I ordered a Beck and an installed fire extinguisher but I don't want to take up any room in the passenger compartment. If you have, I would really appreciate a photo.
Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
I ordered a Beck and an installed fire extinguisher but I don't want to take up any room in the passenger compartment. If you have, I would really appreciate a photo.
This is the best picture I have. You can see one end of the extinguisher on the left side of the driver's seat. That location doesn't get in the way of entry/exit, and it's close by if you need it.
Attachments
Images (1)
i mounted mine right behind the driver seat. i fabed up a metal plate the is sandwiched between the bracket and carpet. only 3 little holes through the carpet and is totally secure.
I have two.One mounted under the dash on the passenger side in a mount,pull down to use.The second is placed behind the passenger side seat (my car caught fire 2 months ago) I was shocked to discover than the flow is just for seconds....I'll feel better with a back-up.
You mean a built-in fire suppression system (~$400) or just a portable Halon fire extinguisher ($60)? After seeing some fiberglass body "after" pictures - ya might want to consider both! A 1# unit is NOT big enough.
One of my close friends is the North American distributor for DSPA fire suppression systems. (dry sprinkler powder aerosol) They just finished developing a small unit for race cars and he's been bugging me to do something with them. You can Google DSPA fire and watch video on the "industrial" unit. It has a pin, like a grenade, but the automotive unit is all self contained and is set off via fire.
What's the replacement for the old Halon fire extinguisher? I don't want to keep the dry powder extinguisher I currently have, but was told that Halon is no longer available. Is there a replacement chemical (gas) extinguisher that's available as a handheld that would be big enough to be adequate? ...resonably priced?
Thxs
Doug
Thxs
Doug
As far as I know Halon is still preferred for outside use on engine fires. Know computer rooms banned it years ago - but thats in a confined space. Chemical extinguishers do real corrosive damage on alloy engines. Guess once magnesium alloy block gets burning - its sit and wait for it to go out anyhow (will burn under water). Maybe Cory will chime in on what to use?
Carey, I like the idea of an engine compartment fire supression unit that is triggered by fire. That sounds like a real winner (as long as engine heat doesn't trigger it) Maybe I can be the Guinea pig and your friend will cut me a price break. I'm thinkin' free for the use of my blabbermouth skills :)
The replacement for Halon is Halotron:
http://www.halotron.com/halotron1.php
http://www.halotron.com/halotron1.php
Fireworks for Halloween? Did I see couple empty Molson Ale bottles in background?
Neven't seen a magnesium case on fire but supposely they burn white hot like a welding torch arc - adding water does nothing except to perhaps cause more havoc. One report said they burn for an hour. I had VW engine fire years ago that melted the carb to a ball of aluminum but luckily didn't catch case on fire.
Neven't seen a magnesium case on fire but supposely they burn white hot like a welding torch arc - adding water does nothing except to perhaps cause more havoc. One report said they burn for an hour. I had VW engine fire years ago that melted the carb to a ball of aluminum but luckily didn't catch case on fire.
When we would take our sand rail out to Glamis Dunes or Pismo Beach, there would inevitably be someone who would put an old VW engine case on the bonfire. Once that magnesium lit up, it was like a supernova! Yikes!
I successfully mounted a small chrome plated extinguisher upright, sitting on the driver's side door sill. It is a '06 Vintage Speedster. I drilled the two mounting holes in the fiberglass and mounted it so that the extinguisher sits like it would on a table. It is far enough behind where the seat-back is that it is out of the way when entering or exiting the car -- plus, it looks pretty cool right there. When you open the driver side door, there it sits for everyone to see. Sorry I don't have a pic handy.
On the dining room table no less. Now there's a genuine Village Idiot....
On "Candy" the white speedster I sold, I purchased a used built-in fire suppression system off eBay for $170. Mounted the bottle in the front trunk under the front cowl, ran the manual operating cable with a 1.5" bright red knob to left of the steering column., The supply line was routed to the engine bay, tee'd to the left and right firewalls(pun)and made nozzles out of brass fittings.
Does this system work .... don't know, I assume that it will if needed by the present owner. ~Alan
On "Candy" the white speedster I sold, I purchased a used built-in fire suppression system off eBay for $170. Mounted the bottle in the front trunk under the front cowl, ran the manual operating cable with a 1.5" bright red knob to left of the steering column., The supply line was routed to the engine bay, tee'd to the left and right firewalls(pun)and made nozzles out of brass fittings.
Does this system work .... don't know, I assume that it will if needed by the present owner. ~Alan
Thanks to everyone, so far, for their input. Depending on the cost, I like the idea of a fire supression unit underhood triggered by fire or remote control of somekind. If that doesn't work out, I like Alan L's vertical mount on the driver's side idea. I'll wait to see what Carey come up with first on the U/H idea. I seemed to have lucked into the best customer support that one can find in this business when I met the Hines family and Special Edition.
Mounted mine horizontally, on top of the central tunnel, between the seats, just behind the emergency brake handle, with quick-break hold-down straps.
I figured that, if a fire were to start, I wanted the extinguisher to be right there by my elbow and not have to look for it, OR struggle to get it out.
gn
I figured that, if a fire were to start, I wanted the extinguisher to be right there by my elbow and not have to look for it, OR struggle to get it out.
gn
I have a Halon fire system that is being installed in my Spyder this year in the off-season. It is similar to Al Merklin's in that it is remote and cable actuated. The 5 lb. bottle goes in front of the RF wheel under the headlight. I purchased this back in 2002 before they changed the Halon/laws. There will be three jets, one for each carb and one aimed at the Eberspacher gas heater that is also being installed.
If you have a backfire, make sure you get the car running and then open the throttle wide, there is a very good chance the fire will get sucked back into the engine. Of course an excellent state of tune of the engine is very important. Just so you don't have to use that extinguisher. Sometimes(most of the time?) when there is an actual fire it is worsened when the engine compartment is opened, adding all that fresh oxygen to the mix. Another good reason to install a fire system with a remote cable.
If you have a backfire, make sure you get the car running and then open the throttle wide, there is a very good chance the fire will get sucked back into the engine. Of course an excellent state of tune of the engine is very important. Just so you don't have to use that extinguisher. Sometimes(most of the time?) when there is an actual fire it is worsened when the engine compartment is opened, adding all that fresh oxygen to the mix. Another good reason to install a fire system with a remote cable.
In which of the many, past, Merklin Speedsters once here but now gone, was a central fire extinguisher installed?
Maybe breaking it down further by exterior color or interior accoutrements or special trim details (or whether Kim liked it at all or even got a chance to ride in it) might help us all home in on one of several that might be the right one as an example of NASA-Style fire suppression.
Or maybe it was in the fake Corvette, or the Ziata, or that Gazelle, or whateverhthehell that purple thing was that he bought at Carlisle three years ago?
Inquiring minds (and Fox News) want to know (I guess)...........
Oh! And Tom Blankinship - getting back to the original topic of this now seriously drifted thread:
If you mount your fire extinguisher in the front compartment (I'm assuming you mean in the trunk area up front), consider this:
In the time it takes you to discover/realize that you, indeed, have a fire going on in the engine compartment behind you, then get out of the car, then remember, in your panic and excitement, that you have to pop the hood, finally get the hood up, position the prop rod so the hood doesn't fall on you, grab the extinguisher and head to the back, remember that you have to pop the engine cover, get that done and then lift the engine cover only to be greeted by a BIG honkin' flame, then try to hold the cover up without getting burned and spraying the engine with the extinguisher in the other hand, you've probably just lost the rear of your car and maybe your engine. Ask some of the people who have been unfortunate enough to have had engine fires - they happen real fast.
Half-seconds are a big deal, here. Anything you can do to remove seconds or even half seconds from the time it takes to get the extinguisher to the flames makes a BIG difference in whether you will save your car or not. Think about that and design your system or extinguisher placement accordingly. If it's in the cockpit (which every racer without a full, semi-automatic suppression system will recommend) then you should be able to reach it, release it and take off with it in less than two seconds. THAT's your benchmark to meet.
gn
Maybe breaking it down further by exterior color or interior accoutrements or special trim details (or whether Kim liked it at all or even got a chance to ride in it) might help us all home in on one of several that might be the right one as an example of NASA-Style fire suppression.
Or maybe it was in the fake Corvette, or the Ziata, or that Gazelle, or whateverhthehell that purple thing was that he bought at Carlisle three years ago?
Inquiring minds (and Fox News) want to know (I guess)...........
Oh! And Tom Blankinship - getting back to the original topic of this now seriously drifted thread:
If you mount your fire extinguisher in the front compartment (I'm assuming you mean in the trunk area up front), consider this:
In the time it takes you to discover/realize that you, indeed, have a fire going on in the engine compartment behind you, then get out of the car, then remember, in your panic and excitement, that you have to pop the hood, finally get the hood up, position the prop rod so the hood doesn't fall on you, grab the extinguisher and head to the back, remember that you have to pop the engine cover, get that done and then lift the engine cover only to be greeted by a BIG honkin' flame, then try to hold the cover up without getting burned and spraying the engine with the extinguisher in the other hand, you've probably just lost the rear of your car and maybe your engine. Ask some of the people who have been unfortunate enough to have had engine fires - they happen real fast.
Half-seconds are a big deal, here. Anything you can do to remove seconds or even half seconds from the time it takes to get the extinguisher to the flames makes a BIG difference in whether you will save your car or not. Think about that and design your system or extinguisher placement accordingly. If it's in the cockpit (which every racer without a full, semi-automatic suppression system will recommend) then you should be able to reach it, release it and take off with it in less than two seconds. THAT's your benchmark to meet.
gn
I'd have a supression system if I could afford it but I cant,maybe one day.In the meantime I carry 2 extinguishers.Thats from experience.I had a fire and managed to put it out (my engine cover stays open with an automatic lock) One extinguisher lasted a very short time but it was enough.....this time.
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/Fire-Suppression-Goes-Off_702304.htm
Well a project this winter....goodie! I have been looking at restaurant fire suppression systems. They use a hard pipe not hose that go over the cooking surfaces with nozzles on the end like brass garden hose nozzles. I think this would work perfect with a Halon cell in the front and a mechanical (not) electrical pull button hidden under the dash. The pipe maybe 3/8" can be bent and threaded to snake under the car and since we have an opening in the back where the engine is have a 'T' like the 'T' for the brake line deliver gas to each side of the engine bay. May sound like a poor mans way to build one, but I am positive this would work. The hardest part is designing the trigger!
Well that's my project over the winter, that and designing roll up windows on my "whoever made this car" Speedster.
Well a project this winter....goodie! I have been looking at restaurant fire suppression systems. They use a hard pipe not hose that go over the cooking surfaces with nozzles on the end like brass garden hose nozzles. I think this would work perfect with a Halon cell in the front and a mechanical (not) electrical pull button hidden under the dash. The pipe maybe 3/8" can be bent and threaded to snake under the car and since we have an opening in the back where the engine is have a 'T' like the 'T' for the brake line deliver gas to each side of the engine bay. May sound like a poor mans way to build one, but I am positive this would work. The hardest part is designing the trigger!
Well that's my project over the winter, that and designing roll up windows on my "whoever made this car" Speedster.
Attachments
Images (1)
Stephen, please elaborate on "my engine cover stays open with an automatic lock"
I know that $300 seems like a lot of dough, but my car cost a lot more than that, plus all the sweat and time I've put into it. Well, now the system costs $450, I guess due to the change of Halon and inflation from 7 years ago. I think the systems were around $350 for one, so the group buy was a good deal. Yeah, I know I haven't installed mine yet, but just think about it. How much is your car worth to you?
Gordon is right, seconds count. I bet I could activate my system in about a second or two, if needed(that is, after I actually install it!)
As far as tubing, the safecraft system comes with 1/4" OD aluminum tubing, ferrules, and three nozzles. Not a big deal to flare with a standard, cheap flare tool. I know there are various flare tools out there of different angles and single and reverse flares, etc. Aluminum is soft enough that the angles don't really matter, anyway. The system won't run under too much pressure when you set it off, the nozzles have pretty big holes. Volume is the key here. The nozzles are hex-shaped, with about a 3/32" hole in three consecutive faces of the hex. So close to 180 degree spray of the gas at each nozzle. The bottle has two threaded fittings for tubing, and it is OK to T the tube at the back for two carbs.
The mechanical valve at the bottle is via a pull cable. The pull cable has a safety pin and flag that protects the big red handle from being pulled inadvertently. Beware with little kids that like to touch things!
So I guess you could build your own if you want to. We did a group buy of 6 systems from a dude over at Spyderclub.com. Maybe you guys could do that here to lower the cost?
Here is the system we bought:
http://www.safecraft.com/product_page_detail.asp?ProductID=87&ProductCatID=1&ProductSubCatID=5&menu=&Search=
Gordon is right, seconds count. I bet I could activate my system in about a second or two, if needed(that is, after I actually install it!)
As far as tubing, the safecraft system comes with 1/4" OD aluminum tubing, ferrules, and three nozzles. Not a big deal to flare with a standard, cheap flare tool. I know there are various flare tools out there of different angles and single and reverse flares, etc. Aluminum is soft enough that the angles don't really matter, anyway. The system won't run under too much pressure when you set it off, the nozzles have pretty big holes. Volume is the key here. The nozzles are hex-shaped, with about a 3/32" hole in three consecutive faces of the hex. So close to 180 degree spray of the gas at each nozzle. The bottle has two threaded fittings for tubing, and it is OK to T the tube at the back for two carbs.
The mechanical valve at the bottle is via a pull cable. The pull cable has a safety pin and flag that protects the big red handle from being pulled inadvertently. Beware with little kids that like to touch things!
So I guess you could build your own if you want to. We did a group buy of 6 systems from a dude over at Spyderclub.com. Maybe you guys could do that here to lower the cost?
Here is the system we bought:
http://www.safecraft.com/product_page_detail.asp?ProductID=87&ProductCatID=1&ProductSubCatID=5&menu=&Search=
Thanks everyone for all of the input. I've decided that I'm going to install an engine compartment system that is either automatic or triggered from the passenger compartment. It will be more expensive, but the piece of mind is worth it, plus no clutter in the passenger compartment :). If the system is not automatic, I will hide the trigger under the dash on the left side of the steering wheel away from little hands....another good tip.
Brian,it's an automatic stay that I also have for my bonnet.It comes from various kit car suppliers for applications such as ours.It's basically a non specific hold that a lot of production cars have.As I lift the bonnet or engine cover,it reaches a point where a lock drops into a hole keeping the length constant.To drop the cover you need to lift slightly and push in the lock,it then drops back down.
Just got a new JEGS catalog - they have a FireBottle unit for $462 (hazardous shipping adds $22 to all). They also have one from Shroud Safety for $356 with Halon and $382 for new FE-36. FireBottle says NHRA approved - no such note on the Shroud unit.
SRBlower - do you use the automatic hood stay on front hood too? Can you post phote or provide where it gets mounted. I have one and want to drill one set of holes -- vice swiss cheesing the hood. Do you use one for front hood or 2?
SRBlower - do you use the automatic hood stay on front hood too? Can you post phote or provide where it gets mounted. I have one and want to drill one set of holes -- vice swiss cheesing the hood. Do you use one for front hood or 2?
What size hand held units are people using, 1.4 or 2.5 lb.?
It would be nice to see more pictures of these mounted in the car.
Halon seems to still be available. Does anyone have an opinion about Halon versus Halotron? One website said Halotron is only 70% as effective as Halon. I know that I should feel bad about discharging Halon.
It would be nice to see more pictures of these mounted in the car.
Halon seems to still be available. Does anyone have an opinion about Halon versus Halotron? One website said Halotron is only 70% as effective as Halon. I know that I should feel bad about discharging Halon.
I have done more research on Halon versus Halotron.
The extinguishers have a rating with a number in front of two letters.
The number relates to the size of fire.
A 2.5 pound halon has a rating of 5BC
A 1.25 pound halon has a rating of 2BC
A 2.5 pound Halotron has a rating of 2BC
So, it looks like a 2.5 pound Halotron is equivalent to a 1.25 Halon.
The 2.5 pound Halon extinguisher I am interested in seems slightly too long to mount as Gordon mounted his.
The extinguishers have a rating with a number in front of two letters.
The number relates to the size of fire.
A 2.5 pound halon has a rating of 5BC
A 1.25 pound halon has a rating of 2BC
A 2.5 pound Halotron has a rating of 2BC
So, it looks like a 2.5 pound Halotron is equivalent to a 1.25 Halon.
The 2.5 pound Halon extinguisher I am interested in seems slightly too long to mount as Gordon mounted his.
Wolfgang,I've sent 4 pics to your email address.Let me know if you need more.
Stephen, please copy me with the pictures. Thank you.
Will do Brian
Stephen - Rec'd pictures THXs.
I'm thinking environmental damage is less from Halon then from burning fiberglass resins, oil and gas! Apparently FE-36 is preferred replacement. DuPont
I'm thinking environmental damage is less from Halon then from burning fiberglass resins, oil and gas! Apparently FE-36 is preferred replacement. DuPont