Clutch cable

I believe my clutch cable is too short, and JPS is going to send me a longer one. First, I'll say why I think there is trouble: the friction point on the pedal is very high, and I don't like that. When I went to adjust, found the threaded aft end captured at the throw out arm w/ a large wing nut that was grabbing just the last couple of threads -- no adjustment left. Also, there would appear to be tension from the clutch spring on the cable in its current condition. [Side note: This does not strike me as the right way to do this, so whoever put this togethr must have had to push on the TO lever in order to get the wing nut to start. Would this be a construction fault? A QC problem?] Anyway, I am looking to replace the cable w/ a longer one, that John Steele said he would send. Any tips out there for how to remove the one there, and fish the new one in? How is that done? And am I right to think that when installing a correct length cable, the threaded end should reach and exceed the TO lever eye by a little so the wing nut can be easily engaged and then honked down to the right place. Secondary question: I understand that there are hydraulic systems available (EMPI?) and has anybody refit one of these w/ good results? What's involved w/ that? I am betting there are old threads here that will tell all . . .

Kelly,
All the "shortened" clutch cables for replica speedsters are the same and come from a VS supplier?
Take a look at the black rubber Bowden tube, it's suppose to have some radius bend (1" -1-1/4" or so) to avoid clutch chatter, too much radius and you'll have a clutch cable that is too short.....Just maybe your fix?

R & I:
Unscrew the cable wing nut, remove the Bowden tube support clamp from the trans case and pull it off the cable, remove the two 17mm pedal assembly bolts (you'll have the rotate the clutch arm rearward for it to clear the tunnel hole and release the cable off the arm them pull the cable out and slide it through a rag as you go as it should have grease on it.

Apply grease as you feed the replacement cable into the clutch tube, you'll have to work it through the Bowden tube...it can be a tight fit. Hook the cable eye onto the clutch arm and bolt it to the tunnel (Be sure to not allow the clutch pedal arm to travel rearward or it will come off the pedal hook...(I wire it in place)
Reattach the Bowden tube bracket to the trans and adjust the clutch w/ 3/8" to 1/2" of freeplay.

I recently installed a hydraulic clutch system I got from Aircooled.com. It's made by German Auto/Saco in Santa Fe Springs, CA. They are great people to deal with...I had some problems and Aircooled couldn't help much. The unit is not a simple bolt-on since it is installed inside the tunnel, but it does seem to work fine...thus far. You have to cut a door in the tunnel to work in. I'm not sure which is worse, working inside the tunnel or cutting a big hole through the 1/2" steel arch at the front "firewall" to install the EMPI style. I'm sure each has it's advantages. Anyway, it does eliminate cable problems...or trades them for others I have yet to experience.

Alan,

Very good step-by-step -- thanks. As it happens, I went w/ Cory over to a local VW shop (Peeks??) last night (in the Hoopty!) and took a minute to talk w/ fellow there about how-to. He had a loose pedal ass'y on the shelf and showed me some of the hardware, explained about how he does it. Mentioned the cable dropping off thing. You use wire and I had thought of duct tape. Fellow at Peeks said he approaches the problem as a two man job, because he can. Me, I'm on my own, so wiring up makes some sense to me. I do not think that a little extra curvature (there does not seem to be any in my path from rear tunnel to trans.) would explain the profound lack of length here. In any event, JPS said a new longer cable is on the way. How he knows what length to make it is a mystery yet to be explained. He made the one in there now, so what is going to be different? We'll see.

Meanwhile, do you have any experience w/ the hydraulic clutch alternative?

....hydraulic clutch alternative?
Only in one car helping a friend in a dirt track machine,to be honest I didn't really know what I was doing...these are greek to me.

And so the rest of the story:

Being tired of having the friction point on my clutch being right up at the last 1/2 inch of the pedal, and also tired of JPS telling me that that was just fine, I went and got another cable made a bit longer. Pics below show the original cable and how it fails to reach the lever in the back.

Very descriptive pics, Kelly. I take it the new one works like a champ?

And so I went to find a cable just right. The guys at locashracing (lester?) will make custom cables. Had a bit of trouble raising them on the internet (they offer no phone to call) and so being impetuous, and tired of not driving my new ride, I went elswhere. Turns out that the other hobby where steel wire cables w/ threaded fittings are needed, to any size at all, is sail boats, and we have a ton of those here in Annapolis. This tip was offered up by Dave at Peeks in Lanham. Found a marine shop (West Marine) willing to apply their parts/tools to the job. So bought an OEM bug cable (way too long, of course) and took it to the sail rigger and said what length I wanted [Turns out this length is 77 3/4 in., in case anyone needs to know]. He sewdged on a SS threaded end, that was 1/4-28, I do belive, but onto which the VW wing nut seemed to fit just fine. That wing-nut thread is 7x1.0 metric, which comes to 0.275-25 in english units -- sorta close to 1/4-28. Anyway, the cable was installed and the clutch set right, but the thread did not hold well enough: threaded male end a bit to small for the larger female wing nut thread. So I put a 1/4-28 nylock at the end, since now I have enough thread to work w/ at the rear end. The deed is done. Friction point is now down at the end of the pedal, where I like it better. May get locashracing to make up a proper metric threaded end, so can have this for next time I need one. Or might see if the sailing guys make metric, and have that ordered.

PS: JPS says one reason why the distance may be a bit more than "normal" is the use of the tube chassis front end, wherein the particulars at the front are not from the VW pan. The pedals get mounted a bit forward, it seems, which is a good thing, but means cable must be longer too.

I've been following these posts (red car, green car) and seeing the clutch cable pic this morning I have to wonder what John was thinking...
To offer up reasons why the cable was short rather than provide a remedy before delivery is disappointing.



I hope your car(s) becomes a pleasure to own and drive soon

Paul, despite the JPS Q/C issues (of which there are many), I have never once regretted buying this car. And driving it is becoming more of a kick each day, as I learn more about how it works, and become confident that it will keep working. The engine is very strong, and can push me through the turns faster than I know how to go. So far, have not gotten close to swapping ends, which I think speaks to the sticky tires, IRS and HD sway bars. This little scooter is stuck pretty well to the road. All of my issues have dimmed my enthusiasm a little in the initial going, and have taken the car off-line for fix-its more than I would like. But we (JPS and I) are getting there. Actually have driven it to work now two whole days in a row!! Whoo-hoo. Took delivery 7/31, so really have had the thing just a little more than a month. When all issues have been dealt with, I have promised to post up (It's Red) the list of issues and how resolved.

My perspective was formed by buying blind, learning the ropes the hard way, then spending an eternity talking to people while trying to sell my car.

I don't recommend "right-out-of-the-box" Vintage because of what I learned on my car. Instead I have referred folks to John at JPS when price was an issue. Hearing your combined stories is like getting buddy-fucked even though I'm not vested in JPS.

I'm glad to hear you're beginning to stack some miles on your car... FWIW, I think these cars will roll-over before they swap ends. Be careful

Kelley:

I went the same route to get my clutch cables fab'd a few years back - found a rigger in Rhode Island who took my original VW cable and cut it to the same dimensions as you provided. The only difference was that he swedged ona new end with the same metric threads as the original. ALL of the sailboats coming from Europe (Beneteau's, etc) are metric so your rigger should have had the right end in stock, but I guess next time.

Now that you know what to get and where to get it and you've discovered that your cable is unique, better go back and get another one made to carry as a spare.

gn

Gordon: So NOW you tell me??! I had to discover the sail rigging option for myself. But as you say: now I have it calibrated, and so know where to go and how to get it done. I WILL be getting a spare. PS: the refitting of the hex bar pivots to heim joints a la Gordon-Pip is coming to the top of my list. You had said something about a parts list, or a source for the fittings themselves. What about all of that??

Paul, FWIW the source of most of my aggravation about John Steele has not been so much about the car, per se, but about the level of BS he seems incapable of stemming. He is way too set on telling me (and others too, I'd guess) what it is he thinks I want to hear, vs. the actual truth. The list of promised actions that have gone for naught, or backwards, is really long, not the least of which is the constant reassurance from Day 1 of the build that he and his fellows always run each car a few hundred miles to be sure everything is set just right. Well, that just plain did not happen w/ my car, and it shows in all sorts of places. More recently for example, he says he'll send me a part overnight, and it leaves CA two days later via 2-day overland. For me, it's a credibility issue, and so I have adopted a ploicy that whatever he tells me he is going to do, I just figure it may or may not happen like he says. I hate doing business this way, but what choice is there? My job is to hold his feet to the fire (much like Dewalt is doing) and get to the end of the issues sooner or later. It's like he really is not paying full attention, although he is the easiest guy in the world to talk to on the phone.

Kelley:

John Steele sounds like the guy that painted Pearl; GREAT guy to talk with on the phone with PLENTY of promises, but it STILL took him about 1-1/2 YEARS to paint the damn car!!

I think Tom DeWalt is doing the right thing, as it keeps the responsibility for finishing the car to his satisfaction with JPS Motorsports, even though I know that Alan, Bill, Jim Sartwell or I could have fixed all of Tom's punch list in a couple of days. That would have fixed the immediate problem, but it let's John Steele off the hook so he can just turn and walk away from the problems HE created (and just keep right on doing them on his next cars). It is also the right thing to do to make Tom's (and yours) issues and their resolution very public on this and other forums so that everyone knows what's going on and getting (or not getting) fixed. If he does a great job, everyone knows about it. If he doesn't do a great job or leaves things hanging, then everyone knows THAT too. Makes dealing with him in the future a lot easier for all of us, doesn't it?

On the throttle linkage conversion kit, I have a couple of sets of parts here in Beaufort, and will be sourcing everything but the Heim joints locally this week. I like the source I have for the Aurora Heim Joints (back in NE) and they can deliver in a week or less so I'll stick with them unless I find something around here comparable.

The kit includes:

(2) 5mm Aurora Heim Hoints (Male 5/16-24 mounting stud unless female is specified)
(2) 5/16" X 2" Hex Bar extensions
(2) 1/8" X 5/8" Tension Pins
(2) 5/16" ID X 3/8" OD X .75" Spacers
(2) 3/8" OD X 1-1/2" Centering Springs

Let me know when you're ready and I'll send along what I need for final dimensions to set up a kit for you.

gn

Gordon: I suppose I'll be driviong the car as the Fall season is upon us, don't you know. The doing of this will come along when I am so motivated -- on a rainy day, I guess. I would like to get my head wrapped around exactly what I am goin to be doing, and have the parts lined up, so when I decide to go, I'll be ready. If I sent you a nice picture of my set-up now (very ordinary for dual Webers, as far as I can tell), maybe you can say what choices I need to make for part types, etc.

Back to the original post.... My clutch cable also was to short. The end of the threaded portion just reached the forward portion of the clutch release arm. I made a coupling by using two different diameters of brake line. I cut about 1-1/4" of each, then press fitting one into the other. I used a metric tap to internally thread the inner piece of tubing. I then cut most of the threaded end of the cable, leaving about 1/2" of threaded rod remaining attached to the cable. Screwed the coupling onto this, and added the remaining end of the original cut off piece of threaded shaft to the other end of the coupling. Lengthened the cable about 1".

Brian: I am told that anything short of a truly swedged in fitment will work loose eventually. Your solution sounds pretty good, however. Youi can get the real deal from locashracing.com (lester) for $35.00 ppd., says here.

Or.....you could order a new cable, cut to correct speedster length with a proper, VW (metric) swedged end, from VS for about $25

I thought I could beat their price, so I bought a new, stock length VW cable from a foreign parts place locally ($8 bucks) then got it cut and a new, metric end swedged on at Bay riggers in RI ($15 bucks) so I saved a whopping 2 bucks under VS.

Of course, I didn't have to pay shipping, but drove my pickup over there which prob'ly cost me $5 bucks in gas............and a Chai Tea from Dunkin Donuts along the way.........

I also looked into locating a with vendors that could do the clutch cable swedge, I also heard the same $15 a pop tune so I also passed on that avenue. Then then talked to my machine shop friend "Randy the Magician" asking if he could make me a dye that I could manually operate with a long leverage bar.....he muttered something about 2.5 tons of force would be needed, again I passed.