Electrical fault? Could this be the last straw?

im a firm believer in grounding issues , clean battery terminals and find where it  grounds to frame and remove/clean... might be switch...

What is a bad starter relay / solenoid?

Sounds like you have something that doesn't like heat.

Sounds like an issue I had. Turned out to be a bad ground to chassis. I would remove clean sand and reattach before you go any further...

Can you park on a hill? Do you have the mesh (but it could be copper too) grounding strap from trans to chassis?  Are both ends clean.  If not add one - can buy various lengths at auto store and try it.  Do you have the VW column switch or the after market dash switch?  Neither is very expensive (<$15).  I'd fiddle with switch before I'd suspect the starter solenoid.

Had similar problem last year...  Turned out to be a bad starter.

- way to check. When car does not start after a long hot drive, put it in gear and rock it back and forth to unlock the starter.. Does not take much...celenoid could me sticking/ magnetize ping to the case when hot.  

- Or you can reach under car and very lightly tap selenoid with the handle of a screw driver/ or a long stick.  

....Then try strarting.

- if it starts.... Then you know it's a bad starter solenoid.  They are sensitive to heat.

Starter is easy to replace... here is the thread from my experience and replacement last year.  

https://www.speedsterowners.com...1#457716058500688611

Good luck,

Wolfgang is on to something:  It's a long, long way to Tiperrary, and almost as long from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid.  After you get all of the grounds cleaned up (Battery to ground, Transaxle to ground) then go to the solenoid and remove the little 1/4" tab wire (which goes to the ignition switch) and clean that tab, too.  If you can find the starter wire up at the ignition switch, pull and clean that, too.

The only other heat-related thing I can think of is (1.) a dirty spot on the starter armature that prevents it from starting when the starter is energized, or the solenoid itself is dirty, corroded and in need of lube.  Either way, on those two you'll have to pull the starter and get it rebuilt or get a new one.  You can replace the starter on these cars w/o pulling the engine.  It's a PITA, but that's how it's done.

Craig,

Nothing will drive you crazy like intermittent electrical problems, and remote diagnoses are always iffy.  Even so, VW/Porsche starter solenoids really don't like heat, and a warm engine seems to be consistent with your problems.

Clean terminals, including grounding straps, are essential.  Others have cured the problem by installing a high-torque starter or replacing/cleaning the solenoid.  As connections age and corrode, they cumulatively increase resistance.  Remember that the grounding circuit completes the electrical path, so it's just as important as the positive side.  Good luck, and please let the group know what fixed your problem.  That's how we all learn. 

16 volts?  That seems high to me. Should be 12-13+

The 16 Volts seemed high to me as well.  But I'm reading a very good multimeter and it said, "16 Volts".  I have no idea why.  Maybe the dylithium crystals are too hot as well Scotty.

Replace the battery in your multimeter. It's dead and causing an excessive offset in your readings. There's no way a car battery's voltage will reach 16V.

Ding, Ding, Ding!!!!  Great advice Justin.  Changed battery, new readings are now believable:  Engine off - 12.3 V    Engine running - 12.2 V    Engine running with lights on - 11.8 V.  I assume these numbers are too low and again, ground connections could be at fault.  I will diligently check and clean all as suggested over the next three days and report back.  I hope it's grounds and not a bad alternator, I just put in a new Chinese POS.  Thanks, all.  I'll get back...

When running should be putting out 13-13+ volts.

Your battery's definitely not being charged then. And your ignition will continue to run the engine long after the battery is too drained to turn the starter over which explains why you can drive around but be unable to restart.

Is the charge light in the dash on with key-on-engine-off? Is the charge light on with the engine running?

Chinese alternator---the plot thickens,,,as the worm turns...I will be tuning in to see where this goes

You are over charging and I believe that your starter is going bad ...$50 at Advance Auto or Auto Zone and you can get a a starter for an Beetle auto stick that is more durable  .

Sorry Alan, you got this one wrong. Craig changed the battery in his multi-meter and now it looks like his new POS alternator is not charging. Read the last few responses before yours.

FYI, I got a manually adjustable Japanese regulator on my 911 alternator, which has been converted to one wire. Which is really two, the output and the idiot light. I adjusted it to put out 14.5 volts(under load of lights, ignition, and HEATER, which is close to 30 amps) at 2500-3000 rpm, which is where it spends most of it's time. No load voltage is a little higher.

Craig, make sure your idiot light bulb is connected AND working. It really could be that simple.

DannyP posted:

 

Craig, make sure your idiot light bulb is connected AND working. It really could be that simple.

Thanks to all, THANKS to DannyP.  This morning I checked my Alternator output right at the Alt connection and found 12.5V.  I was convinced the Alt was bad and not putting out enough to charge the battery.  So I started to work jacking up the car.  After cleaning and checking all grounds I stumbled upon the little sh!# that caused this.  See pic for the culprit.  I finally noticed that I wasn't getting any Alternator light coming on in my dash cluster at all, so I started at the Alt and checked wiring.  Within 12 inches from the alternator under corrugated plastic wire cover I found a bare wire end and a fastener (no longer connected).  Wadda ya know, wire to the dash light that was supposed to be connected.  So I put on a new connector and re-checked output.  Got 14.4V just like I should.  Light on dash went on at start and then off.  Perfect.  Another un-necessary waste of time trying to keep a 1974 vehicle running.  It may just be the last straw but I still have five things on my to-do list before I claim victory.  Oh the madness....

BTW, "make sure your idiot light bulb is connected AND working." was not in the form of a question, so we cannot award points.  Sorry.  We'll be right back to Madness Jeopardy after these messages...

Actually, this is the last straw:

What I do find funny is you titled this thread "Last Straw" and the source of you problem was a small "straw" shaped connector.

Good on ya, Craig, for finding the problem and letting others know the solution!

Way to go for sticking it out and keeping at it.

I've been replacing as many of those connectors as possible with a soldered joint and a good heat shrink tube cover.