than the current (low zinc, low phosphorus) SM/SL/SJ/SH formulas. Penn oil has 1500 ppm of Zn and 1340- 1400 ppm P. As you know, these are "sacrificial" elements in oil to protect cam lobes and tappet faces in high-pressure situations (like a flat-tappet engine with dual valve-springs). Modern engines don't have crazy cam/tappet loads (too much frictional loss) and these sacrificial metals foul catalytic converters, so they have been greatly reduced in modern formulas. The Zn/P additives also leave sludge deposits unless the oil formula has a good detergent pack and the oil is changed often, so if they are not needed it's better to not have them- hence the new formula.
I DO want the additives, and I'm not smart enough to play home-brew chemist by adding a zinc/phosphate additive to a modern SM/SL/SJ/SH oil. I have no idea what kind of detergent pack there is in the oil, and whether or not it will play nicely with the additive. Other guys have no compunction doing just that. Everybody has their own opinion. The factory recommended 30 weight oil- and there are still guys out there who swear it's the only way. Never mind that the 30 weight they are running isn't the same 30 weight Granddad used to put in his Beetle... but if it makes them feel happy, I suppose there's no harm in it.
All I'm trying to say is "factory recommended" is kind've irrelevant to the discussion. The factory recommended GL4 gear oil, but everybody runs GL5. The factory recommended running old-formula straight-weight oil, but it hasn't been available for 30 years so we all make the best decisions we can. There are guys that swear by dino oil. There are guys that swear by synthetic. For me, neither is as important as the additive pack, but that's just my opinion- that and $3 will buy a dark-roast at most Starbucks in America.
Okay, the owner's manuals, from way back only showed 90wt. and no mention of GL numbers. I think I forgot what I read about and if you look up what Porsche recommended, then I think I am correct on the GL-5. I have owned many Porsche air cooled cars and I guess when I read what they recommended, I figured best to use the same thing in my VW. If it was good enough for the Porsche transmission, then good enough for my VW transmission. Is this logical ? And, in most of my Bentley repair manuals, they don't mention the GL rating. On oils, just suggest any good quality oil and weight based on the climate where you live. On start up's, I am certain my use of 10W30 with Lucas break in additive is doing some good on the new parts. Or, have used only 30wt. break in oil, which has plenty of zinc in it. Berg used to suggest only 20wt. non-detergent for break in, but that old oil did have plenty of zinc in it. He did not want the oil cleaning off the parts with additives or detergent, in the break in process on his engines. I used to follow that routine, until I talked with many Super Stock V8 engine builders who use what I now use.
Since all now think I am against synthetic oil, I did use synthetic gear oil in the race transmission , only for race use. The oil never gets that hot, in a manual transmission, so wanted the reduced friction. But, because synthetic is like a thinner stuff, I had a few leaks, not so, with the old dino 90wt. oil. A cookie sheet, tied with ty-wraps, under that transmission worked to keep liquids off the track. You heard it first, here. Cookie sheet and that works wonders under leaking VW engines. Not kidding. Buy the big "baker's " sheets, for big leaks. Ever see those "trays", the bread delivery person has, to carry in loafs of bread to the stores ? Make wonderful catch pans, under you car, to catch any oil leaks. They sell them really cheap, once they get banged up or old. Come in both aluminum and fiberglass.
Since all now think I am against synthetic oil, I did use synthetic gear oil in the race transmission , only for race use. The oil never gets that hot, in a manual transmission, so wanted the reduced friction. But, because synthetic is like a thinner stuff, I had a few leaks, not so, with the old dino 90wt. oil. A cookie sheet, tied with ty-wraps, under that transmission worked to keep liquids off the track. You heard it first, here. Cookie sheet and that works wonders under leaking VW engines. Not kidding. Buy the big "baker's " sheets, for big leaks. Ever see those "trays", the bread delivery person has, to carry in loafs of bread to the stores ? Make wonderful catch pans, under you car, to catch any oil leaks. They sell them really cheap, once they get banged up or old. Come in both aluminum and fiberglass.
George I would really like to see a picture of that bread tray caching the oil. Ray
We also had to use one on my son's race car, under the oil pump, which never sealed. I will look late tonight and see if any of my photos show the tray. If I find one picture, that will prove it.
Well, looked for the bread tray picture on the race car and I guess, due to me thinking how Mickey-Mouse it looked, I did not want to show that to anyone. NHRA and IHRA approved, as it would keep the oil off the track. You probably know, they require safety blankets around all the automatic transmissions, there days, on the dragsters. That acts also like a diaper to catch fluid.
Received a 114 page manual on how to assemble the Porsche Speedster I bought, in unfinished condition, like totally unfinished. Been reading the instructions and this is going to really help me assemble it and also to find out what parts are missing , which are needed to complete the project.
Before I work on the body assembly, which is next, as the chassis work, engine and transmission are finished, I have the body suspended by "come along" ratchet devices and cables from the rafters of my garage. Before I get under that hanging body, as the instructions suggest one has to do, I am going to buy some strong tall support stands , so I can live longer. Not trusting my suspended body system. The stands will be for safety , in case those cables break. The instruction manual suggested saw horses about 50 inches X 36 inches and I think they intended for the body to be supported on the saw horses. Some what off topic here, but good safety tips.
Received a 114 page manual on how to assemble the Porsche Speedster I bought, in unfinished condition, like totally unfinished. Been reading the instructions and this is going to really help me assemble it and also to find out what parts are missing , which are needed to complete the project.
Before I work on the body assembly, which is next, as the chassis work, engine and transmission are finished, I have the body suspended by "come along" ratchet devices and cables from the rafters of my garage. Before I get under that hanging body, as the instructions suggest one has to do, I am going to buy some strong tall support stands , so I can live longer. Not trusting my suspended body system. The stands will be for safety , in case those cables break. The instruction manual suggested saw horses about 50 inches X 36 inches and I think they intended for the body to be supported on the saw horses. Some what off topic here, but good safety tips.
I look forward to following along, George.
I went the route of hanging from the rafters, too, but with an electric winch and a frame to get the support chains out to the corners of the cockpit. I put a couple of holes in the rear seat area into the sub-frame, and then caught the holes just in the front corners of the footwells.
A couple of lifts and adjustments to get it balanced and I was good to go, but the body was in the second bay while I rebuilt the rolling pan. Four of us carried it to the "working" bay when I was ready to mate the two - rolled out the pan, brought in the body and got it suspended by the winch, then rolled the pan back in so I could mess with the two and get everything matched just so. Had a couple of small stands for the body, but never really had to support it "up high" for long - it was usually just dry-sitting on the pan when I wasn't around.
You do what you have to do on these things.