Head work

Hi Guys I finally got around to porting the 1668 Los Bandidos heads for 87 jugs I got from CB.Performace last fall. I drilled out the guides as instructed and everything went slick as a kitten..

Flawlessly, no metal tear outs nothing scratched or damaged. But now the stock guides I have wont work in these heads with these bigger valves with smaller stems and the exhaust guides are over sized.

I have to work the next 2 nights I got bumped to night shift after the last big layoff. But I still have a job at least for now !!##????.

Does any of you have some pull at CB.P to help me make sure I get the right guides for this puppy. I hope to get back over to the shop Friday with a set of mics to phone in the spec's. I called 2 times today and only got one of the Ladies. It's looking like they have had some layoffs to.. I have to be patcent. because they are short handed. But if any of you know anyone that knows the deal on these guides. I'd like he spec.s to compare to mine..

Thanks Guys

Can't help you with your questions, Barry, but I'll bet Vince is gonna have fun with your topic name.

Vince needs to get a life. out side of this site..

But on the lighter side The port work turned out excellent. And i pretty sure C.B.Performance . has the right parts ,if we can just match what I had..

I not rushing it because i had to send the new pistons back also. They didn't properly clearance the rod boss's The connecting rods wouldn't even slide into the pistons . They looked perfect otherwise. but that was their Boo Boo not mine. I sent them all 4 clyinders and a old 85.5 piston and a new 87 piston . They miss that one all by them self's..

Barry,

When I put new silicon bronze guides into my heads, I found that there are a lot of different diameter ones available. In any event, be sure to get the correct outside diameter. After being pushed into the heads, they will have to have the inside diameters sized with a reamer. Too tight and the fit will generate too much heat. Too loose and they allow oil to get past.

Chuck

"They didn't properly clearance the rod boss's The connecting rods wouldn't even slide into the pistons . They looked perfect otherwise. but that was their Boo Boo not mine. I sent them all 4 clyinders and a old 85.5 piston and a new 87 piston . They miss that one all by them self's.. "

You are too kind--Try they didn't even look at them. I'd be afraid, very afraid.

I mic'ed them myself when we opened the box they are the right diameter, The vw rings did fit the one we pre fitted . What happened?? They thought it was a Turbo motor. I going to give them a chance. But I DID WARN THEM they better be right or i want a total reinburshment and I do have the S.A.G forms right here to turn their butts in. And I let them know it.

C.B.Perf. Got up with me Thursday afternoon. I called in the spec.s and they returned my call and said they had the guides picked out by my spec's And that only one combo they use, that hits that spec and it is on the 1668 head .(A Confirmation) and they will ship them on out. so that fixes that.

Know, If work will just pick up?? .. I'm layied off for a week.

This is your opportunity. Use this time wisely, get moving! If you're waiting for them to throw you a line you will have missed it. Strike first.-Good luck!

The only job oppertunities around here are 30 miles away. I am going to wait one week and if that it. Thats it.

In this economy and at my age. who the heck is going to hire a 52 year old nearly blind american who was making 15 bucks a hr. when they have all these illegal imigrents that will work for almost half around here they out number us 2 to 1..

It's a terrible community with break in's all over and now I fear gonna get worse very fast.

I stocked up on Ammo last month any rouges come looking they are going to get a butt full.. I even made some armor pearcers for a monified 20 gauge shot gun 2 lbs of lead in the stock to kill the kick that will stop anything even a rig so my brother said.

I,ve posted the property and put out warnings around here. My mom said I was crazy. Then she got mugged at the grocery store. Her tune changed pretty quick. I have to knock, these days when I come home.

The law is crappy around here. I know a few tricks myself that even worries the swat teams. I have friends it that busness too. and im a quick study.

I'm (NOT) going looking for trouble. but it better stay the heck out of here if it knows what good for itself.. I'm playing for keeps and that's what I told the county Shierf.. We have the right to bear arms and defend our homes.in this country And I am prepared to use deadly force.

Barry

I drive 40+ miles one way and have had yearlong jobs that are 75+ miles away (construction). Its a fact of life in this country.

The advice to look for work while you are hanging out is a good idea.

Sorry about your mom.

Hope everything works out and good luck with the engine.

Best Regards
Dave

Well mom only got a few bumps and bruises . That is sound advise. But I have been looking all along. I have hated textiles almost from the start. I have tried at least 3 times to leave it,and always wound up back in this mess. Their just isn't anything out there worth the effort. that can even come close to the pay. In Siler City the town I was born in. there are only 2 companies of any value One a chicken proscessing plant and the other is a old lumber yard. No thanks!

My only hope is to strike out on my own with a needed web based job from home.. That makes it a level playing field!

Well here I go again. I got the valve guides back from CBP Thursday and got a chance to check them Friday 4 intake are right and 4 exhaust wrong . I kept the right ones and sent the 4 wrong ones back with a old exhaust guide that had been drilled but the outside is right.. I left them a note half right valve fits the o.31 guide but the exhaust guides fall though the head holes. That need s to be 0.51 OD guides.

Now this getting stupidly redeculious.. I called in the right spec's last time... and left in Danial's care to correct this is someones boobed on their end But It better be right this time coming or I well want to have a talk with Tom myself and see if they want thier heads back and give me a total refund Including the labor for the port work I did .

And then call Scat racing.

This is elephant POOP

Ok! Morning Thursday Feb 19 i got a Ups notification from CB-P so the new guides are in the mail.

My pistons came back Wednesday and spec.ed out perfect. So maybe I will get this together in 3 weeks. and see what we have..

Barry - good luck with your project!!

Thanks Jim. The day I did the head slicking. I had a visitor that gave me a story about flowing heads and changing the shape I Emformed him that I did as little shape changing as possible. I only de burred and smoothed the ports by cleaning off the interior casting seams to a shiny shean being very careful not to open or alter the shape of the ports, and NOT take away any meat near the valve seats

They should be the same shape as they were when I got them only now they are smooth Inside. I did as little as possible.

If the guides I receive on the 24th match the old ones when miked? The heads should do very nice..

The pistons have been sized for expancion. They are billet race grade. From Ross Racing Pistons. with the wrist pins moved up by .180 thou.s to make case shimming unnessary.

The rods are CB-P H beams race rods of stock length.

I'm NOT going for great HP with the 87 jugs but I hope these upgrades will make a strong lower end. that can take some abuse.

The case is aluminum and the crank is a 74 stroke counterweighted steel crank . My only remaining concern is the grade of aluminum in the case. It's a CP-P Ampro I think? a CB-P product line.

If it's good I'm set, hopefully for a solid street engine.

If my job at work will stay steady. I will be building a second one for the bug. FOR!! we puttin des puppy in da Speedster (D)!!

My goal in this indeaver was to build a engine very close to the super 90 spec.s. It is very close I may could have done a little better on crank and rod selection. Hey no bodies perfect.. But my resources are limited..

My last CB case held up to 30 pounds of boost and 516 hp at the flywheel on HEADS-UP dyno. With your combination it should last forever!

Thanks Troy. I sure need it to be tough. It's full flowed internally and will have T4 oil cooler on a very close to stock fan shroud. Heater pipes removed and neatly tig welded up and inner vanes diverted down to the heads and the doghouse was modified to carry the bigger oil cooler. I made 2 of them. One of them's on the beetle now. I'd say they should handle a 1725 to 1825 build perfectly.

Both cars have type-3 .003 audi/vw automatic's in them and from second to third they will rev a engine. That why I made the bottom end heavy duty.. I just hope its enough.

I do like how this engine sounds more like a real 356 engine.
It reminds me of the twin cam, but without the cam drive whine.

Here is a video of it. Sounds nothing like a Porsche though. Screams on the street!!!!!

http://media.putfile.com/full-clip-79

Troy - THAT sounds friggin AWESOME!!!!

Thanks, that's the motor in my Unlimited Street Car. Sort of the Outlaw Street VW race class.

http://www.unlimitedstreeteast.com

Troy- WOW- YOU DRIVE A BUG. just a littil sarcasume back at you!
do you drive the bug on the steet much? have any over heating problems on two cylenders with the 911 fan?--VERY NICE SOUNDING MOTOR
STEVE

Yup I drive a bug. My wife also has a drag bug. I race my car quite a bit over at 411 Dragway. I drive it on occasion. Mostly just out to lunch etc. The complete package has to be correct to stay cool. I added air deflectors in the housing to help the air flow. But is is only eight to one compression when it's not on boost. Don Pauter has a great view of the modifications to his fan housing on their web site. I also have another turbo motor with the VW dog house style on it. I think that is almost the best way to go. VW spent millions perfecting it.

TROY- THE SARCASUME WAS FROM -YOUR AK (WOW) COMENT ON ANOTHER TREAD.
ARE TOUR BUGS TYPE 1s or 4s?
i have bought gun parts from you for year when you use to do the "mike holliway" shows in K-town. i'm building a speedy with simmilar mods! would it be possiable to stop by your shop and check out some of your MODS that i might incorporat in to my speedy sence it looks like you've worked out the (BUGS)-YOU ARE ONLY 25mins;away THANKS STEVE ps; i use to DRAG BIKE'S AT 411 BEFORE THE CRASH ON THE STREET!!!OUCH

Sure give me a call at the shop. 865-932-6509

TROY -GOT IN TO LATE TO CALL. So what got you on the SPEEDSTER SITE BUG MAN-is the Speedster "MADNESS" GETTING TO YOU TO> OR IS THAT WHAT THAT OTHER TURBO MOTOR IS FOR a Speedster????----HHMMMMM!! STEVE

I've always wanted a speedster. I bought the one on the SAMBA out of Atlanta. Not started completing it yet. Getting the new race car ready. I've got to sell the old race car to make room in the garage for the speedster. Building a small stroker motor for the speedster. It won't be a race car! I'll be in the shop all day tomorrow.

Hey Troy , the last few times I've been up to Farmington. I get more and more discouraged, I see less Bugs every time.

I know this engine is no where near what your would want on the track. But in its last configuration it was getting 42 MPG. the 2 biggest changes now are big valve heads and a bump up from stock to 87 jugs.

I'm gambling that the dizzy and the carberators mods are the keys to this and not the valve size. But I still felt the head porting was very critical to keeping close to the 40mpg target for good power and economy..

The Hot Vw mileage motor was a 76 stroke X 85.5 bore engine with EFI heads. Mine was only a 74 X 85.5 with stock heads which helped it.

The Los Bandidos head bump up worries me a bit.. but I still have the other heads if it make it much worse .I could easily boost this engine the compression target is only 7 to 1. But I want to keep it as simple as I can. Its a daily driver. The compression drop is to help keep the head temps in the range I want it to run in It was 7.8 to 1. Now with bigger heads and jugs it will want to run hotter. So I tweeked it a bit.

I think you will have ZERO heating problems with the 87s. You might lose a little MPG if you have to re jet the carbs. Now also remember these little motors need a little heat to run effeciently and keep the moisture evaporated out of the oil. I have seen them over cooled. Every time you would pull the dip stick on these motors you would see milky spots in the oil. We had a little lady next to where I used to live that had an original 63 bug that she only drove real close to home. The guy that rebuilt it did not put the thermostat and flaps back in it and the oil always looked milky. I finally figured out the problem. Don't get too excited about a little heat.

When I was at the beach with the 356 a few years ago the temps would creep up over time at 80 mph. Never badly and it was a stock engine but I wanted the T4 oil cooler upgrade so I could do that and maintain slighy better load temps on long trips. The upgrades are not to much for a stocker The engine in the beetle right now is the same stocker that nearly threw a rod. before I got it to the parking lot at work, It was well overdue and I had babied the heck out of it the last year. At 277,thousand miles it was pooped..

The oil has been fine in it the 11 months since the rebuild. I had the mileage motor in it for 7 month and kept having Valve train issues it was just to loud and would not stay in adjustment. We pulled it last march and dropped the stocker back in But kept the T-4 cooler on it to see how it would do.. So far its a happy camper. But it's not getting much more than 31 mpg. The mileage motor had better power and economy.

We had discussed putting a Wiffle electro clutched belt driven Blower on it and plumbing it for a single 44 weber with noss. But I haven,t see a Wiffle blower set up for Bugs in years??

I'm Hooked,

I just need to get the kinks out of so it can last... I went to the shop this morning and rechecked all the guides the new exhaust are perfect . but after miking th intakes again saw a slight difference . That I corrected.

The ones out of the engine OD> was 0.47.20 the new ones were 0.47.55 I chucked them in a Alt.lathe by the shoulder bosses and swiped theme down with a flat file to match the old one's I'm not risking a cracked head bosses. I got them all the same as close as possible, to 0.47.20 ..

I don't for see any further problems with the valve guides.

But NOW!!! I am worried about work and having a job.. They are shutting down the mill again Friday