Considering JPS Coupe. Seeking Guidance.

Any AirCooled VW shop will do. Look for your local "Bug Club"

JPS builds nice cars. They all seem to have problems initially. I saw the car you're talking about - it's a nice looking one but I didn't drive it.

I would call Vintage Motor Cars. They are active on this forum and have a good reputation.

Thank you.  I spoke with Greg at Vintage and he kindly answered all my questions.  Just thought I would try and get some additional insight from the community.  

Chris

Oh, you will.  But it's a quite week around here, be patient. You could get a head start by searching for JPS, the search bar is on the top of the page.

Art

You have two  aircooled vw clubs in Albuquerque that you may want to connect with. They will know the aircooled mechanics in the area and should be a good source for local info.

1. Albuquerque Air Alliance / Rte. 66 Aircooled VW Club

2. So-Low VW Club

The first has an interactive forum site with a wide variety of topics.

Greg and Alex at Vintage Spyders are a couple of good guys.  I imagine they have fixed whatever they could find wrong with the JPS that was fixable.

Based on the stories I have heard from guys I trust, I would be hesitant to buy a new JPS straight from the manufacturer because there seems to be significant quality control issues. 

That being said, I would consider one that has gone through a thorough refurbishing by Greg and his guys. You might ask them, if you haven't already, what issues they found and what they fixed.

Thanks for sourcing the VW clubs Bob. Great idea and I'll definitely reach out. 

Chris:  As has been mentioned, JPS has a looooooong past of questionable mechanical quality on the cars that they build, and follow up delivery with some tacit customer support in the form of paying for people in the customer's area to fix things post delivery.

On the other hand, some of us have seen quite a long list of things that Vintage Motorcars did on that particular car to make is customer-worthy.  I was impressed both in their thoroughness and their attention to detail.  Based on that (and if I had the money!) I think the car they are offering is far from the usual JPS quality and worthy of a serious consideration.

Good luck in your quest.  That's a pretty nice car.

Chris,

Hello. I test drove that car and almost bought it. My wish list of additional cosmetics was too large and it would've been another project post purchase. Greg and Alex are good guys. Go for it if you can. Here's a pic you haven't seen.

Wow, great to know Julio.  My schedule just won't allow me to get out there anytime soon so it's nice to hear from someone who actually test drove it, especially a 356 enthusiast.  Any other impressions you can give...exterior/interior cosmetics, driveability, build quality, etc?  What are the things you would have changed or added?

Mechanical, nothing major. The low gears are too short so that was to be modified. The 2332 type 1 engine is a beast for that little car. Fuchs for wheels and everything else cosmetic. Billet pedals, rear reflectors, Nardi 360mm wheel, and a bunch of other personalized stuff probably unnecesary but that I like. That said, I would make the trip and sit in it/drive it. Don't know your body build, but I'm 6'0" 220 and could barely fit in the car, hence the smaller wheel request.  The car is well sorted with low miles. Not crazy about the speakers in the back seat, but owner did not want holes on the body which is respectable.

good luck with your decision.

Thanks for the feedback.  I'm a slender build at 5'10" 160 so fit shouldn't be a problem. I'm with you on the pedals as that's one of the first things I would want to change and the rear speakers and most likely the stereo in general will have to go.  Thx for the info.

I think David Stround may have a VW/AC place in Albuquerque. David?

'

Hot Damn...we're  good Rich . Of about 150 business cards strewn around at the top of my desk and filtering down only about 20 gets me the right one....

Suzanne has all this stuff on file somewhere but she was too tired to look it up and post it. 

Foreign aide Inc.

1800 San Pedro N.E.

Albuquerque, Nm   cell 505 450 2350    or

505-255-9417    ask for Paul Crespin.     He treated us very well, was knowledgeable and gave us no BS fair treatment.    He knows aircooled very well and doesn't care if it as speedster, van or bug.    A real straight shooter.   paulcresp@gmail.com

You've got a good memory, Rich...   :-)  That was 2011.  

Thank you gents.  I know of Foreign Aide but referrals always go a long way.  Thanks for the info!

Chris,

All the things Julio mentioned are easy fixes except for the Fuchs. Personally I like the old school as well a authentic look of the wide fives which that car has. If you like the car then work a deal with Greg to change the transaxle ratios.

If you're serious then ask for many detailed photos - IMO if you like the color combo then you won't find a nicer coupe with a 2332. It's got the right engine - with the right gears that car would be sooo fun to drive.

Greg is currently doing some work on my car. Yesterday he let me drive a Spyder with the gear ratio that I am interested in. The ratio I'm talking about is a 3.11 1st, 1.93 2nd, 1.21, 3rd, and .89 4th with a 3.44 R&P. The car I drove yesterday had a 3.88 R&P but I am going with a 3.44. With the 2332 motor a transaxle setup like that is perfectly spaced out for the larger displacement engine. Remember there is no replacement for displacement. Sorry you fellas with your short tranny's & small engines this is just something you won't understand until you try it. Kind of like once you go black you cant go back!!

Seriously Chris the stock vw transaxles were designed for a much smaller engine and that is why the stock gearing is so low. I suppose if you are into drag racing with a lot of stoplight to stoplight punch then the stock setup is right for you. If you like the gears stretched out for nice acceleration and space between shifts but still perfect for a curvy road then get the setup above. Just my 2 bits.

Thanks Rusty.  I appreciate the input.  As mentioned, I'm not mechanically inclined so getting this kind of info is very helpful.  My driving intentions are definitely Sunday curvy roads with nice acceleration and not to hammer on the car from light to light.  I'll reach out to Greg and see if he can make your recommended changes prior to shipping.

Chris,

Get the car with the trans mod and whatever other light mods you prefer.  That way we can compare notes at Carlisle when I get mine delivered next year. This group is 'lite' on the Coupes only represented by Jim Kelly's SAS suby powered this year.  Greg can do anything you ask him too within reason but you have to buy the car first and pay for the add ons. Hopefully it works out for you.  Another cosmetic was to change the power window buttons to billeted as per this photo, they will look way better than the black ones it has now.

Great point Julio and that was my thought as well.  Who has the best accessory site out there to research add-on's?

It's the SOC if you haven't noticed yet...No better source of info for this hobby than here. 

I'd say add-ons are pretty custom - check Sierra Madre though.

You surely won't find many used Coupes for sale - maybe 1 or 2 per year.  So if it's close to what you are looking for - go for it before its gone.  

Rusty- 3.44x3.11 is hugely long, and for anything but flat ground will be a pain at idle speeds (and just above). If you compare final drive numbers (r&p x 1st gear)- stock VW 1600 (3.88x3.78) is 14.6,(which, I agree, is short for a bigger engine'd car when performance off the line isn't a priority) where (as far as I've found) most 356 final drives in 1st gear were in the 14.1- 13.7 range (there is 1 combo - 4.375x2.90, that gives a 12.6 final drive, but as far as I've read it was more for just getting the car moving for road racing). 3.44 x 3.11= 10.69; as I said before, that's long!

The 3.44 r&p/3.78 1st combo, which a lot of guys like in a Speedster, gives a 13.0 final drive, and at 900rpm (idle or just off) you're already doing 5-6 mph. Stock 1st-4th gear spacing with the 3.44 gives great highway speeds! (don't ask me for help with the tickets) and is really close to what was in the Spyder (without the expense of the custom mainshaft/gear set). Going with the 3.88/3.11 gives a 12.0 final drive, and a member here (Trevor?) says it's perfect. Any longer and parking lots and hilly areas (where do you live?) will be hard on the clutch.  Remember, a Spyder is a much lighter car (25? 30%?) than a Speedster, and what feels right in the Spyder won't necessarily translate straight across into a Speedster. What are you trying to achieve with this?

Don't get me wrong; if you're sure that's what you want to do, then great. Just be sure. Al

Hi Folks,

Just got in and gathering my thoughts.  A little known thing about us is that a big part of out business is service, upgrade, repairing, accident/insurance repair and sorting out of other builders cars. 

This particular car is owned buy a meticulous owner that addressed and upgraded any issues the cars had.  We have experienced pretty much all the same issues with JPS cars and know what to look for.  The car was fully inspected, test driven and evaluated to what it all needed and all was at taken care of. 

JPS makes beautiful cars and are above average in aesthetics and is a great platform.  Not sure why they neglect certain mechanical issues as after we are done with them they are great cars and should have been done that way from the get go.  Every customer that drives the car after we have gone through them is amazed of the transformation of performance and reliability.   

Lets get to value.  Not sure what the average cost of a coupe is new from JPS, but most need an added $5k of sorting out.  Add that to the initial price vs. what the asking price is for the car now and do the math at the savings, not to mention the joy of having a car done right.

This car has a 2332 full flowed with external filter and oil cooler, pro street tans by Ranch, 4 wheel disc brakes, leather interior, Vintages Speeds shifter, heated seats, AC, Sirius radio, elec window washer.  And, newly replaced complete front German beam with all new ball joints, tie rods, torsion springs, sway bar with urethane bushings, and performance KYB shocks.  Front and rear suspension has been aligned and torsion set to performance standards  New Kenedy performance clutch with German disc and throw-out bearing, new engines seals, upgraded trans mounts and performance supports, new brake master cylinder with correct master for 4 wheel disc brakes, new brake lines, new wheel bearings.  The list just goes on and on.  The car drives and handles so nice. 

At our shop we removed all the running gear (motor, trans, and all supports and mounts) removed all the suspension (complete front beam, and rear torsion plates and bars), removed complete brake system, and reassembled all of  it as it should be.  

This car is a killer deal for anyone that is looking for a coupe. 

ALB posted:

Rusty- 3.44x3.11 is hugely long, and for anything but flat ground will be a pain at idle speeds (and just above). If you compare final drive numbers (r&p x 1st gear)- stock VW 1600 (3.88x3.78) is 14.6,(which, I agree, is short for a bigger engine'd car when performance off the line isn't a priority) where (as far as I've found) most 356 final drives in 1st gear were in the 14.1- 13.7 range (there is 1 combo - 4.375x2.90, that gives a 12.6 final drive, but as far as I've read it was more for just getting the car moving for road racing). 3.44 x 3.11= 10.69; as I said before, that's long!

The 3.44 r&p/3.78 1st combo, which a lot of guys like in a Speedster, gives a 13.0 final drive, and at 900rpm (idle or just off) you're already doing 5-6 mph. Stock 1st-4th gear spacing with the 3.44 gives great highway speeds! (don't ask me for help with the tickets) and is really close to what was in the Spyder (without the expense of the custom mainshaft/gear set). Going with the 3.88/3.11 gives a 12.0 final drive, and a member here (Trevor?) says it's perfect. Any longer and parking lots and hilly areas (where do you live?) will be hard on the clutch.  Remember, a Spyder is a much lighter car (25? 30%?) than a Speedster, and what feels right in the Spyder won't necessarily translate straight across into a Speedster. What are you trying to achieve with this?

Don't get me wrong; if you're sure that's what you want to do, then great. Just be sure. Al

All very good information Al. I think over the years you have seen me comment on these gear ratio threads the most! After putting the 3.44 R&P in my car I still disliked 1st with a great disdain. When you look at it on paper the start out of 1st with a 3.88 vs 3.44 is negligible. I realize the Spyder is 600lbs lighter but starting out of first was very easy and my thoughts when driving it were that it could easily tolerate a little longer 1st. I'm going to gamble here and go for it. If the 3.44 makes 1st too long then I will have to bite the bullet and have a 3.88 put in and swap the 4th back to a .82.

Besides you all know you love a test pilot on this site right?

...or I might bite a bigger bullet and drop a type 4 in!

and Alex, regarding our conversation earlier - The type 4 in the Spyder when properly dressed is like a nice pair of heels on a woman with great legs. You will not achieve the same look with a type 1 in a Spyder and a woman will not achieve the same look in a pair of flats. That is why some pay that extra $15K and that is why some get prenups!

No better words spoken Rusty.  Hot and Sexy meets Classy. 

Rusty S posted:

All very good information Al. I think over the years you have seen me comment on these gear ratio threads the most! After putting the 3.44 R&P in my car I still disliked 1st with a great disdain. When you look at it on paper the start out of 1st with a 3.88 vs 3.44 is negligible. I realize the Spyder is 600lbs lighter but starting out of first was very easy and my thoughts when driving it were that it could easily tolerate a little longer 1st. I'm going to gamble here and go for it. If the 3.44 makes 1st too long then I will have to bite the bullet and have a 3.88 put in and swap the 4th back to a .82.

Besides you all know you love a test pilot on this site right?

Yeah, but I forget who has (and who doesn't have) experience with this stuff (especially gearing, as it's so easy to build something you think meets your pruposes but that's almost unusable). You've already tried the 3.44x3.78 and it's still to short for your taste?; I see where you're going with it then!  You have the right attitude, Rusty, toward all this, so definitely let us all know how it turns out. I already can't wait to hear what you think. Test away, my friend!

PS- The only thing I'll comment on- the 3.11/1.93  combo is really (really) short (shorter than the typical 3.78/2.25 short ratio mainshaft (the 2.25 is from a type 1 autostick trans and is grafted on in place of the stock 2.06) and you might find it more fun with using a 3.11/1.86, which will make the 2-3 split a little closer. The recovery rpm should go up with each shift, and to have the 1-2 super short and then the 2-3 shift close to stock is a little counter productive. It's not much (only about a 100rpm difference), but it will be more fun with the 2-3 shift that little bit shorter. Otherwise the 2-3 split is almost stock.

http://calc.teammfactory.com/i...26+2&trannytype=

To have something to compare the info above to-                                                                 When shifting from 1st to 2nd at 3500, the revs drop to about 1950rpm with the stock (3.80/2.06) gears. From 2nd to 3rd, engine speed drops to 2200rpm with the 2.06/1.31 gears (again, stock). You can see that with the 1.93, the 2-3 split doesn't change all that much, whereas the 1/2 change is huge. For those having trouble following, the 1.86 2nd lowers the recovery rpm into 2nd 100rpm (still significantly higher than stock) and raises it into 3rd by the same amount, so you're higher into the powerband.

If you're not committed to any parts yet, either mainshaft/gear combo is about the same price, so I suggest going with the 1.86- it will ultimately be more fun. If for some reason (your trans guy has one he wants to unload, or?) there's a deal on the 1.93 that you can't pass up, then of course it will work as well. 

Again, I'm really interested in hearing your comments after some seat time! Al

Like Julio said earlier, there is NO BETTER source of info for replica 356/550 than this SOC. A wealth of tech data and shared experience at your fingertips!

Secured the Coupe with Greg at Vintage and he's going to handle a couple of things prior to shipping.  Looking forward to its arrival!  Thanks to the community for all your input. 

Al you are 100 percent correct on the 1.86. That mainshaft will not be available until sometime in June. The motor is currently out of my car and I would have to ask Greg to wait on the mainshaft from Weddle. Greg discouraged me from running the 1.86 and recommended the 1.93 as it keeps the rpms consistent between shifts as well as keeps the RPM's a little higher in the power band.

My thoughts on that are you can have a bit more drop in RPMs between 1st and 2nd as there is less restrictive force on the car at the lower speeds. As the car builds speed it builds drag so the shift between 2nd and 3rd should be less of a drop in RPMs and even less of a drop between 3rd and 4th to maintain efficiency within the powerband. If you look at a stock setup you will clearly see this pattern. Wind and friction = drag and as you know this builds as the car picks up speed. I'm no engineer and I'm not trying to recreate the wheel here just trying to apply what makes sense to me. If the timing permits I will ask Greg for the 3.11 / 1.86 mainshaft instead. You and I are in sync on that one.

Welcome to the madness ChrisP!

Congrats on your new ride, Chris! Awesome car. 'Welcome To The Madness' known as replica ownership.

Good move Chris. However, mine will kick your's ass at next year's show. Stay tuned, literally, you've got dual carbs on that Type 1..!!! No, but seriously, welcome to the madness! This forum and all of these guys are class acts. Can't thank them enough. Looking forward to meeting you and hearing more about your new Coupe once it arrives. 

Chris;

Welcome to the Madness!       

Congrats Chris. That is an awesome looking coupe.  If it had been for sale any longer I might have considered selling my Speedster to get that one. LOL

Chris - get the gears redone in that car! Would you attach a 350 chevy engine to a little Yamaha 125 gearbox? No way! That is overdoing it a bit but you get the point right? Your car has a gearbox designed for a 36 hp engine. You have a 160 hp engine. Spend the extra $$ now and you will be one happy dude later.

Thanks everyone.  I've always wanted a coupe and as you all know they don't come up that often.  Hope to enjoy it for many years. 

Nice score, Chris. Alex hit the nail on the head regarding the builder. I'm glad it's sorted.

I'd probably ignore the well-intended advice, and just drive it and develop your own opinions regarding what needs done (or not). You'll know soon enough what you'd like to change (and you will develop a long list before you know what's happening).

I would bet, Rusty, that when designing a transmission, almost every car manufacturer in the world raises the "recovery rpm" with each shift to the next higher gear. VW's recovery rpm's for the type1 4speed are 1950, 2200, and 2400 for the shifts into 2nd, 3rd and 4th gears for a reason (which you already know). The 1.93 could certainly work in a 5 speed if you were building a super close ratio box with stock spacing from 4th to 5th, but with only 4 gears to cover from standing to faster highway speeds, the super short 1-2 gap just doesn't work as well as the 1.86. Gregs reasoning that "it keeps the rpms consistent between shifts as well as keeps the RPM's a little higher in the power band"  doesn't really make sense. I'm glad you get it.

If it's available in it'll be worth the wait. Al