TRP posted:IaM-Ray posted:It does give you the ability to toot your normal horn anytime without the cacophony of an air horn.
Mine is similar. I have the standard horns. Go a little longer on the button and you get the accompanying sounds of 4 tuned 1960's / 70's Cadillac horns. It preeeeetty funny.
That is interesting how did you get that circuit to do that... or is it a special module?
TRP posted:dkennemo posted:Wolfgang, really like the diagram. But as far as the gauges themselves, who makes the most accurate ones - or do people just buy originals?
I bought originals and had them professionally restored at Palo Alto Speedo. Teby did the same except he used Hollywood Speedo. They look good. Function well. Very expensive for what you get.
So TRP - here's the million dollar question. You paid a premium and got a premium product. Was it worth it? If you sit the gauges you have side by side with traditional replica gauges such as Beck's or IM's. do you think, "oh yeah, mine definitely look far superior"?
Not nocking the new gauges made by Beck or IM. They just look too new modern ... for me. I had original Brazil replica units before the rebuilt units, truth be told? Those were rock solid except the trip meeter didnt work, and the tach bounced. These two items bugged me. A smart man would have addressed those simple issues.
Don't get me wrong, my new gauges are beautiful. Are they $2500.00 beautiful? Do they look new but not too modern? I would never tell anyone yes to those two questions.
Nothing about my car makes sense. This is why they call it the madness.
If the madness really takes hold and you insist on rear beehives then go for the pre-A dash too! Fiberglass replica for $395 with glove box!
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/cl...etail.php?id=2073456
dkennemo posted:TRP posted:dkennemo posted:Wolfgang, really like the diagram. But as far as the gauges themselves, who makes the most accurate ones - or do people just buy originals?
I bought originals and had them professionally restored at Palo Alto Speedo. Teby did the same except he used Hollywood Speedo. They look good. Function well. Very expensive for what you get.
So TRP - here's the million dollar question. You paid a premium and got a premium product. Was it worth it? If you sit the gauges you have side by side with traditional replica gauges such as Beck's or IM's. do you think, "oh yeah, mine definitely look far superior"?
I had N. Hollywood do up a set of 914 gauges for my Spyder project, despite having perfectly serviceable, brand new Chinese repop 356 gauges with the kit, and a set of Brazilian 356 gauges, NOS, on hand.
As explained before, I did it to get the correct sized gauges with the correct faces and ranges (100mm-diameter 250 kph speedo instead of 105mm-diameter and 130 mph; 115 mm diameter, 8k rpm tach instead of 105mm and 6k), because I've gone insane. Every damn detail.
But if you set the gauges out all at once and really look at them, yes: you can easily see the difference in the N. Hollywood gauges. Compared to the Brazilian gauges, the screen is crisper, the background color deeper, and the works are just nicer. Like looking at a very expensive watch next to a Timex.
Setting the Brazilian gauges next to the Chines is like putting the Timex next to a $4 drugstore watch. The Brazilian's buttons are better defined, the screen is a bit better, and so on.
They all look nice, don't get me wrong. No one is going to point and laugh at any of these when checking out your car.
And all these are mechanical: the speedo runs from a cable in the front left hub. The odometer is a cylinder with 10 numbers on gears, not an LCD display. The advantages of this are simplicity, cost, independence from satellites and the fact that they look like they belong in a 60-year-old car.
The disadvantages: plastic gears that break forever the first time you hit the trip reset while rolling (or in 5 years, whichever comes first), occasional broken cables, and in the Chinese/Brazilian case, common (not universal) jumpy tach syndrome, which is reportedly curable with a diode but I don't know. You also can't easily calibrate the speedo to your tire/rim size, which is reportedly a snap with the new GPS gauges.
So: you basically get what you pay for, and in my opinion, the gauge pecking order is.
Best: Original VDO/Porsche gauges (or later repops) rebuilt by Palo Alto or N. Hollywood. About $1,700-$2,500, depending on condition. 3-6-month wait.
Damn Good: Current Beck 356 GPS. About $800! (including the senders) Act Now!
Pretty good: Brazilian VDO repops @about $300 for the set. Talk to me if you want my set.
Good enough, maybe?: Chinese repops. Say $150 for the set.
Hi, I am building a 1956 speedster replica. I have templated but not cut based on the dimensions from the African Speedster template guide. Attached I have scale adjusted a photo from Porsche.com where they show an original Speedster dash and then using the 100mm gauges as a size I know, I created this template. The 77mm spacing in the Porsche Dash emblem was accurate to my original emblem. The question I have is the following. The left furthest gauge is lower then the speedo gauge - If I am to understand that the original has them in that order (oil/fuel, then RPM, then speedo - left to right)? Is this because someone had a bad day measuring the holes, or is this how it should be? Hopefully this helps someone else out for other measurements. I am also wondering if someone can tell me what side the wiper switch goes and the headlight switch? Thanks
That's a coupe/cabriolet dash, Dave, and things are laid out a bit differently. To @Swytech's questions, yes, the left hand gauge is a bit lower than the right hand one. I believe it's to follow the curvature of the top of the dash. As for the switches, the headlight is between the lefthand gauge and the door, while the wipers are to the right of the gauges. I don't have a drawing, but someone here will no doubt have one. The speedo is supposed to be on the right of the tach, but most replicas have it on the left because the Beetle speedo cable isn't long enough to reach to the right.
I put the speedo on the left because that's where most original Spyders had it and it keeps the wife from clearly seeing how fast we're going.
My decision had zero to do with the cable length, my speedo is GPS: no cable.
This might be a short, interesting winter project for me - find and measure everything on an original Speedster dash for, say, 1958 (I already did this for a 1955 Pre-A car).
Two local original Speedsters have been recently sold, but Hot Rod Jimmy has his recently restored '58 so I'll see if he's here and not in Florida and entice him with a free Dunkin Donuts coffee to let me measure his dash. No promises (he usually winters in Florida). His brother, Hot Rod Charlie, has a '63 B-series Super 90 coupe he's restoring so later in the Spring, when he returns from Florida, I can measure that, too (for all you Lane Anderson super-clone wannabees out there).
@Gordon Nichols posted:This might be a short, interesting winter project for me - find and measure everything on an original Speedster dash for, say, 1958 (I already did this for a 1955 Pre-A car).
Two local original Speedsters have been recently sold, but Hot Rod Jimmy has his recently restored '58 so I'll see if he's here and not in Florida and entice him with a free Dunkin Donuts coffee to let me measure his dash. No promises (he usually winters in Florida). His brother, Hot Rod Charlie, has a '63 B-series Super 90 coupe he's restoring so later in the Spring, when he returns from Florida, I can measure that, too (for all you Lane Anderson super-clone wannabees out there).
Gordon.
I can say that the measurements you provided me for my IM6 Pre-A dash certainly helped.
I called Jimmy and half of his extended family has Covid. 
That means that he'll not be heading to Florida this month, and I may have a shot at getting photos and dimensions by the end of the month. He also has dashes for an A, B and C so we can see what the differences are and document them, too.
Stay tuned...
Yes the guages kind of follow the shape of the dash sometimes even the steering wheels seems to be uncentered so it depends how much the madness has already gotten you as you go along with a build Crazy.... lol
i have gotten used to the tach in the middle and left of speedo....been awhile, but i believe my '65 type 3 squareback (1st car) & my '68 type 2 bus (3rd car) where the same...i keep fiddling with stuff...since i have liquid cooling...and have electric gauges ie: oil press...water temp..volts my multi gauge lights are delete....except my high blue beam bulb, (that john-boy wired up,but felt ok leaving a bulb out of, go figure?) which i remedied and left it non LED so it isn't a blue
laser beam in my eyes....the LED bulbs are a MUST DO! 
.....just IMHO
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It all depends on how you drive.
If the steering wheel can possibly interfere with half of a gauge, best to place the gauge where its more useful half is always visible.
Most of us want the speedo on the right, so you can always see the first half of the scale (0-65 mph).
You can understand how Danny would want it the other way around.
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P.S.: I have a Nardi three spoke, it doesn't matter which side it's on. But as I said, traditionally 550s had it on the left. So I went with tradition.
I don't understand why steering wheels are not centered on the gauges and eyebrow.
My CMC kit was delivered that way too but I modified the bracket to center the wheel.
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I think in the photo I posted, the wheel is also centered, but the camera may not have been.
With the original 15-inch wheels, you could move your head off-center quite a bit and still see all gauges pretty clearly.
A lot of our cars, though, have slightly smaller wheels. My Nardi repop is 14 inches, and part of the speedo is often obscured. I do like the smaller wheel for a few reasons. There's plenty of leverage for such a light front end and the smaller wheel quickens the ratio a bit. There's also a little more leg clearance underneath.
Still, I'm saving my pennies for a Nardi Anni-50, which is available only in 15-inch:
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Mike Lempert could make it any size you want without paying the Nardi premium.
Just be careful not to go too big or you'll block your legs. We really don't have a lot of room to work with in these cars.
When the wheel gets too big it can REALLY impede getting in and out, regardless of driver girth. Even toothpick legs could have a problem with a large steering wheel.
Did the steering column/floorpan/seat geometry of an original car allow more clearance than a typical pan-based replica?
The original P wheels were 15-inch (I’m pretty sure), but most replicas seem to be equipped with 14-inch wheels out of the box. I’ve got the thinner, speedster seats on standard tracks - Kirk’s default install.
@IaM-Ray posted:Mike Lempert could make it any size you want without paying the Nardi premium.
Mike made me two wheels. Both well made.
Above I said I don't understand why steering wheels are not centered on the gauges and eyebrow. For pan-based cars, it probably was to keep the steering wheel centered on the seat.
My wheel is centered on the gauges and not centered on the seat. I pretty much don't notice it is not centered on the seat. I would notice every time I got behind the wheel if it was not centered on the gauges.
I may be able to do steering wheel placement, height and "typical" wheel diameter when I measure Jim's dash - He's running a stock, original Banjo wheel. I can't do the same for the '63 coupe because the interior's out and the body's on a rotisserie this winter but I might be able to get the wheel diameter elsewhere.
Jim's wheel and dash:
A couple more photos, Nardi and Original: Nardi in a '58 Speedster - The Nardi looks about 1" dia. smaller?
And an original in a '55 Speedster.
And a "B" dash like Lane's:
On my original 59A coupe I believe the wheel was 420mm but it could have been 400mm, but certainly wasn't 14 or 15 inches.
400mm - 15.75", 420mm = 16.5"
Those were some big wheels.
I've got no idea why your first attachment is not showing up, @Gordon Nichols, but I suspect it's because it's not an "added attachment"? I've got no dog in the hunt, but we can't see the first picture.
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Apparently, I misspoke.
Best I can Google, the original Porsche VDM wheels were 420 mm, or as Lane notes, 16.5".
The repop in my car is a 360mm (14.25") copy of the Nardi Classic (which is available in a few sizes).
The Nardi Anni-50 (which, for some reason, costs twice as much as the 'Classic') is 380 mm, or about 15", so about 3/4" larger than what I have.
From my seating position (I'm 5'9"), the top of my head is below the top of the windshield, but the 14" wheel blocks the tops of the gauges. Another 3/4 inch of diameter would help a lot, and still leave enough room under the wheel for ingress/egress.
A 16.5" wheel would be unusable - for me at least - in this car with the seat at its current height, so I'm thinking the original cars had different geometry. Without a tunnel or a central handbrake lever, the seats must have been closer to the car's center line, and maybe lower in the car as well.
The wheel in my car does seem to be centered, left to right, on the eyebrow over the instruments.
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I loved the 16.5 inch 420mm wheel it just felt like a real classic and made the worm Roll a lot easier, having a worm and roller steering box. the leverage advantage is substantial.
@Stan Galat It was a photo of a local '58 Speedster dash. No big deal and I have no idea how to fix it. That one photo came from an iCloud folder. THAT might be the reason, but I don't know and will try playing with things to figure it out. I'm also running on a new laptop and am still learning the cockpit procedures.
Sorry about that !
@Sacto Mitch posted:I'm thinking the original cars had different geometry. Without a tunnel or a central handbrake lever, the seats must have been closer to the car's center line, and maybe lower in the car as well.
The wheel in my car does seem to be centered, left to right, on the eyebrow over the instruments.
Bingo.
@Stan Galat I found that reading the post with my iPad, not the laptop, gives me the “image not found” notice, too.
The plot thickens…….
@IaM-Ray posted:On my original 59A coupe I believe the wheel was 420mm but it could have been 400mm, but certainly wasn't 14 or 15 inches.
I was waiting for that.
Yes! All them old cars had 16, even 17-inch wheels, with skinny little rims. They look and work perfect, and everyone ought to stick with them as far as is possible. I put a 16.5-inch (?) Brooklands Bluemel style banjo wheel on my TD and it absolutely transformed the car. The Flat-4 wheel on the Spyder is 15.5 inches and it'll just about pass. But when you guys start getting into these 14-ers and smaller, trying to save knee and belly(?) room, you're (more often than not) doing violence to a sacred aesthetic.
A Lempert wheel in 14? Sure. Mike understands the assignment. But if you go with something like this—
even if it feels good—you dishonor your ancestors. And every man on this board.
Friends, owning a Speedster or Spyder replica is more than just a convenient consumer choice. Indeed! It's more than just a Way of Life!
It is a calling. And it is a responsibility. You must adjust your desires to the needs of the car. Every choice you make reflects on all of the rest of us. Choose wisely.
I have thought about that reflecting on the rest of us thing from time to time. It was mostly when I saw Speedsters belonging to people not on this site.
All this talk about "respecting the aesthetic" makes me wanna' put one of these bad boys on my car.
... well, not really, because what I like is the biggest wheel I can get behind.
But believe me when I say - I'm not thinking of you, I'm thinking of me.
It's a clown car. Do what you like.
^ Bwaaaa.... @Stan Galat if so, then you need to change your shifter to one of these...
@MusbJim posted:^ Bwaaaa.... @Stan Galat if so, then you need to change your shifter to one of these...
That looks frage-jill-ay.
@edsnova I seriously hope that whole "dishonor" thing was tongue-in-cheek.
You have two fiberglass replicas. One is an English body copy on hacked up German running gear with a Japanese flat 4 in the back instead of an inline-4 tractor motor in front.
I'm with Stan. It's a REPLICA. Do whatever makes your boat float.
I'll go further with a small detail on my particular plastic-fantastic. My cable(oh, the horror!) shifter is in between the seats where it is easy to use. My e-brake is just to the right. This is backwards from "originality" but is a few leaps forward in function. I'm all about the driving function, and if it looks good too it's a bonus.
Mike's Spyder that I built a motor for and did some fabrication had it the "original" way, and it worked horribly. It was difficult to drive. I was able to get both shifter and e-brake between the seats, and MAN it was a tight fit. But I got it in there and it works. The e-brake is in the middle and the shifter just to the right. It works wonderfully and Mike is happy. The shifter is NOT in front of the passenger seat "as original". 
You can see the two holes in the floor where the Fibersteel shifter mounted. This necessitated raising the passenger seat about 2.5" which put the passengers melon way about the windshield. Not fun.
I'll stop there.
P.S.: That clunky PBS shift rod has been replaced by a beautiful round tapered rod. That was just for setup purposes.
