Front Suspension or Wheel Issue?

Rust on the front discs from sitting over the winter?  It will wear off after 20 miles or so.

Tires flat spotted from sitting with one surface to ground?  Next year pressurize tires to 40# before storing.  Check now for low pressure - set to 23-24 F and 26-28 R and again drive some miles.  This is usually more of a thumping.  Some recommend raising car on jack stands so tiress don't have pressure on them.

Rotate wheels to see if that changes feel (be sure to adjust tire pressure).

Repack grease in front wheel bearing and adjust.  Spin tire while still on car and jacked up - see if rim is out of round or a bubble on tire rubber.

Check steering rag joint --- or red/orange poly replacement.  Replace as necessary (which is now for the poly one! as they crack).

Is a front brake pad dragging?  Check caliper and change brake fluid (every 2 years as it absorbs moisture).

Lug night tighten evenly?

Does your car have a front steering shock and a front sway bars?  Years ago they weren't standard on VS produced Speedsters.

With that low mileage and driving modern cars all winter --- perhaps you're just over sensitive to the old steering box?

Thanks, @JoelP  Good to hear you are OK and that you will have funds for tons of new upgrades!  Haha

What about the steering box?  My limited experience makes me think an issue with the tires is more likely, as you suggest.

I am on to my next project already - upgrading heads and clutch.  Pat Downs recommended dual spring heads when I asked him about installing Dellortos and A-1 Sidewinder exhaust.  He said in no uncertain terms that I MUST upgrade the valve springs.  He almost guaranteed that I would damage my engine with an overrev with the extra power.  I haven't done that yet, and so it is in process right now.  Also, the stock clutch now slips, so he recommended Kennedy Stage 1.  I guess I'll do that now too.  The fun continues....

Sorry to usurp your thread.  I hope you get the shimmy figured out. 

I had a similar problem for years until I finally figured it out as very minor imbalance in the wheels.  I had my wheels balanced 5 or 6 times the regular way and there was always an imbalance and vibration above 60mph because the car is so light.  I took the wheels to have them “road force balanced”.  That cured it.

Do a google search for “road force wheel balance near me” or go to the Hunter website and search for Road Force balancers.  There should be a bunch near you.  Expect to pay around $20 per wheel.

https://www.hunter.com/find-equipment/

Gordon:  I find I have to balance often.  Every time ( the conventional way) improves things and then after a while . . .  I've heard your tale about road-force balance before and did some research, as this sounded pretty cool. Could not find a place near by after cursory searching . . . ??  Also found some comments by folks on the interweb and generally that came up with a big "meh".  Some saying that it's just hooey.  Just FWIW . . .  I have no direct knowledge/experience.

@WOLFGANG posted:

Rust on the front discs from sitting over the winter?  It will wear off after 20 miles or so.

Tires flat spotted from sitting with one surface to ground?  Next year pressurize tires to 40# before storing.  Check now for low pressure - set to 23-24 F and 26-28 R and again drive some miles.  This is usually more of a thumping.  Some recommend raising car on jack stands so tiress don't have pressure on them.

Rotate wheels to see if that changes feel (be sure to adjust tire pressure).

Repack grease in front wheel bearing and adjust.  Spin tire while still on car and jacked up - see if rim is out of round or a bubble on tire rubber.

Check steering rag joint --- or red/orange poly replacement.  Replace as necessary (which is now for the poly one! as they crack).

Is a front brake pad dragging?  Check caliper and change brake fluid (every 2 years as it absorbs moisture).

Lug night tighten evenly?

Does your car have a front steering shock and a front sway bars?  Years ago they weren't standard on VS produced Speedsters.

With that low mileage and driving modern cars all winter --- perhaps you're just over sensitive to the old steering box?

@WOLFGANG

I have installed a front sway bar. I was able to drive the car 40 miles per month from December to April. So it never sat for more than a few weeks at a time. Aslo, car sat in 65-degree F garage all winter.

The front caliper does sound like it's dragging. I'll be addressing that ASAP.

I am probably being a bit over-sensative about it all. But I'd rather constantly do little things constantly and avoide big surprises.

Do you know what the rotation pattern is? Without looking at the Bentley book, I'm guessing the following:

Right Rear to Right Front
Left Rear to Left Front

Right Front to Left Rear
Left Front to Right Rear

@El Frazoo posted:

Gordon:  I find I have to balance often.  Every time ( the conventional way) improves things and then after a while . . .  I've heard your tale about road-force balance before and did some research, as this sounded pretty cool. Could not find a place near by after cursory searching . . . ??  Also found some comments by folks on the interweb and generally that came up with a big "meh".  Some saying that it's just hooey.  Just FWIW . . .  I have no direct knowledge/experience.

Know what's NOT hooey? The old-school Hunter spin balancers that balance the tire, wheel, and rotor while they're on the car. Dead nuts on, up to 120 mph.

Yeah, but I think Danny is one of the few left that have one.   That's how I used to balance my 12" wide rear dune buggy wheels.  A local mechanic had an on-car wheel balancer and it was like magic.  Used his power roller to spin the fronts and I did the rears using the buggy engine and just held the rpms while he fiddled with the weight adjusters to dial it in.   Again - Like magic.

@El Frazoo  My car used to shake between 60 and 70 enough that the windshield would vibrate....A LOT.   Tried everything I could think of to cure it for years until I finally did a road force balance.  That calmed things down about 90%, for sure and made it a pleasure to drive on the interstates (below 80.  If I kept it between 75 and 80 before balancing, it smoothed out a bit).  That's why I recommend it.  Use this site to find one near you.  I'm seeing ten different locations near 21207 Zip

https://www.hunter.com/find-equipment/

There's a shop deep in the hood in Peoria (Vachon's) that balances driveshafts, rotating assemblies on engines, and tires with one of those machines. I'm pretty sure the tire machine is the newest thing they've got, but their work is impeccable. They're amazing.

Too bad it doesn’t balance people… on a more serious note I tried every thing and ended up realizing the tires might be an issue, changed the front then it was gone .   The rear still has a bit of an issue due to the hubs not being hub centric.

@JoelP posted:

@WOLFGANG

I have installed a front sway bar. I was able to drive the car 40 miles per month from December to April. So it never sat for more than a few weeks at a time. Aslo, car sat in 65-degree F garage all winter.

The front caliper does sound like it's dragging. I'll be addressing that ASAP.

I am probably being a bit over-sensative about it all. But I'd rather constantly do little things constantly and avoide big surprises.

Do you know what the rotation pattern is? Without looking at the Bentley book, I'm guessing the following:

Right Rear to Right Front
Left Rear to Left Front

Right Front to Left Rear
Left Front to Right Rear

If you have radials (and you absolutely do) the word is not to swap them side to side, it's front to rear only. Unless that's changed in recent times.

@edsnova posted:

If you have radials (and you absolutely do) the word is not to swap them side to side, it's front to rear only. Unless that's changed in recent times.

You and I clearly worked in a service station about the same time, Ed.

It took me forever to believe it, but you can rotate modern radials in an X pattern, assuming they're not directional tires.

Yes, I believe that is correct, if they are not directional.  I just found that out myself recently.

I have Pirellis on my car. I haven't checked whether they're radials.

They are.

Yes, you can rotate radials same side front to rear OR side to side OR in an X pattern, or like Greg described, front to back, then diagonal.

If you have a tire that won't maintain balance, it could be MANY things: wheel runout, bent rim, rim not attaching to hub concentrically, or bad tire to name a few.

And I DO NOT have a road force machine, nor have I ever used one. I have a Snap-On hand crank electronic wheel balancer from the 1980s. Exactly like this one, except the knobs are black on mine:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...op&v=WnpvLhzHSHk

Thanks, @Stan Galat. I should have looked that up.

Just to be safe, and to avoid some wheel bearing issues that seem to be common, I was thinking of replacing all my front and rear wheel bearings. Has anyone used FAG bearings? If so, do you know what size?

@JoelP posted:

Just to be safe, and to avoid some wheel bearing issues that seem to be common, I was thinking of replacing all my front and rear wheel bearings. Has anyone used FAG bearings? If so, do you know what size?

I'm using FAG bearings. Bear in mind that they're not made in Germany anymore (they're made with pride in Vietnam). I have no idea of their longevity, but they were the best bearings I could find and so I bought them.

Size depends on what you have for spindles (link-pin or ball-joint).

Thanks, @Stan Galat

Ironically, as I removed my front passenger side wheel to rotate it, I found this!

I never thought I was clairvoyant, but maybe this is a sign from the universe. Although there is no obvious source, I can’t help but think my worries about wheel bearings are well-founded.

I actually have a set of FAGs made in Germany that fit one of my old 356s, in the boxes.  Being 30+ YO, they are a bit rusty.  The new ones I got for the Speedster I think said made in So Korea??  Or maybe it was 'nam. ?  All I told the guy was "Not EMPI, not China" Apparently they had ones from different mfrs.  I'm betting there is a bearing set made in the good ol' USA somewhere that will fit, but be damned if I can find. As to size/model numbers, not sure I have the boxes they came in, but  CB or Jbugs or ?? will have the right things if you tell them what you have.  Further point: while on the subject, how tight does one set the clamp nut?

Old school: keep radials on the same side when rotating.  I've never heard of any other way to do it -- except just now above.  Theory: the belts/fibers take a "set" rolling in one direction, and one ought not make them go the other way around once set.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Kelly, I've rotated radials counter clockwise for years.  no problems.

Not to be too dense: so that red stuff likely came from my wheel bearing? I say “stuff” because I don’t definitively know what it was.  

@El Frazoo posted:

I actually have a set of FAGs made in Germany that fit one of my old 356s, in the boxes.  Being 30+ YO, they are a bit rusty.  The new ones I got for the Speedster I think said made in So Korea??  Or maybe it was 'nam. ?  All I told the guy was "Not EMPI, not China" Apparently they had ones from different mfrs.  I'm betting there is a bearing set made in the good ol' USA somewhere that will fit, but be damned if I can find. As to size/model numbers, not sure I have the boxes they came in, but  CB or Jbugs or ?? will have the right things if you tell them what you have.  Further point: while on the subject, how tight does one set the clamp nut?

Old school: keep radials on the same side when rotating.  I've never heard of any other way to do it -- except just now above.  Theory: the belts/fibers take a "set" rolling in one direction, and one ought not make them go the other way around once set.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

7 to 9 ft. lbs.

Joel - is the red ‘stuff’ liquidy or greasy and does it wipe up with a rag?  Or does it seem to be something that leaked or dripped some time ago and has since dried solid or mostly solid?  It occurs to me that if it was something that was leaking as you were driving, with wheels spinning, it would not look like this - what you have appears to have occurred once, and has either dried some time ago, or happened after you parked it after your last drive.  

Do you know that this hub was previously clean, or is this the first time you’ve had that wheel off?  Is it possible this is something that occurred during initial assembly that wasn’t cleaned off?

What does it look like with the spacer off?

Good point @Jon The hub has always been clean. With the spacer off, there was a bit of the red stuff on the inside of the spacer. Also, it was slick, like oil, but not that slick. If it is from the car, it leaked after the last drive and I parked.

I think I’ll spray some foot powder around this area to track the source is the red stuff.  

The wheel bearing grease separated a bit, and that's the liquid part of it. It dripped out of the press-fit of your dust cap and the hub.

It indicates nothing bad in and of itself.

Jack up the front end, put on a wheel, and spin. Does it spin freely? If so, grab the top and bottom of the wheel and try to shake it on the hub. Does it rock? If so, pack and adjust the bearings.

If not, wipe up the oil and drive away.

YAY! Stan, you just made my week! Tomorrow is the first truly nice day for driving that isn’t packed with meetings.

I thought you were referring to the brown grease (upper in photo) near the contact surface????  Check the pads for grease contamination.

@El Frazoo posted:

Further point: while on the subject, how tight does one set the clamp nut?

Old school: keep radials on the same side when rotating.  I've never heard of any other way to do it -- except just now above.  Theory: the belts/fibers take a "set" rolling in one direction, and one ought not make them go the other way around once set.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

You said it: OLD SCHOOL! That is how it was when radials were new, like 50-60 or is it 70 years ago? That used to be true, but not any more.

* I looked it up, a guy who worked at Michelin invented them in 1946 or 1948 depending on which source you read. They used them in Europe for twenty years! The first American car that had them from the factory was the 1970 Lincoln Continental.

I ALWAYS set wheel bearing tension by feel. I leave the dust cap off and the wheel on. Grab the wheel top and bottom and push/pull, tighten the nut until it is JUST to the point of no play. Spin it, it should go for a few turns. Lock the nut down and replace the cap. Drive it 50 miles and check it again. Done.

If you were asking about the pinch bolt for the clamp nut: 13 Nm or 9.5 ft.-lbs.

Txs for the technical reply.  I figure just about finger-snug, no wiggle.  With my last go-'round with this, I bought some supposedly high temp, high performance wheel bearing grease that was red,, not black or brown or green.  Perhaps similar product was used here and some leaked out when it got hot??  The stuff I got said it was not supposed to do that, having a very high use temperature.

This morning’s drive went off without a hitch. Forgot to mention I installed my rear anti-roll bar too. Handles even better now.

Made a pit stop to grab a drink and take a pic:

Beautiful car, Joel.

Thanks, Lane. I covet yours. I wish I had the clients I have now when yours was up for auction. Those suby-powered coupes are killer!

Kinda off topic, but does anyone know whether a current SOC member uses a Gene Berg oil breather box?

There was one on a Spyder motor that I built. It was the kind that attaches to the stock oil filler. It seemed to work OK, but I installed a dry sump system and a separate catch can hooked up to both the Berg breather can and the top of the dry sump tank.

@JoelP posted:

Kinda off topic, but does anyone know whether a current SOC member uses a Gene Berg oil breather box?

I've had one in my car for 19 years.

@Impala

I hope you’ve had better dealings with CSP than I'm having. I emailed them and asked if they could assist with giving me a parts list for what I would need to install a breather tower using 22M dual banjo fitting with 18mm hose; they said they could. Lo and behold, the parts CSP told me to buy are missing the adapter for the top of the breather tower which would allow me to use the 22M banjo bolt required for the dual banjo fitting. Ironically, this exact setup is pictured on the CSP website, so it's not like I'm pushing any boundaries. I was a bit miffed because only the person putting together the parts list would know the adapter would be required (this is the very reason I contacted them in the first place). Luckily, I hadn’t drilled by air filter assemblies yet. Sadly, I then realized they sent me a breather tower for a car with a generator. TBH, I didn't even know they sold different towers for alternator versus generator cars. Of course, my car has an alternator. I figured this would have been a question CSP would have asked me before putting together a finalized parts list. After all, if I knew everything about this subject, I wouldn't have asked for CSP's assistance.

All that said, CSP parts are clearly well-made, and I would use them eight days a week; however, I will NEVER recommend anyone rely on CSP’s "expertise" on thinking through application of their own products: think about it, CSP dual banjo fitting, CSP banjo bolt, CSP breather tower = requires CSP expertise to know an adapter is needed as the size of the opening at the top of the tower isn't publised.

Hopefully, they will send the adapter and an alternator bracket so I can be done with them.

Sorry for the rant, but other SOC members should know what ordering directly from CSP is like. Ironically, Steven at cip1.com was the one who turned me on to how great CSP products are. I’ll be going through him for my parts needs, going forward.

Joel, I just re-read your OP and it reminded me of something (since I’m getting ready to go do it in a few minutes for this season.

Every spring when I take the 968 out of storage I get a shimmy/vibration from the flat spot on the tires from sitting over the winter. By the time I drive the 2 miles to discount tire to get the TP checked, and go around enough corners that the spots are no longer aligned, the vibration goes away. As soon as th3 tires get up to operating temperature, they’re fine.

Reminds me of the seals in a pool, or hottub, start it up and wait a few days and voila the seals swell up… Happens as well sometimes in cooling systems, but I have a routine of tightening up every bolt I see every spring.  I remember when the gas filter got loose and the hose was spitting gas all over… dangerous… I learned my lesson as these cars, including all cars not driven will often show up with a bunch of sudden stuff that you need to plan for in your pre-season launch.