As Troy says, any number of scenarios are possible...again, I'm going on what I heard from Matt. As for Kirk's payout, the legal doc would say that he got some money upfront but the bulk was to be from ensuing royalty payments which were soon terminated (and the subject of the lawsuit). I'm guessing that judgment this June spelled the end for AZ. As for whether Kirk would be a secured creditor, that could be an obligation of the business or a personal obligation of the buyer, depending on the sale agreement - either way, tough to collect now
"Criminals already know the law, it's the squares like us that need to understand what the law can and can't do." - @Jim Kelly
THIS ^
Those of us that have owned businesses or dealt with unscrupulous business partners, or employees, have learned through that experience that 'what is right and what is law are two totally separate universes'.
Let me say that again...'what is right and what is law are two totally separate universes'.
In case I didn't make it clear enough...'what is RIGHT and what is LAW are two totally SEPARATE universes'.
Yeah and while sometimes it would be nice to be back in the wild west it might not be unless your the fastest. 
@GTman posted:It probably would have a better shot of being bought out of bankruptcy if it was still in Hawaiin Gardens and still had Kirk's crew in place so that it would be more turnkey.
Yeah, with respect to that, there is a company in Hawaiian Gardens now. Vintage Motorcars, Inc. is the company. Greg Leach bought/leased the building and ALSO hired on all of Kirk's old employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ.
Read that again: Greg hired on all of Kirk's employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ between Christmas and New year's day about 5 years ago.
Vintage Motorcars, Inc, maker of pre-A 356 coupes, 356 Speedsters, and 550 Spyder replicas is run by Greg Leach since the early 90s. Greg used to be Vintage Spyders, and for his first 10 years or so, worked out of the exact same HG location that he is back to.
I'd say there is no need for anyone to buy any business. I hope the bankruptcy will pay off all buyers and creditors. Then let V-AZ go to the bottom of the dust-pile where it belongs. It's karma, starting off the way they did and moving out of state. Consequences.
"...and ALSO hired on all of Kirk's old employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ."
An act that contributed greatly to my opinion of Greg and his company. Good on him!
@DannyP posted:Yeah, with respect to that, there is a company in Hawaiian Gardens now. Vintage Motorcars, Inc. is the company. Greg Leach bought/leased the building and ALSO hired on all of Kirk's old employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ...
That was such a smart move- no learning curve training new people. It's turned out VERY well!
I am sure the workers did not want to move to AZ , but it was a smart move to hire them before they all go separate ways ,
and it seems to have worked out well for him
I'm pretty sure it was a win-win for all involved.
Not to make light of a terrible situation for everybody who's owed something by these AZ charlatans... but at the very minimum, this should finally eliminate the befuddlement of having two nearly identically named companies (Vintage Motorcar and Vintage Motorcars) each building "Vintage Speedsters" with bodies laid up by Greg Leech's guys using different molds (the subject of the linked lawsuit). It's enough to make even experienced guys corn-foozed.
Now, if we could figure out some alternative naming for the guy selling re-pop Chinese trim pieces (Vintage Speedster Parts) and Ming's company (Vintage Speed) we'd be getting somewhere.
Isn't that true. Naming confusion galore.
Yeah, and my buddy Dennis a few miles down the road from my house has a VW restoration/body business entitled "Vintage VW".
.
Speaking of Vintage Speedster Parts, they still show these in the catalog:
I'm thinking this will one day be worth more than the easy-to-find P-Car badge. They're only replicas once! Twenty years from now, they'll be making cheap copies of these in someplace like Wisconsin, and to think you can still buy the Chinese originals for bubkas!
I should probably scoop up all the remaining stock and corner the market.
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@Sacto Mitch posted:They're only replicas once!
To quote the sage from Sacramento:
"The quality is going in before the name is going on"
@Stan Galat posted:To quote the sage from Sacramento:
"The quality is going in before the name is going on"
Sorry to steal his thunder but wasn’t that Zenith advertisement
@IaM-Ray posted:Sorry to steal his thunder but wasn’t that Zenith advertisement
Well.... not quite.
The Zenith ad copy English was a little less... stilted. Almost as if English was Madison Avenue guy's native language.
Since I am not english, and having a mother tongue that is not english, what do I know about Zenith... not much except for the tv ads when I was a kid.
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"The quality is going in before the name is going on"
It is indeed, Stan.
Here is my own VS badge, which my car still wears proudly:
At one point I toyed with the idea of replacing it with a P-Car badge, as so many of my less secure brothers have done. But eventually, I thought, we all must take responsibility for our actions. We must man up. Was I ashamed of this car or proud of it, dammit?
The badge endures.
In time, I discovered a hidden feature of the badge that is probably little appreciated. Besides proclaiming its origins, this special badge also reveals to the world the provenance of the vehicle to which it is affixed.
After about 20K miles, one of the red stripes neatly peeled off. Not in a shabby way, but crisp and clean — revealing a neat gold bar underneath. My car was coming of age. It was maturing.
And then, after another 20K miles, a second red stripe peeled away and I had discovered the hidden Easter egg.
The badge records and proudly displays, if only to the cognoscenti, the car's total accumulated mileage, in a quiet, understated manner.
I drive my 'two-bar' VS with a pride of ownership not easily described, eagerly anticipating every mile, every oil change, every carb adjustment inevitably leading us to that hallowed third gold bar.
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Well with all the naming confusion you could say that it is a Very Special Build since your in Caulifornia.
Go ahead and rock that two-bar VS with pride, @Sacto Mitch. You've earned it.
Now is coming the Time of Miller. If you are having the time, we are having the beer.
To honor the shop team without any deceit about the company name, many of the older speedsters could wear an HG nose badge. Or a Hawaiian Gardens variation on the Reutter badge, even more appropriately.
Nice patina Mitch.
Yeah, and Mitch’s car is aging well, too.
@Stan Galat posted:Go ahead and rock that two-bar VS with pride, @Sacto Mitch. You've earned it.
Now is coming the Time of Miller. If you are having the time, we are having the beer.
legit lol
Great taste you will find, we're number one of its kind
Really gutted for those that lost money...
When England, Chesil went under they had over 50 cars ordered that customers lost their money for, plus hundreds of suppliers.
I've heard the new company took on various old members of the company, one of them a guy called simon Westwood , where most peoples anger was aimed at, but now they have all been fired by the new owner after only a month or so.
Must have found out Westwood and co had turned the brand toxic.
There is another new company in the UK called Sebring speedster, and they seem to have a different way to work, by not being too big and a pay as you build model.
I'm going to keep my hopes alive here at home first though, different regulations can complicate imports.
I wish Porsche themselves build one, it'll be expensive but at least get built.
Given the prices the used market is commanding it would seem not being able to run this kind of operation is a cash and most importantly a competence issue. The $250K comment sounds like a hobby business not a real manufacturing operation. From my businesses experience and education it would take a Capitalization of at least $10m.
Hello all. I'm also a victim. Just signed with Matt in July 2022, said someone backed out of a contract due to cancer, he told me if i gave him a deposit i could get this car April 2023. Really sucks. I filed with the AG and contacted my bank. Good luck to all.
I'm sorry Steve, seem one of the many including myself. Will you bank do anything? I never thought of contacting my bank, I wired in February 2021. I filed w/AG and Goodyear police which is also looking into.
Steve,
Matt must have dealt with a lot of cancer patients, that was the story he presented me in September 2021. He is a dishonest and untrustworthy human being. At this time, I only wish the worst for him and his family. Let’s hope he finds his “Bubba” behind bars and they eat baloney sandwiches together.
Steve I'd encourage you to call Det. Baca at the Goodyear PD as well
@Napa Paul posted:???"To send money to Mathew Teernik in the future..."??? WHY in hell would anybody SEND him money, now or in the future?
This was just an auto notification showing he changed all his info and opened a new bank account with new phone number.
On behalf of @Theron I’d like to admonish everyone to limit their posts to facts re: the bankruptcy. Impugning someone’s character and congratulating them on their upcoming prison wedding are all well and good, but it puts the website in a precarious position, legally.
Like I posted previously, you don’t need a case to sue someone into oblivion, only a lawyer that will to do the dirty work for you.
As more and more people are coming out of the wood work, the stories are all the same. That's what frustrates me and I believe most of you how long this show lasted. Not until my legal action got presented to VS, the curtain slowly dropped.
For what it's worth....On 10/28 I posted FYI: Best to use the term "alleged" than have said individual alleged retaliate which happens all too often. Use the PM option for specifics to individuals. AND ...... use common sense when replying to unfamiliar persons posting.
@ADAM SCHROEDER posted:This was just an auto notification showing he changed all his info and opened a new bank account with new phone number.
My question was entirely rhetorical. 
And I thought CMC was bad.......
Man, I'll never understand why some of you are so afraid. Free speech is one of the protected rights in this nation. Go back, reread the only legal advice from an actual lawyer (Jim Kelly) earlier in this thread. There's nothing even close to libelous here.
These defrauded guys (fellow members) didn't "allegedly" lose money, they gave a guy money and got nothing but broken promises and BS. This is really their thread. I'm not comfortable with all the 3rd party keyboard warrior saber rattling, but I can understand being frustrated for these guys. There, but for the grace of God go any of us.
Thieves and charlatans love it when their deeds go unreported. Mold and infection thrive in darkness. Light is by far the best disinfectant.
Theron is a big boy. He can moderate his own website.
Sorry I can only "like" Stan's post once.
@edsnova posted:Sorry I can only "like" Stan's post once.
Stan’s obviously never spent $100K and three years of his life defending himself from a bs defamation suit brought by someone who took offense to being called a liar over a misrepresented motorcycle from an online classified ad on a motorcycle forum and “called Saul.”
@dlearl476 posted:Stan’s obviously never spent $100K and three years of his life defending himself from a bs defamation suit brought by someone who took offense to being called a liar over a misrepresented motorcycle from an online classified ad on a motorcycle forum and “called Saul.”
Wow that really sucks; that guy was a real Richard, wasn’t he? 🙄🙄
@dlearl476 posted:Stan’s obviously never spent $100K and three years of his life defending himself from a bs defamation suit brought by someone who took offense to being called a liar over a misrepresented motorcycle from an online classified ad on a motorcycle forum and “called Saul.”
I was going to let this pass, but I decided to answer it.
Firstly, I'm really sorry for what you endured. It's awful to be singled out by a sociopath.
I might get hit by a runaway bus while walking on the sidewalk, but that doesn't mean I'm going to hide under my bed in case it happens. Free speech is a bit like that - stuff can happen, but living in fear of an unwarranted and irrational lawsuit seems to me like a pretty lousy way to move through life.
As to the personal aspect of your post - respectfully, Dave, you've got no idea how much I (or anybody here) have or haven't had to pay for exercising the right to express an opinion, or to defend oneself against a frivolous lawsuit (or governmental overreach). But even given that - the people sharing their experiences are not expressing opinions, they're stating facts. Cancelled checks with nothing to show for it are infinitely (by definition) different than getting something you perceive to be less than you paid for.
One is subject to interpretation, one is not.