CMC Wide Body Wheels - Request for help

Bill I as had mentioned love the way your looks. Is this why you chose 16 x 6 and 7 since they rub instead of 16 7 and 8. 7 in the front will rub.

I do plan to lower the car and was probably not going with 17’s




This message was sent via mobile device. Please excuse any grammatical or spelling errors.


> On Jan 6, 2018, at 7:31 AM, SpeedsterOwners.com <**************> wrote:
>
>

Thanks to both for response. I was checking out empi and samba on 16 x 7 and 8 but I love the deep dish look which is not offered on 16.  

Do you guys know or have seen 16 with deep dish?  

 

IRS

Calmotion:  All I'm familiar with for 16" Fuchs rims are the original Porsche rims for 911/930/944 cars.  All of the 16" 944 rims that I've seen are black anodized spokes, but they come in 6" and 7" rim widths.

The 911/930's were often Black Anodized, but they had their share of polished spokes, too - ALL of the Polished versions in decent shape, ready for clean-up will run you $400 - $1500 EACH.  They used them on 911's and 930 (turbo) cars with widths from 6" to 11", that's it.  Backspacing differed on each.

Here's everything you ever wanted to know about wheels for Porsche.  Just remember that the Porsche bolt pattern is almost unique - Only the Porsche/VW SUV and Audi Q-cars have the same 5 X 130 pattern.  It will probably be cheaper to go to a Chevy bolt pattern on your hubs and aftermarket wheels as Dr. Clock suggested.

https://members.rennlist.com/911pcars/WheelWts.html

Bill

What size tires are you running  on CMC car with the 16'' wheels?

Fuchs wheel chart- you can see how they fit- 

Note- on irs with Beetle drums the 7x15 911R wheel  (with a 205 tire) will not fit unless you have late (single) spring plates and the bolts inserted from the outside. The short bolt that threads into the spring plate will be  put in from the inside and needs to be cut down in length to flush with spring plate.

I think Gordon runs 16's on his flared CMC

 

@Ron I ended up with 7 and 8 with 16. On SAS wide body I got rubbing on all 4 corners. A lot did not get rubbing but i think its due to wheel lug converter /  spacer. 

Tire size was 195 and 205 x 16 

Alan Merklin posted:

I think Gordon runs 16's on his flared CMC

 

Yes, Gordon's running 16's.

Thank you.

Regards
Steve Vacker

RonL posted:

Bill

What size tires are you running  on CMC car with the 16'' wheels?

205/50 front and 225/45 rears (16")

HI It’s a little more complicated than just wheel-tire size.  

I would estimate the width of the CMC flares at 4” or 5”.  Originally, I was running 6” wide rims on the front and 7” wide on the rear with 205/50 X 16 tires front, 225/50 X 16 rear.  Loved the combo but you cannot rotate tires.  🤔

I now run 6” wide rims all around that came from a 911.  All four wheels are spaced outward 1-1/8” with billet, hub-centric spacers (Pelican Parts). I could have used 1-1/4” spacers and still not rub anything.

I went with 16” wheels because I like how they fit the wheel well openings ( they just look good).

Cowards!  17 X 8 All 4 corners!!  

@Jerome Smith love the wheel combo. What is the brand of the wheels and offset. What are the tires size   There has been a lot of discussion here about how hard of a ride the 17 tire give. 

Is the central lock more of demo thanks function?  

@calmotion  Thanks!  I sold the car back in 2008 and was pretty active on here in the old days.  There are probably some old posts with the info you seek.  I would have to rely on my ever failing memory, not advised.

If I remember right they were TSW wheels, can't remember the offset.  I machined my own custom billet wheel spacers.  The center caps are decorative.

Looks like they still make something very similar.  Don't see a 17" size.

My goal was to do the flares justice and fit the widest rubber I could fit.  I remember fabricating a wooden jig that bolted to the face of the drum/rotor that I could use as a datum to measure accurately to the inner fender lip on the outside and any chassis bits on the inside.  I could also use the jig to verify the tire diameter/width throughout the whole suspension travel and lock-to-lock steering travel.

I also remember doing a lot of internet research to find the right combo to fit.  I didn't want to do spacer/adapters but had to go that route.  So the spacer adapters were pretty beefy and precision.

(Been so long that it looks like all my old posts are labeled "FORMER MEMBER" instead of my old account name.  Makes it hard to find stuff.)

 

BTW: "There has been a lot of discussion here about how hard of a ride the 17 tire give."  I didn't buy a Speedster for the ride!  I couldn't feel the bumps over the smile on my face.  Of course that was 15 years ago, and now I get stiff and sore after a hour in my Durango.

Click Here

@Jerome Smith I get it with a big smile / ride. I thought about that decided to stay in the middle. 

A) get it as close to the end of the fender so it’s flush on all four corners without using to wide of Dover/ adaptor. I think balancing get crazy if not hub centric for the adapter / wheel. 

Im debating using 205x 45 as well as 225 x45 16 due to little sidewall. 

Thanks for the info. 

@calmotion  No problem.   If you have any reservations I reallyrrecommend making a jig to  get measurements.  I seem to recall there was about a 1/2" difference on the driver's side vs the passenger side.

FYI: The tires were 245/35's.  I seem to recall some guys squeezing 255's under there.

Good luck!

@Jerome Smith wrote- "Cowards!  17 X 8 All 4 corners!!  "

I'm sure it works (and don't get me wrong, it does look good!), but I can't help but wonder how well the stock front suspension could control a wheel/tire that huge- and what was the turning radius like?

@Gordon Nichols wrote- " Originally, I was running 6” wide rims on the front and 7” wide on the rear with 205/50 X 16 tires front, 225/50 X 16 rear.  Loved the combo but you cannot rotate tires.  🤔"

It's not a commuter car- who the h#ll rotates tires on a hot rod!

This is interesting calculator if you want to compare rims backspace/offset and see impact on how wheel sits in your wheel opening.  I compared a 2L Fuchs 4 bolt with ET40 to the EMPI Fuchs replica with ET45.  Ok would have to redrill/replace rotors/drums to 5 lug bolt pattern but I would gain and added 5mm/.20" to the spacing to the outer wheel well lip (which I have already sanded).  I can probably sell my 4 2L Fuchs for what going to the fake polished Empi Fuchs.

https://www.willtheyfit.com/in...h=5-5&offset2=45

 

@ALB

Believe it or not I felt it handled great.  Tracked straight, no crazy vibration at highway speed.  I had no issues with maneuverability in parking lots etc.  No rubbing at full lock.  I'm sure the larger contact patch made it tougher to steer at low speeds but I never drove a Beetle/356 with narrow tires so I have no frame of reference.

I remember while taking my measurements the back of the wide tire was very close to the same position as a stock VW tire/rim.  This gave me confidence that the that any additional moment load on the spindle was minimal.  I also seem to recall not a big difference in weight between the light weigh aluminum rim and low profile tire and the stock steel wheel and tire.

I still took care to over-design the wheel spacer/adapters for strength, balance, and concentricity.

 

 

"Former Member"   @Jerome Smith wrote: "I machined my own custom billet wheel spacers."  

Sure......   We all do that, dude.   

Seriously, though, Jerome's car always had "the look".  It was just right because he put a LOT of thought into his total execution, and the way the wheels/tires fit the wheel wells was/is just about perfect (even if they looked like the inspiration for SAS wheels - Hey!  Lawing had to get his ideas from someone!)   I took a more traditional approach in going to the 16" wheels on my car and while they looked good, originally they had the black spokes (Jerome probably remembers those).    They look far better with polished spokes against my white car.  

A quick note on Jerome and my ribbing him about the spacers - Jerome is a bit unique in that he is (or at least used to be) a tool design engineer for the plastics industry.  What makes him unique in my mind is that he is an engineer who actually knows how to use machine tools like lathes and milling machines (hence, the home-made spacers).  For those of us "less worthy" there places like Pelican Parts who will make them to order.

Here are Jerome and his brother, Carlisle, 2004, just before Chris and I dusted him out of the stoplight.......  (See Pearl in the reflection of his door, black spokes and all).

And me, detailing Jerome's car at the show field (and I don't even detail my OWN car!)

Say HI! to your brother for us, Jerome!

 

@Gordon Nichols@Jerome Smith OK now it make sense. Someone creating the spacer was a task and that explains the how to steps take 👍👏😎😇

I know this is an old thread, but I hoped to get some advice from you all on wheels and spacers after reading your helpful responses.  I am a VW guy (‘66 Ghia and ‘74 Thing) who stumbled into your wonderful world of 356 replicas by finding a partially completed 1991 CMC Classic Speedster C Widebody for sale in my town.  It sits on a chopped standard 1969 Beetle chassis with a 1973 dual port 1600cc motor and all of the interior, trim, etc is sitting in original unopened boxes and packaging from 1991.  It has the unused original gold/chrome star wheels that I plan to immediately replace with some widened chrome wide-5 steel wheels with which I can use either half moon or nipple Porsche hubcaps just like the silver CMC in the photo below (not my car).   Who makes these?   I would be interested in 6 or 7 inch widths in 15’s if possible and appropriate spacers so they fill the fenders.  Help!

Where are you located Mitch?  When I had my Manx, I had a company in California make me some 8” wide 5’s. Easily found via google.

Didn’t cost much more than the stock width from all the usual suspects. But chrome would be an additional charge on top of that if that’s what you’re looking for. I got mine in primer because I painted them red.

Thanks dlearl476.   I am in Idaho but would love even 6” depth wide-5 15” wheels if I could also figure out what width of spacers to order as well.  Who would you recommend I contact in California for wheels like that as well as the spacers that would fit them as well as 1969 Beetle wide-5 lugs?  here’s my car so you can see the spacing with stock VW wheels.

6" wide Wide Fives are pretty common. Most of the VW suppliers sell them. The beauty of a custom wheel is they can make it any offset you want i.e. No spacers needed.

I think ink the place I used was Stockton Wheel, but if it's not, I'm sure they could recommend someone.

Here's a guy on TheSamba that makes custom widths, but they're pricey. Like I said, the ones I got for my Manx were about the same price as regular wheels.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/cl...etail.php?id=1172589

This is what 6"&8" looks like.

Hey guys, it’s been awhile since I asked my question about deep wheels for my CMC wide body.  I got a hold of U.S. Wheel and they agreed to custom build me wide-5 15x7 or 15x8 chrome OEM style wheels for cheap ($120 each).  I planned to use nipple style Porsche hubcaps.  

so my question once again would be, if I don’t use any spacers, would you recommend 15x7 on the front and 15x8 on the rear?   Or 15x7 on all 4?

Sounds like Gordon Nichols is using 6inch depth with 1 1/8” spacers all around.

I am.

I had 16" X 7" with a 2" dish on the rear and 225/50 tires, and 16" X 6" with a 1" dish on the front with 205/50 tires to clear the fender lip without rubbing and everything seemed to fit.

Since then I've gone to 16" X 6" with 205s all around for simplicity and gained a little space at the rear.

Good for you for finding US Wheel.  Very Cool Shop.

Mitch, what sizes are those gold star wheels? Spacers/No spacers is a question of offset as well as width. If I were you, I'd go to a Mexican tire shop and have them mount some appropriate $5-$10 used tires on those gold stars, then measure the heck out of your stock wheels and the gold stars and figure out the offset and width you need to fill your wheel wells.

Since you're starting with custom built wheels, I would strongly advise avoiding spacers. If you notice the wheels on the Manx I posted, almost all of the additional width is on the outside. Same with the wheels I had made for my Manx. All the extra width was on the outside so it didn't impact my turning circle. With your car, you have the luxury of having them made in any offset you like.

Gordon, when you had 7” rear wheels with 225/50R16’’s and 6” fronts with 205/50/R16’s, we’re you using any spacers to push those wheels out towards the edge of the fenders?  I should be OK with 7’s up front without spacers (the stock wheels are 7’s) but I’m trying to understand if I could get away with 8’s in the rear  without spacers.  Any photos of your old set up?  Thank you!

Yeah, I was running 1-1/8" thick spacers all around.  The wheels (both 6" and 7") were dished to the outside and the spacers got them out to the fender lip where they looked "right".  The rear was much closer to the fender than the front.

You can do the same thing Dave suggests by setting a 18"/24" carpenter's square against the part of the wheel hub where the rim attaches, then go up to the point equal to where the fender lip is and measure that horizontal distance across.  That's the max space you have for wheel + tire width (outside of the tire) to the inside of the fender, then subtract another 1/4" - 3/8" for "running space".  

You can measure how far the tire on your DD sticks out beyond the rim - Just place the carpenter's square across the wheel and measure the distance to the rim lip and I'll bet it'll be about the same on your new wheels and tires.  Alternatively, you could mount your chosen tire on a similar width rim to see what the outside tire "pooch" depth is.  Subtract that amount from the distance you got just above, of the max space you have for wheel + tire width and add another 1/4" - 3/8" for running space.  That is where the outer rim lip has to be, measured from where the rim mounts to the hub/drum.  

Next, measure from the hub/drum inward to the outside surface of the spring plate and subtract the same amount of tire width you got from your DD, then subtract another 1/4" - 3/8" (your choice) as "running space".

Take or email all those measurements to your wheel builder and they can build a set of wheels to fit your car.

Many thanks.  That’s the best explanation I’ve read and exactly the steps I needed to know.  This is a great group.