brake light switch

@widebody boy

OK, Darrell, let's see what I can offer:

All running/blinkers work, so I'm thinking the ground is good, fuses look good, going to take off front wheel and look at switch on m/c,

On my Speedster, the brake light is a separate filament with a common ground in the light.  If the others work but no brake light, it's in the circuit (and probably the brake light switch at the M/C).

Should one side of the switch be hot all the time, or with key on only ?

One side should be hot all the time.  Yes, the M/C switch sends voltage to the rear lights, it does not provide ground.  One of your fuses (maybe the second from the left?) should provide +12V to the brake circuit all the time, even with the ignition off.

Someone on here in the past published a VS wiring diagram, Maybe Alan Merklin?, but the easiest thing to do is remove the front driver's side wheel and start probing for voltage on the M/C switches.  They may be wired together in parallel, but there are most likely three terminals.  The center one is not used (it is for the brake failure idiot light on the dash of a VW sedan and we don't use it).  The left and right terminals are simple switches - +12V in one side and out the other when the pedal is pressed.

These brake switches are way too often junk and have a high failure rate over a short time.  Life expectancy is about 18 months, just so you know.  German ones (if you can find one) last much longer.  You only need to wire up one (the front one to the front disks) but if both are wired in parallel, that's OK, too.

Does anyone on here have a VS Electrical Schematic for Darrell??

This might be a good start - AND Blessed by Dr. Clock!

https://www.speedsterowners.co...r-vintage-speedsters

12 volts to one side of switch, nada to the other when depressed. Switched the two blade connectors to the other switch that had none on it and magic !! got lights and my led lights hidden behind the grill is working , thanks for the ideas.

One of those blade connectors was for the OEM VW dash mounted brake test switch.  Don't know of anyone that has used the "safety" dash tester. 

The VS wiring diagram is located at the Resources Tab - visible to donating members.

There are often two switches in those MCs because they're a known weak link. When you get a minute, replace the bad one and rave on until next time. Be swift and deliberate about it; should not have to bleed them, but I hear sometimes you do.

I had an MG Midget that used the very same brake switch, and it went through them every couple of years.  I found that, as Ed said, if you were careful you could swap them out without bleeding.  As an added safety measure I would put some brake fluid into the hole in the switch and then use a toothpick to pop and fill any bubble before installing it.

Those hydraulic brake light switches are mostly from Asia and are mostly junk.  I used to replace mine about every other year and had to bleed the fluid each time I replaced a switch because the pedal got soft.  That sucked.   I finally got fed up with that and put in a mechanical switch worked off of the brake pedal arm.  That was back in 2009 or 2010 and it has been working reliably ever since.  Here is the thread talking about it:

https://www.speedsterowners.co...238#2135445019354238

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Congrats on solving this.

FWIW, my 2013 VS has six fuses. If you're looking up at the fuse block from the floor, which is pretty much where you need to be to see it, the brake lights are on the leftmost fuse - 10 amps in my car.

And yes, they're wired to be live when the ignition is off.

My MC and the brake light switch are both original with the car and — miracle of miracles — still working with no problems, as are all of the Asian repop gauges.

Which leads me to believe there's a lot to be said for keeping these cars garaged where humidity is generally pretty low and it never freezes, if at all possible. And not driving them in the rain probably helps keep delicate bits under the car (like the MC) from getting gummed up and corroded.

These are 'replicas' in many ways, beyond the obvious. A lot of the engineering done on 'real' cars to keep them alive and running through all kinds of weather and conditions was simply never considered when our cars were pushed out the door, four weeks after construction began. It's also one of the reasons why cars from Beck and IM, (and today's VM, too) always cost more than those bargain basement builds from VS.

These cars were great value for the money and can be made to deliver great service, if you understand just what they are and what they are not.

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I think I'm on my third brake light pressure switch.  They do swap out pretty easy.

I have the same pedal-mounted switch as Gordon with the pressure switches still connected.

The pedal-mounted switch activates the brake lights a little sooner although I don't know it that is significant.

I had to change the brake pressure switch twice on my first Spyder.

I don't know if it was the quality of the switches back then or what. 2002 to 2016 is a pretty long span of time. I know the brakes weren't used at all for the first three years until I got the car on the road.

I haven't had to change a switch in my new car. The switch dates from 2016.

I will say that I flush the brake fluid at least every two years. Sometimes every spring if I can. Maybe that has something to do with it?

I seldom flush my fluid. My MC and switch date from 2005. They're both original. Luck of the draw, or did Henry have a good source?

I have no idea.

I am really happy to see that @Stan Galat seldom flushes.  Now I don't feel so guilty about seldom flushing, brake fluid that is.

@Michael McKelvey posted:

I am really happy to see that @Stan Galat seldom flushes.  Now I don't feel so guilty about seldom flushing, brake fluid that is.

I think keeping the car in a climate controlled environment really helps. At least, that's my story and I'm sticking with it.

Whelp, that’s one more thing I can forget to do this Spring!

@Stan Galat posted:

I think keeping the car in a climate controlled environment really helps. At least, that's my story and I'm sticking with it.

I agree. I insulated my garage about ten years ago. No switch replacement since.

But you slackers that put your head in the sand and don't change the brake fluid? It will bite you, eventually. Probably when you need your brakes the most, sorry to say.

This is ESPECIALLY true with those of us who have hydraulic clutch setups. Most master cylinders and slaves are aluminum, but using a steel piston. You know what happens when dissimilar metals have even a hint of moisture?

Black goo and corrosion. Have fun replacing parts, when you could merely spend an hour of time and a few bucks on some new brake fluid.

Thank you sir, may I have another?

@Stan Galat posted:

Thank you sir, may I have another?

Any time, friend!

Just channeling my inner George Brown, fellas.

We live in a water world, conditioned spaces notwithstanding.  Its unique chemical properties allow it to serve as intermediary for all kinds of processes almost all of which are not favorable to automotive machinery.  Hence the liberal application on same of things like paint, tar, grease, wax and oil.  And water and brake fluid can't keep their hands off each other.

Some of y'all remember the problems I had with my Speedster on the last Tour de Smo' that I had it for (2017, I think).  The centrifugal advance weights had rusted together, and the springs on them had disintegrated.  Both of these conspired to make the car run rather poorly sporadically.

Yeah, it's certainly a water world in Charleston, SC.

@Sacto Mitch posted:

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Congrats on solving this.

FWIW, my 2013 VS has six fuses. If you're looking up at the fuse block from the floor, which is pretty much where you need to be to see it, the brake lights are on the leftmost fuse - 10 amps in my car.

And yes, they're wired to be live when the ignition is off.

My MC and the brake light switch are both original with the car and — miracle of miracles — still working with no problems, as are all of the Asian repop gauges.

Which leads me to believe there's a lot to be said for keeping these cars garaged where humidity is generally pretty low and it never freezes, if at all possible. And not driving them in the rain probably helps keep delicate bits under the car (like the MC) from getting gummed up and corroded.

These are 'replicas' in many ways, beyond the obvious. A lot of the engineering done on 'real' cars to keep them alive and running through all kinds of weather and conditions was simply never considered when our cars were pushed out the door, four weeks after construction began. It's also one of the reasons why cars from Beck and IM, (and today's VM, too) always cost more than those bargain basement builds from VS.

These cars were great value for the money and can be made to deliver great service, if you understand just what they are and what they are not.

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My VS is from 2004; back in November I replaced the original MC that came with it and transferred all the parts including the brake switch and the little plug (yes it has only one brake switch) and everything works, miraculously. Like Danny P said above, I also flush the brake fluid every two years.