Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA

!!

That car should already be sold. Good looking car.

Ted

What a deal that could easily be upgraded to a "Emory Look a Like"......Perhaps I see a Metal Craft chassis ?

I was wondering about that boxed in rear control arm visible in one of photos.  

Pretty nice car! Here's what John said about it when he bought it:

     It is supposed to be a 1983 IM.  I bought it from back east and had it shipped to California. The guy was not the original owner.  Im not sure it actually is an IM.  Im real happy with what I got but just like most new speedsters owners you are trying to figure things out.   I think the longer I have it, I learn to accept the car instead of wanting to make it into something it can never be.   Its a shortened VW pan.  IRS with custom swing arms.  The front end is lowered with the adjustment, sway bar and front end is braced to the pan.

 

Maybe he can chime in!

 

~WB

The boxed in rear control arm are had me thinking it might be a MC chassis...

 

Wasn't there a guy who owned an Italian restaurant in the Philly area that had this car?  As I recall it had the engine cover hinges like this one and he went to great pains to convert to the wide fives.  Can't think of his name, but he was pretty active on this site several years ago.

 

You're thinking of Mickey Donatello.  I don't think that's his car, but I'm not sure.

That is Mickey's car. Here's a pic of his rear suspension. Those boxed swing arms must have been a part of his laborous wide-5 conversion.

Here's his pic file link:

https://www.speedsterowners.com...agination.sort=SCORE

What a small world!

That's my car. Or it was

and yes, the arms were part of the wide five conversion. Had to do that for the offset difference in the rear. 

I just saw it on Samba. I was shocked to see it was offered so low. That is a steel at $13k.

As for it being an IM.... I was told it was when I bought it. The original rear lid hinges had Intermecanica embossed on them. I had no reason to think otherwise.

the gent I sold it to did a few things to make it look nicer like the steering wheel, but it was pretty well sorted when I sold it. I think one of the best improvements I made to that car were the frame supports to reduce flex at the rear door gap. And of course, Pats engine was huge!!! 

Someone should be very happy with that car. If I had money sitting around I'd be flying to Cali for a nice long drive home.

Do you have any pics of the frame support work you did?

I don't have any pics but it was a diagonal from the sill area up to the rear and reduced chassis flex quite a bit.

 

Hey Mickey, good to hear from you! Hope you are doing OK.

 

So, it's really an East Coast car!

Mickey,Welcome back? Have you been lurking in the background all these years? Miss the New Jersey Motorsport Park rendezvous! Are you still carting? I moved to Missouri back in 2013. Life in the Ozarks is "different"! I see you captured a photo of RUBY at NJMP (Img. 118). Seems like only yesterday!! Keep the rubber side down!

    Al

Are those hood hinges like 'quick release' type that allow the hood to be quickly removed/installed? Some of the vintage Porsche guys I used to open track/vintage race with had something similar for their hoods rather than hidden hinges, but I never really payed all that much attention to them closely...

Here are a few pictures of the "butt sag" fix that Mickey posted back in 2009.

 

 

Here are the details he posted about his CB Performance Pat Downs engine.

 

CB Performance 2005cc engine = 140+ hp
(78x90.5, Super Race Crank, full flowed w/ external oil
cooler, wedgeport heads, chromoloy push rods, , forged
chromoloy lightweight flywheel, MSD ignition w/ MSD
Blaster coil, Dual Weber 44 idf carbs, 1 5/8

John needs to add $3k to price -should quickly get asking price.  Suspect low price scares folks off.  Even $17k since IM provenance documented.  

Thanks for the brace pics and the engine info, Troy! It sounds like it's a beast...

Wow! That is my car and I think after reading this I am being stupid.  I am reconsidering selling and I will raise the price in a few minutes.  This was my first speedster rep so I have had to get used to the craziness.  Some moron from Fresno promised to buy it till his wife scolded him...  ha ha   I may still sell but after seeing this I think I should respect the car a lot more and keep it. thank you guys  by the way it still hauls a$$

 

I had the same question and understanding of the 'butt sag'. I thought it was a problem of the body sagging ON the subframe... not the subrame sagging.

 

Do I have that incorrect? or does the solution above include more than the 'door bars' shown above?

 

Ted

Hello all!! Yes, I'm a lurker.

Ive been toying with the idea of selling my 996 C4s for a couple years now, so I torture myself by perusing speedsters and long hood 912s looking at all the "if I sell my 996 I could...." cars. Still can't seem to pull the trigger. 

John, that is a great car! keep it, or ask more, but don't make me suffer seeing it sold for so little

The reason I put the supports in was to eliminate the 'chatter' from the doors going over bumps, and hoped it would stiffen up the chassis a bit as well. It did both those things better than I'd hoped. Honestly I don't know why the builders don't offer it as an option, but then again they probably build better frames nowadays.

Ted;

 

My thoughts are the same. Gordon and Dr, Clock, et al., have given very specific directions how to solve the butt sag.  So much, that I haven't even tacked mine yet, working on other "more  important fixes".

 

I hope I live long enough to  complete my tasks.

 

  A cool one to all!

Could be that I don't really understand the "butt sag" issue and I assumed that was the reason that Mickey did the modification.  In reading his postings about it, I read this "I think one of the best improvements I made to that car were the frame supports to reduce flex at the rear door gap."  and assumed that the flex at the rear door gap was "butt sag."

Mickey also braced (welded) the frame horns to the substantial rear support frame -which would help traditional rear sag. The traditional approach seems easier and more direct to me.  I do like idea of beefing up the frame horns as I've seen some rusted out from inside out.  The stock horns are fine for 50-80 hp but could see the stress with higher HP.

 

The tubing in the doorways is to increase overall frame stiffness. Intermeccanica does offer this option (I believe). And you can bend the trans frame horns with a stock 1500; just constantly drive the bag out of it for a few thousand miles (you can all guess how I know this- what can I say, I was much younger...). The engineers at Wolfsburg never anticipated people driving these cars in any way other than a civilized, econo car manner, and this is one of the few areas that isn't over-engineered. 

IM does this will all 911 cars, and "some" () lesser 4-cyl cars.

 

Scott Sloan's car had them. My car has them.

Yes, Intermeccanica adds these with certain cars.

 

I really don't know if they are positively necessary, as IM frames are as strong as they come, but perhaps with the larger engines it's a safeguard.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/...et-72157649830760802

Mickey can you tell me about the car?  When you bought and sold.  Was it an older IM build?  Was it a kit that IM sold to a private builder?   I put a new coil in today and it ran great.  I will take it further tomorrow to make sure all is well.  I did raise the price to 16.5k   There are so many overpriced cars and I wanted to put a good price but I guess 13k was too low.  There is some fiberglass on the pan that appears to cover some rust. Hope its not too bad.  Thanks  John   ps car is still awesome and its happy out on the west coast


On Monday, April 13, 2015 5:51 PM, SpeedsterOwners.com <alerts@hoop.la> wrote:


Reply By mickey356: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA== To reply by email, write above this line. == Hello, John Heitman: We're sending you this notification because you are either following the forum, the content, or the author listed below. New Reply To Topic
| Subject: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA Reply By: mickey356 In: Speedsters / Classifieds (For Sale/Wanted) | |

Hello all!! Yes, I'm a lurker. Ive been toying with the idea of selling my 996 C4s for a couple years now, so I torture myself by perusing speedsters and long hood 912s looking at all the "if I sell my 996 I could...." cars. Still can't seem to pull the trigger. John, that is a great car! keep it, or ask more, but don't make me suffer seeing it sold for so little The reason I put the supports in was to eliminate the 'chatter' from the doors going over bumps, and hoped it would stiffen up the chassis a bit as well. It did both those things better than I'd hoped. Honestly I don't know why the builders don't offer it as an option, but then again they probably build better frames nowadays.   View This Reply
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John, i bought the car from a guy in Florida. Flew down and drove it back

It was pretty rough when I bought it. The guy selling it didn't know much but I recall him saying it was made by a company in California, in 1979, I think? Anyway, I didn't really concern myself with who or where it was made because I always wanted one and now (then) I had it. There was no documentation with the car, I think it was titled as a VW in fla. inquiring on here, and the stamped rear deck hinges left me to believe it was an old IM, and I still have no reason to believe otherwise. If it's import to a potential buyer, I'd tell him what I told you and let him make the call. I think I may have even reached out to Henry about it at one time and he had no way of knowing, but don't hold me to that, it's been a few years, and a few cars and bikes ago. 

As for the fiberglass patches... There were a few small hole in the floor that I cut out all the rust, riveted and sealed aluminum patches, and glassed for a little more protection. I don't recall them being much more than a few inches. I also POR-15'd the pans on the inside and out. 

As for when I bought it....2007-2008? I remember it was in the spring though  

I completely redid everything on that car from paint to suspension to engine and trans...new top seats, carpet.....on and on. I wanted it to resemble a 59 Carrera GT. I even got a vintage turn signal switch and fake knobs to complete the interior. 

Im glad you bumped the price. It's still a steal at $16,500. I regret selling it all the time, but that's nothing new to me, I regret selling any toys

I hope this helps. There should be a pretty good record on here as to dates, what was done, etc...in my user file. These folks were a massive help and helped me through all of it with their knowledge. Feel free to reach out to me anytime.

Wow 1979!  You did a great job the car still looks incredible and I keep it running.  Just put a new coil in and gonna drive it for a few hours tomorrow.  Have you ever driven a "real" 356 of the same style?  Im always curious as to how different they really feel.  I have carved a few curvey roads and the car handles good but not sure how much those little pizza cutters tires can stand.  I may have a shop look at the upper mounts of the rear shocks because they seem to be out of line with the swing axles.  I had the rear shocks replaced because they were actually wearing when they were making contact with the swing axle.  Remember how the shocks sit real low down in the swing arms.    One day a guy approached me and he had an older guy, maybe 80, sitting in his car.  He said it was his dad and he used to work on Porsches for 30 years and he wanted to see more of the car.  I was in a hurry but thought later that was so cool and I should have taken him for a ride.  You built a cool car and its still out there getting a lot of attention.  Thanks for the info  John


On Tuesday, April 14, 2015 5:59 PM, SpeedsterOwners.com <alerts@hoop.la> wrote:


Reply By mickey356: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA== To reply by email, write above this line. == Hello, John Heitman: We're sending you this notification because you are either following the forum, the content, or the author listed below. New Reply To Topic
| Subject: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA Reply By: mickey356 In: Speedsters / Classifieds (For Sale/Wanted) | |

John, i bought the car from a guy in Florida. Flew down and drove it back It was pretty rough when I bought it. The guy selling it didn't know much but I recall him saying it was made by a company in California, in 1979, I think? Anyway, I didn't really concern myself with who or where it was made because I always wanted one and now (then) I had it. There was no documentation with the car, I think it was titled as a VW in fla. inquiring on here, and the stamped rear deck hinges left me to believe it was an old IM, and I still have no reason to believe otherwise. If it's import to a potential buyer, I'd tell him what I told you and let him make the call. I think I may have even reached out to Henry about it at one time and he had no way of knowing, but don't hold me to that, it's been a few years, and a few cars and bikes ago. As for the fiberglass patches... There were a few small hole in the floor that I cut out all the rust, riveted and sealed aluminum patches, and glassed for a little more protection. I don't recall them being much more than a few inches. I also POR-15'd the pans on the inside and out. As for when I bought it....2007-2008? I remember it was in the spring though  I completely redid everything on that car from paint to suspension to engine and trans...new top seats, carpet.....on and on. I wanted it to resemble a 59 Carrera GT. I even got a vintage turn signal switch and fake knobs to complete the interior. Im glad you bumped the price. It's still a steal at $16,500. I regret selling it all the time, but that's nothing new to me, I regret selling any toys I hope this helps. There should be a pretty good record on here as to dates, what was done, etc...in my user file. These folks were a massive help and helped me through all of it with their knowledge. Feel free to reach out to me anytime.   View This Reply
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John- I think you'll find a swing axle replica with smaller mild engine and fairly narrow tires feels and drives very similar to an original. You mentioned the rear shocks seeming to not line up with the mounts- could the axle tubes be on the wrong sides? Swapping them could cause what I think you're describing, and iIrc (it's been a very long time since I worked on a swing axle trans) they will mount on either side.

Hey John,

I do recall having some issue with getting the rear shocks to line up better. I think I ended up using a short "hot rod / rat rod" shock, and they were still a bit close. That said I'm sure it wouldn't be too difficult to get new upper mounts welding on to better align things back there. 

I have driven a few originals. Aside from the awesomeness of driving a piece of history there isn't much to them. your car, and likely most cars on here are better in all areas. I did have the pleasure of driving a 59 Carrera Coupe that was sorted for vintage racing and that was fun, to say the least. . 

Tires.....unfortunately it comes down to aesthetics versus performance. I had a wider lower profile on it but it looked ridiculous. If you were inclined, you could source a set of custom made wheels that would still give you the wheel well clearance and an offset to take a wider tire. 

He probably means swing ARMS, not axles. It's an IRS car.

I was talking about swing axle replicas in general, Mickey (for some reason I thought his car was the earlier suspension). I was also going to say that an irs car handles and rides much nicer, but taking care of kids prevented me from adding that last bit, and I never did get back to the post in time to add/edit.

Thank you again Mickey, I drove a bit today with the new coil and the car ran great.  There is a group meeting (San Luis Obisbo) in June just about an hour from my house.  I will try to show up as I think meeting other replica owners will help me keep the mojo.  I will take the car to a local hot rod builder to see about repositioning upper shock mounts and I was thinking of some newer seats.  Something newer and something that doesn't detract from the great Porsche look.  You set it up nice so theres not much to change just maintain


On Wednesday, April 15, 2015 10:09 AM, SpeedsterOwners.com <alerts@hoop.la> wrote:


Reply By mickey356: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA== To reply by email, write above this line. == Hello, John Heitman: We're sending you this notification because you are either following the forum, the content, or the author listed below. New Reply To Topic
| Subject: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA Reply By: mickey356 In: Speedsters / Classifieds (For Sale/Wanted) | |

Hey John,I do recall having some issue with getting the rear shocks to line up better. I think I ended up using a short "hot rod / rat rod" shock, and they were still a bit close. That said I'm sure it wouldn't be too difficult to get new upper mounts welding on to better align things back there. I have driven a few originals. Aside from the awesomeness of driving a piece of history there isn't much to them. your car, and likely most cars on here are better in all areas. I did have the pleasure of driving a 59 Carrera Coupe that was sorted for vintage racing and that was fun, to say the least. . Tires.....unfortunately it comes down to aesthetics versus performance. I had a wider lower profile on it but it looked ridiculous. If you were inclined, you could source a set of custom made wheels that would still give you the wheel well clearance and an offset to take a wider tire.    View This Reply
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No worries, ALB, I just wanted to clarify. 

 

John, by all means go meet the crew at San Louis Obisbo....awesome group of people. Look for Troy and Terry to name just two guys who know their $#*+ about these cars. I'm sure there are others too, and the rest of them....some I've met, some I feel like I have...but all good folks. You'll have fun with them.

glad you're enjoying the car, and it's still catching looks. If Id of sold my 996 I'd be heading out there to get it back  

Still kicking myself in the ass for caving to the wife a couple years back on one of Troys cars :-/ 

Mickey  I am having an issue with the car temporarily losing power after it is warmed up.  Im fairly certain its electrical.  I did replace the coil but same problem.  The engine runs good except for that issue.  Did you have this problem?  thanks  John
  From: SpeedsterOwners.com <alerts@hoop.la>
To: John Heitman <johnny1x62@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2015 1:24 PM
Subject: Reply By mickey356: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA

Reply By mickey356: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA== To reply by email, write above this line. == Hello, John Heitman: We're sending you this notification because you are either following the forum, the content, or the author listed below. New Reply To Topic
| Subject: Calif Red Speedster $13k on SAMBA Reply By: mickey356 In: Speedsters / Classifieds (For Sale/Wanted) | |

No worries, ALB, I just wanted to clarify.  John, by all means go meet the crew at San Louis Obisbo....awesome group of people. Look for Troy and Terry to name just two guys who know their $#*+ about these cars. I'm sure there are others too, and the rest of them....some I've met, some I feel like I have...but all good folks. You'll have fun with them.glad you're enjoying the car, and it's still catching looks. If Id of sold my 996 I'd be heading out there to get it back  Still kicking myself in the ass for caving to the wife a couple years back on one of Troys cars :-/    View This Reply
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Sorry John, never had that problem that I recall but it definitely  sounds like a timing issue. Of course it's hard to be specific but it's best to check all ignition factors from points, wires, plugs etc.... you replaced the coil, was this issue there before you did? If so it sounds like something maybe overheating the coil.