Feedback needed on dual (1 barrel) carbs on a stock 1600 dual port

Jetted down Weber 40's would work,.... I have had good luck with dual 34's 1600 to 1915 cc  If you shop around you can get he complete dual set up for under $300.

If you could find a set of Dellorto 36s, they'd be perfect. I had a 1776 with ICTs-- it wasn't bad, but it wasn't anything special, either. 

When I brought my engine up  1914cc I tried dual single barrels and the engine would only idle on two cylinders and was rough -I was told that it was a vacuum issue,one cylinder drawing from the other. I broke down and installed Weber IDF 40s dual barrels and the engine smoothed down and fires on all cylinders-not that the Webers are perfect but well worth it.

Joel

Here's a nice set of 36 Dells on SAMBA, but the guy is asking $1240.

And then I'd have to get them rejetted to work on my stock engine.  With the Canadian dollar in the crapper I'd end up spending $2000 for these carbs and that's just....

Cip1 has the Weber 34 ICT carb kit for $630 CAN,  and the EMPI EPC 34 kit for $447.99. CAN

I suspect the Weber kit might be better, quality wise, but is it almost $200 better?

Have you checked with CB Performance on the Weber 34 ICTs?  I bought a set for 400 USD.   I think that's about 530 CAN??  Plus shipping.   I have had good service from CB and am pleased with several products I have purchased from them.   Just my opinion.  ��

James

I've got Weber 34's on my 1904 cc, and I'm pretty happy with them so far.  My engine builder re-jetted them, but I'm not at home and can't remember what they ended up at.

It's always "so far".

Way back in my university years I drove a 1970 Beetle.  The single port engine, which was stock, except for a merged header and a set of Kadron carbs.  I drove that thing for 70,000 miles and those carbs gave me zero problems.  The only thing I did to them was to check the linkage once a year.

I've had three sets of dual throat Webers over the years and all three have been a pain in the a$$.  The biggest problem was plugged idle jets.  Even the new set that Henry installed on my old IM gave me grief.

I know that that there are members on this forum who have had zero problems with their dual throat Webers, but not me.

I'm thinking it's not like I'm going to drive my buggy every day.  I doubt I'll drive it more than a couple of thousand miles a year.  Even if dual single barrel carbs wear out faster than dual 2 barrel carbs it should be a long time for the single barrel carbs need to be worked on (hopefully).

James posted:

Have you checked with CB Performance on the Weber 34 ICTs?  I bought a set for 400 USD.   I think that's about 530 CAN??  Plus shipping.   I have had good service from CB and am pleased with several products I have purchased from them.   Just my opinion.  ��

James

I just put a set of ICTs through CBs checkout to see what they would cost.  Shipping to Vancouver Island (British Columbia) is $92.  The total in Canadian funds would be $656.

That's $26 more than Cip1's price, but it includes CB's better linkage and air cleaners, which won't matter to me, since I plan on going with a center mount linkage and I'll need custom air cleaners to fit under the buggy's body.

I also checked with Aircooled.net, which is a bit more expensive, both in the cost of the carbs and shipping, than CB.  The total, in Canadian funds, was $733,

I just did a EMPI EPC and Weber ICT search on SAMBA and I'm not liking what I've read so far.  Seems the throttle shafts wear out quickly on both EPC and ICT carbs.

Maybe I'd be wiser to go with a set of 40 IDFs from John at Aircooled.net.  He said he can jet them so that they will basically be a plug-and-play  install on my engine.

The only think stopping me is the price.  $1350 CAN.

Do it once or twice?

IaM-Ray posted:

Do it once or twice?

Not sure what you mean.

Well sometimes you want to save money and you choose the cheaper option.... then you eventually need the other one that you turned down and you spend again but now you spent twice.  So if any doubt exists DO IT ONCE  

Do you really need dual carbs? You could install a center mount 32/36 Weber, set it and forget it forever. They're about $200 US new and a manifold could be had on the Samba for about $50 or so. 

David Stroud posted:

Do you really need dual carbs? You could install a center mount 32/36 Weber, set it and forget it forever. They're about $200 US new and a manifold could be had on the Samba for about $50 or so. 

I've heard they're difficult to get running properly.

Nope.

I've had three different dune buggies in the distant past, one with an Ford/Autolite carb that looked like THIS and was (I think) built by Carter back then, and another with a small Holly 450 or something - IIRC, the manifold flange matches on both and way back then the manifolds were from EMPI and center-mounted it up like the original VW carb, just a tad bigger.  Lots of buggies ran singles up higher, more out of the dust back there and more problem free.  We often put the air cleaner up on top of the back apron.

Like Dave said - set them up once and forget them - Most of the time, they were plug-and-play if it came from a similarly sized engine.  Usually had to rebuild one every couple of years, anyway, 'cuz the dust and wet would get to them, but a rebuild took about 45 minutes.  Easy-Peasy and a LOT less hassle than a pair of Webers.

Ron O posted:

David Stroud posted:

Do you really need dual carbs? You could install a center mount 32/36 Weber, set it and forget it forever. They're about $200 US new and a manifold could be had on the Samba for about $50 or so. 

I've heard they're difficult to get running properly.

 

 

Nope...just not true. I've had a Weber 32/36 on my car since 2011 with a 1915 VW engine, a 2.2l and now a 2.5L Soob. Set it and forget it. Many miles on the Weber with not one adjustment. 

Weber makes it easy on you too. You can get a carb with the throttle on either side and you can have the choke at the front or back. 

Weber 32 / 36 is a great carb once it is set up , the mixture screw is on the back of the carb near the shroud and is difficult to get to but once you dial it is , that all you need to do. I have had to cut away the inner portion of the deck lid for the air cleaner to fit.

I think a 1600 would be a perfect candidate for a Mexican EFI conversion. Mario Velotta makes a kit with everything all set up with one single throttlebody, easy/peasy. 

You're an evil man, Mr. Clean.......

Gordon Nichols posted:

You're an evil man, Mr. Clean.......

I know Ron had a disastrous experience with his CB kit, but this isn't anything like that. The kit uses a Mexican Beetle manifold, TB, and injectors, and runs it with MS. It does crank-fired ignition as well. He's got the whole thing put together as a plug-n-play set-up, packaged for $2500. I'd use it for anything up to a 1914 if I didn't like carbs.

FWIW, Mario Velotta (thebugshop.net) is the real deal. Everybody running around looking for the perfect EFI rig and bypassing him is missing the best possible solution. 

Alan Merklin posted:

Weber 32 / 36 is a great carb once it is set up , the mixture screw is on the back of the carb near the shroud and is difficult to get to but once you dial it is , that all you need to do. I have had to cut away the inner portion of the deck lid for the air cleaner to fit.

But you can buy one with the mixture screw pointing out towards the back of the car too. Yes, you'll need to clearance the deck lid 'glass a bit in a speedster but I think Ron wants to put this in a dune buggy. 

I have built a wide range of aircooled flat 4s over 30 years.  For 1600-ish I would move away from the 40 Webbers, and head for th ICTs or Kadrons.  I have had great results from Kads and ICTs on slightly warmed up baby engines, but 40s need to be on a 1776 or similar.

And as for the single dual choke 32/36 - yes it works, but that's as far as I will say.  Not on my list of preferences.  Been there once - never again once you have used twins.

Stan,this time around I'm going to keep it simple, and that means no fuel injection for me.  If I told my wife I bought another F.I. kit she'd kill me, my brother-in-law, who told me not to buy the first kit from CB,  would mock me, and my dog would look up at me in disgust, and pee on my buggy's tires.

I've read countless threads on SAMBA comparing various carb setups and I've talked to a couple of people, who have decades of experience working with air cooled engines.

Yesterday I ordered the IDF Weber 40 kit from John at Aircooled.net.  I also plan on ordering the Synclink throttle linkage from slowtwitch on SMABA.

for an extra $70 John will set the carbs up properly for my climate, altitude,  and engine size.  There's also a good chance I'll be upgrading the engine in a couple of years.