European Visit

We have friends that want us to join them on a river cruise somewhere in western Europe next summer - haven't nailed down the river yet. Am I nuts to think that I could take the speedster over as well and spend an extra week or two tooling around? (It may turn out that the "guys" do the driving and the "gals" end up taking trains from place to place - although I've warned them that they may miss some of the good stuff!)

A few things I have questions about. First, the cost of shipping? Is it going to be an arm and a leg? Second, the timing for shipping - how long? (Don't want to miss the possible SOC in Colorado.) Thirdly, where do I start with finding out the registration issues I'll run into? Finally, any idea about the potential market for selling a used VS in any of the western European countries?

geeze - you either have too much money - or haven't fully thought this through. ;)

that's a massive risk and expense - one i'd never take with my car. These cars are easy enough to steal and insurance would be tricky i'd think. Cars get swiped pretty quick in Europe (especially near eastern Europe)

It's a sweet idea, but i honestly think it'd be more of a logistically headache than it was worth.

you'd be better off renting a high end convertible when you are there.

for the amount of money you'll be spend on tariffs/Taxes, shipping etc, not to mention the headache retrieving your car from the port city... Just rent a PGO in Paris and have at it.

It would be a nightmare with customs etc. Rent a car & beat the hell out of it.

I'd have to disagree with most of the comments....

I understnad it is a usual practice amoung the well heeled (not me!) to do this for their European vacations. They ship their cars over to use while they are there for a couple of months. Check out the cost of renting an upscale car in Europe and you'll see why it makes sense.

Having said that, just for a couple of weeks I don't think it would make sense. I've often thought about doing it as we usually go to Portugal and sometimes Germany each summmer but only for short periods. If you look up on the internet I'm sure you'll find more info and last time I checked it was not that expensive...especially if you consider the cost of renting an upscale car over there...just too much of a hassle for me for the couple of weeks we usually spend there.

Just came back from Portugal last Friday (and it snowed here and is staying!) where we met up with Luis and his wife Debbie. Had a great visit (although short) and got to look over his 1.8L water cooled VW engined speedster. Portugal is a great place to visit and more than likely the cheapest European vacation you can have at the moment (other than some eastern European places).

But renting over in Europe can be an experience as they have cars over there that we will never see in NA. Granted, this time I just had an Opel Corsa 1.2 L but other years I have rented some interesting cars. If you take your own car you may miss out on renting something you couldn't get your hands on here.

Just my 2 cents...

Thanks for the input. Asked for a couple of quotes on shipping the car today - we'll see what comes of it. I'm particularly concerned about the regulatory, tariff and fee side of getting the car there and using it. I don't like surprises along those lines.

As far as the money side, my wife and I are far from being really well off. The trip is our self indulgent reward for getting one daughter through grad school and married (as of this coming Thanksgiving weekend) and another daughter out of the house and ALMOST done with grad school. I'm just looking for a reasonable way to drive a "fun" vehicle when taking a trip - one that I already have at home. And I want to figure out what the option will cost.

Any of the guys in Europe that want to chime in are more than welcome. I've read a couple of threads discussing this, but nothing very recent.

Thanks, again, for the input.

You could take a bicycle trip in the Netherlands. Rent a Smart Car when you have to, but see some of the Low Country without any hassles at all -- and the Dutch are genuinely friendly. My European travels have mostly been recreational in Northern Europe and G.I. tours in the Balkans. I'd stay north. Fewer land mines.

Cal,
I transport dozens of vehicles monthly to east coast exporters.
From what I see and hear plan on at least $1,200 each way you'll have to also get firm quotes on each end for the actual handling / loading and off loading as the are usually another company that provides this service.
Since you are in OK. there would be additional transportation costs to the coast and that, gets expensive.
When you drop off the vehicle to be exported it becomes a number on a piece of paper with no guarantees (they will tell you what you want to hear)as to an exact shipping and arrival times, I have seen vehicles that I have delivered sit in the same spot for 30 days plus.
They are situated into a container in such a way that they are blocked up on a 30 degree angle this allows the cars to physically overlap each other allowing for three units per container.
IMHO....rent a PGO speedster there. ~Alan

Cal:

I used to get to Ireland and the Continent often when I was still working and, believe me, it would be FAR, FAR, cheaper (and safer, too) to rent a Miata, Peugeot or BMW something-or-other when you get there to tool around with than to try to get your car there and back in one piece.

And what do you do if you have any mechanical troubles? You'll find just as few people willing to work on it as you do in OK, maybe less, whereas with a rental car, you just have the hook come and get it and they give you another car - presto! I would probably go for an Audi or Peugeot turbo-diesel - GREAT fuel mileage, lots of power and they handle like Banshees.

For that matter, you could travel around on a rail pass or air pass (they're ridiculously cheap once you get there) and rent several different cars at different locations and STILL come out way ahead.

Happy trip planning.....I would do a trip down the Rhine, but don't forget the Shannon River in Southwest Ireland or a liesurely trip down the Seine, or, or.......there are SO MANY rivers to tour in Europe, and most were developed as "highways" over 400 years ago.

Remember what Billy Joel sang about: Slow down, you crazy child, take the phone of the hook and disappear for a while.....Vienna waits for you.......

gn

Whatever you do try to avoid driving on the streets of Vienna

:-)
Dusty

One more thing...

Just two weeks ago when I was in Portugal I had an accident with the rental car. My fault, backed into a tree and took out the rear window and hatch. Didn't notice the lopped off branch jutting out of the side of the tree until it was through the window.

That type of accident would really put the damper on a vacation where you had your own vehicle but not so with a rental. They picked up the damaged car and gave me another...total time "wasted" was about an hour.

I didn't opt for the CDW or so-full insurance so I was on the hook for the damages. But unlike car rentals in Can and the US I was not on the hook for the full amount as over there they have a maximum amount you are on the hook for...depends on the class of car. I ended up paying 750 Euros even though the damage was greater.

I paid for the rental with my Visa and opted not to have the CDW therefore Visa's insurance kicks in (not available if you opt for additional coverage from the rental place). I should be able to recover the 750 Euros (or at least most of it) from Visa's underwriters when I get the documentation from the rental car firm.

All in all the rental car firm was very understanding and very accommadoting. Visacar was the firm if anyone is planning on going to the Algarve in southern Portugal.

I'd also avoid driving on the streets of Venice.

...and if you are in either Vienna or Venice, make sure to NOT get mud on your helmet!!

I would not avoid attempting to drive in any city on the Continent (or the Planet, for that matter).....those who tell you to avoid this or that city are just Wimps (at least I capitalized it - I bet Vince wouldn't!).

BE AN AMERICAN!! Get out there and drive like the locals!! (or at least like you come from Boston).

Ignore any and all traffic rules, either real or imagined.

Have two speeds: Fully accelerating or fully braked. NO IN-BETWEEN!!

Use your horn often, if not constantly, but never, never use your brake!! Remember the words of Ettore Bugatti: "Real Racers don't use brakes!"

Treat the view out of your windshield like a video game: Weave through any and all traffic ahead of you for maximum points, er...I mean...distance covered!

Always ask for a "Turbo-Charged" or "Super-Charged" (preferred) car from the rental agency (but don't get the optional insurance). All Wheel Drive (AWD) gets you bonus points, as does Dunlop 501 M&S tyres.

Always ask for the GPS option. It costs a bit more, but you can yell at the GPS instead of at your wife when you (it) gets you lost (that option, alone, saves a lot of marriages). Also ask for the "Safety Camera Location" option loaded for the country you are in (those "Safety Cameras" take a picture of you when you go by over the speed limit and send you a ticket later on - not cool...

Never, Never get a Red or Yellow rental car, but prefer Moss Green or shades of brown. They blend in with the background and become "invisible" in a group of cars speeding over the posted limit (which most cars in Europe do, anyway, except for the Trabants).

Always ask if the rental agency provides complementary picnic baskets (good local wines and bread included are a definite plus). If in Germany, substitute beer or schnapps for the wine.

Cory,
THAT's funny :-)


Dusty

Gordon is telling you like it is -- pay heed. Forget the transport idea; rent your conveyance.

I had a turbo diesel Peugot, 4 dr something or other once, and it was three days before I knew it was a diesel. Very funny story. Anyway, it was a great car, and rode down the autostrada with the best of them, almost, and got terrific gas (cancel that: fuel) mileage. I got real used to getting from here to there at 90+ MPH. Locals informed me that the posted limits (often different for different lanes on the highway) are merely suggestions. In two weeks of steady travel never saw the polizzi one time.

And "Stay away from the streets of Venice"? Now that is really funny. My advice: go to Venice, and find out for yourself.

In another life I had to travel quite a bit outside of the US - and almost always drove myself while on site with the following exceptions: most of Asia (although Singapore, Hong Kong, and some parts of Thailand are doable) and eastern Europe (where they'd even stole a pair of used jeans out of the back of my car at one point). No problem with either left or right hand drive - lived in Oz for several years.

Really like the ideas that were put forth here - and it seems like the rental alternative will work best. Now, to start that process.

Gordon - I'm not afraid to drive anywhere, although my patience can be taxed considerably in certain cities. And you're right - Boston is a very good training ground!

Brian, one of my worst driving experiences was on the Iberian peninsula while in Madrid

I went to Europe a few years back and rented a car to get around with. It was already running when I got in, so I just took off and drove the 1+ hour to my hotel.

Went out the next morning, got in and turned the key........nothing.

Tried it again, maybe five times..........nothing.

Tried having a co-worker push it while I popped the clutch......instant stop and......nothing.

Finally I was irate (and late for a business meeting) so I called the rental company ready to give them "what for". Got this woman on the phone who sounded like she was in a Coma, especially for Germany, where they're always crisp.

"This *&^%$##@@ car won't start!" I exclaimed.........

She replied, right away; "Sir, you're driving a diesel. you must turn the key to 'on', let it sit for 10 seconds and then start it."

I tried it and, Damn! it worked 8>(

DOH!!

I wouldn't want to drive in NYC...that place sucks. Especially in a speedster. Did that once, never again.

David - NYC in a Speedster? You are a braver man than I, my friend!

It was a nightmare. Big potholes, fast traffic, 18 wheelers 2 feet away at high speeds. Whew what a mess!

Torture: I have tickets to the Orioles games (and don't you Yankee fans start up, please) and have taken the Speedster to the games a couple of times. Well, OK twice. Lesson learned: This is definitely NOT an urban vehicle, esp'y on downtown Baltimore roads. Felt like being on a bucking bronco. Very stiff springs, very stiff sway bars, very pathetic roads, so one goes very slowly, or one loses ones fillings, or possibly hemorhoids.

That Puegot was a 403, as I now recall. Really, a very nice sedan.

Started looking at rentals. Found sites that say they offer the PGO, but don't seem to find pricing on line. Some of the lesser sports cars are pretty reasonable - about $1,700 for two weeks (all up) for an M5 or Mini convertible, unlimited mileage. Based upon Brian's experience with accidents in Europe with a rental, this is definitely the way to go. Alan's estimate on the freight sealed the decision.

And there's an added bonus - my wife will probably come along with me in the rental car....

Just make sure you beat the living hell out of that damn thing.

How are the Orioles doing this year by the way?

I've used this place before to book in Portugal...

https://www.rentalcargroup.com/book_car.php?pick_up_city=Albufeira&pick_up_loc=3361&lan=&image.x=52&image.y=11

I believe the rates they will quote are all inclusive including CDW but read the fine print.

Hate to throw this out but depending in where you are going you may not need, or want, to rent a car. I do in southern Portugal because its basically older fishing villages, now tourist traps, and the mass transit is not well developed. We also like to go to beaches and towns off the beaten track and stay at rural B&Bs as opposed to resorts (used to be rowdy football groups now it sems more and more rowdy, realtively affluent, eastern europeans guys...both not my idea of R&R).

When we go to Germany we never rent a car. The public transit system is just too good. Its reliable and relatively cheap. Most of the main train stations are in places where you want to be as a tourist anyway, or, its easy to get to them. I have often taken a train from one city to another staying in small hotels near the train station (often within walking..dragging my suitcase behind) then walking about the old towns or Altstad, visiting the sights and pubs. I've used this site for hotels in Europe before....

http://www.world-stay.com/en/europe/

I prefer the smaller, family run places as opposed to the larger chains but to each his own.

And you don;t have to worry about having a bit too much to drink when using mass transit. Once going from Dusseldorf to Bremen we came upon two different keg parties on the train and of course the Canadians HAD to sit and have a beer (or two...). Wouldn't have had those experiences had we rented a car and driven.

Just a thought..

Only slightly worse than the Yankees, at least recently; BWAAAHAHAHAHAH!! Go Indians!! I told you not to start . . .

mass transit in germany is great.... when they are not on strike!

Last time the Yankees didn't make it (and neither did the Red Sox) this BIG billboard went up along Boston's Southeast Expressway:

"At least the Yankees didn't win!"

Ya gotta love 120+ year old rivalries.....

BTW: For all of you folks up in little old Massachusetts; Just entered into the Guinness Book of World Records is Fuller Field in Clinton, MA. The oldest, continuously running baseball field in the USA, and it was established in 1853. Still in use by a AAA team and local little leagues for their local series. Wow.....

I used USAA to rent an Opel Astra out of Fumacino. I wasn't about three blocks out of the carpark when I dusted off a Vespa into a flower garden in the middle of a roundabout.
If the statute of limitations is up -- should be by now -- I kinda did it on purpose. Really. How in blazes does one expect to pass on the left, inside the left lane, in a traffic circle?
Good God. And I think she was still trying to sell me Chicklets, even as she went wheels over teakettle into the pansies.

Cory, thats normal in Italy.

A recent Dream Car Garage show talked briefly about sending your car to Europe and driving it there. The boys were in Germany visiting Porsche and they had brought a recent Vette and Caddy sports car over.

They had a brief interview with a rep from Lant & Company Insurance Brokers Ltd. The guy talked about insurance for your car overseas and when shipping....he seemed like he knew what he was talking about.

He said it is a lot easier now since the EU in that one policy will cover you in all EU countries. You need to have a recent appraisal and be sure to insure for an agreed upon value, both in transit and while there, and "all perils". He had a few other tips but it was brief. You may want to contact them for more info....

I guess if the purpose of the trip is to drive your car in Europe, on the autobaun and/or through the countryside, then a rental would not be the same. You'd have to send your car over.

If the purpose is to have a relatively carefree vacation/tour of Europe then I'd go for a rental.

.....and I thought I was due for more speedy visitors. It would be great to see some you guys come over with your cars, but common sense says it will be easier to hire, even a PGO or TT etc.

Hey Luis. Got your car back together yet?

Still haven't found a place or estimated prices to rent a PGO, and haven't given up ---- yet. Brian, also checked your recommended site and didn't find a PGO offered. Thinking more closely about why I'd want to drive while over there and the SEG ranks really high on the list - as opposed to needing the freedom to go where I/we wanted. Maybe time to reassess the entire idea. Thanks to all for the input and a dose of reality in some cases. Sometimes you need folks to say: What are you thinking?!

...or "Vat are you sinking"?

http://mikeandjosee.com/page23/german_coastguard.mpg

rent or buy this