How do you make it rain in California?... buy a speedster.

Takes a good man and a gentlemen to step up ! .....You are right as it is difficult to "hear" the tone of an email conversation.

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Reply By TRP: How do you make it rain in California?... buy a
sp...
From: "SpeedsterOwners.com" <**************>
Date: Thu, August 11, 2016 6:22 pm
To: mcmscott <scott@metalcraftmotorsports.com>

An open letter to specialists of all kinds:

Dear Guru,

I've got a hobby I'm really enjoying, and you are an expert in the field. You come recommended by people I respect, but you've never met me. I know you get a lot of tire-kickers and guys just jerking you around, and I'm really sorry for that (it must get really old). It's hard to make a living like that.

Even though I'm new to this and you don't know me-- I'm asking you to give my intelligence the benefit of the doubt. It has nothing in common with your particular area of expertise, but I'm reasonably successful at what I do. That's the thing about this hobby-- I'm at least partly interested in it because it's not like how I make a living, and it's a bit of a diversion from the grind.

I'm really motivated to learn all I can, and ask a lot of questions. You know that there are internet forums for every possible hobby, and that I'm bound to gravitate towards them. Please don't think this is meant as disrespect. This thing you do, you do for a living, and I'm trying to learn about it to escape my way of making a living. This is all new and really cool to me. I'm diving into the deep end, and it's all very interesting.

So, as difficult as it must be for you-- I'd like to be part of the decision-making process and would like to learn as much as I can along the way. I know that you do this on a daily basis, and I'm not trying to question your advice or conclusions. We'll probably end up just doing what you think is best, but I'd like to understand why we are doing things this way instead of that.

The thing is-- if I just give you vague perimeters for a desired outcome, and you build what you think is best, and my involvement doesn't go beyond just writing a check-- the thing isn't a hobby anymore, it's just a transaction. I can wander down to the car dealer and do the same thing. I don't want that, or I would have done it already. The journey is at least as exciting as the destination, and I've got a hungry mind-- I'd really like to learn about this stuff along the way.

I know it must get old. You say you're busy and don't have time for this. I get that, but I wonder if you remember what it's like to get so excited about something that you just needed to know everything you could about it? That you couldn't sleep? I can't expect you to be that excited about this any more, as it's the way you put food on the table-- but if you take away my "back and forth", you're taking away the things that are helping me learn. I'm sure it's not important for you that I learn, but it's vitally important to me. I'm not just buying your service, I'm buying the process.

Please don't short-circuit that process. Please don't rob the joy I've got in learning about this thing . You're the guru. I'm probably going to end up doing what you think is right. But PLEASE let me spool out a bit-- give me some line to run before you start reeling me in. I'm spending a lot of money.

It's important to me to enjoy every step of the way.

Stan....  A terrific essay hitting home on all points ..impressive and should be archived !  The prior post surely won't generate new fiends and business relationships as every successful and established business person knows that all contacts (likable or not)  are a direct or indirect potential customer. Final thought.. Word of mouth is the best for or advertisement, integrity, tends to keep the lights on and a good night's rest.

 

 

Stan, that indeed is a beautifully composed intelligent essay.... and should be archived so undiplomatic arrogance, from any quarter, can be gracefully parried.  

Stan well said!  

Some clients want to be included in the "reason why" things are done while some want to simply buy.  Some vendors or service providers will treat you somewhat patronizingly, willingly or unwillingly and if your part of the group that wants to be included in the process it may not work out as one of them will be frustrated. 

In custom car building I can't see getting much success without being somewhat of a teacher to your client in sharing your experience of what has worked in your previous builds. 

 

Wow! Even concerned patients get 2nd opinions from other Doctor's.

Is this guy related to Jake Raby? 

baaaaaaaaaa

So... that happened. I appreciate the support, guys. Let's let this one go and move on. 

Stan - your letter was spot on, man. Thank you. I was super excited about the five speed again after waiting 6 flipping months and $2500.00.  Now I'm back to being fed up with it.  Metal parts don't rot if you keep them clean and dry.  I will put them on a shelf and cool off for a bit.  

Interesting side note. Gene Berg sends you a fun little bag of candy with your parts. I didn't even get to try one. My daughter found the bag and ate them all. That's a metaphor for this project.

 

Sorry to see the tranny build take this turn.  I will likely do another build some day and I'm definitely interested in a 5 speed. Egos are a delicate thing.  If the tranny Guru is that sensitive I would not want to do business with him.  As a Doc I get advice from nurses, technologists and colleagues all the time.  A wise man considers all advice and then decides.  To dismiss a suggestion out of pure arrogance is foolish.  There is always more than one way to skin a cat  (I hate cats).   I'm sure the tranny Guru is swamped with work.  I believe him.  Good thing since he won't be getting any referrals from this site.   

You didn't get any Zots? Oh man....

I would give it a few days, and talk to him again. How far away is he from you? Visiting his shop for a face to face would make it easier to clear the air, and if you can't save it at least you know you tried.

Talk about taking a hard left turn and getting derailed...

Zots! That's what they were called.  Nope not one. My daughter found 'em and loved 'em. It was sort of funny. She would go into the garage... and come back smiling.  A while later... repeat.  One flavor she didn't like... she came back with a sour look on her face.  It wasn't until the next day when I found the bag ravaged inside the box of parts that I figured it out.  When I asked her about it she just smiled and said "Sorrrry... you're not mad are you?"

I don't even know how she found them in the first place. I think Candy is to children like truffles are to pigs. They just have a nose for it. 

 

And that folks is how "you make it rain in California"!

Sorry Ted...

"I don't even know how she found them in the first place. I think Candy is to children like truffles are to pigs. They just have a nose for it." 

^  ....or, like gears to an SOCer with a serious case of the madness! 

This has been like watching "How I met your mother."
>

Ted - For what it's worth I just had my transaxle done. The planning of that had been in the works for two years and when I had to have the engine taken out to have body repairs done I jumped on the opportunity. Even though I had all the hypotheticals down on paper I still had doubts. After posting my thoughts here I received lots of feedback which caused me hesitation. It wasn't until I was given an opportunity to drive a car that had similar ratios to what I wanted that everything was confirmed.

For me I wanted to rid my car of that "granny" 1st and almost granny 2nd so I had a 3.44 ring and pinion put into a stock ratio transaxle. The result was that it still wasn't anywhere near what I wanted it to be. Now I knew I had to get the next one right or just settle for what I had. I'm not a settler. The drag guys love the stock setup with the big motors and when you hear them talk it sounds exciting! Well I realized that I don't like to burn the tires off between stop lights and I wanted something much different.

My initial thought on a new 1st and 2nd was to put a 2.90 1st and a 1.93 2nd in. The guys on here and at a shop I know really cautioned me on that saying that was too high and would make my starts and driving in traffic difficult. The car I drove had this setup in it - 3.88 R&P, 3.11 1st, 193 2nd, 1.21 3rd, and .89 4th. I know you're sick of this but it's important you talk to people that are in the know and ARE willing to listen to what YOU want and come up with a solution that fits.

After driving the car with the above configuration I spent hours running numbers on a gear calc and talking to Stan who has done this a few times then decided to change just the 2nd gear from the above config to a 1.86. I conveyed what I wanted to the builder and then had to wait and worry if my decision was right. When they got my car to a drivable state I went over and tried it and Ted it was like driving a $100,000 car! It really worked.

In my opinion your builder did you a huge favor that may save you $$$ and disappointment going forward. He also exposed his character not only to you but to all of us - thank you!

Ted - figure out what style of driver you are. If you like to drag race your car then stick with the ratios that are closest to stock. If you want 1st and 2nd stretched out a little don't be afraid to wait until you can confidently build it right by replacing the mainshaft with higher gears. I drive up to Bakersfield once or twice a month. That's not too far from you. Make a day of it and come on down and take my car out for a drive. We can take it up Kern Canyon Hwy 178. Take Terry's out first and get his configuration on paper then lets compare. See which type of setup you like best then design your 5 speed!

Stan...Write the book.........And they will come !

MusbJim posted:

"I would give it a few days, and talk to him again. How far away is he from you? Visiting his shop for a face to face would make it easier to clear the air, and if you can't save it at least you know you tried."

Right!

With that kind of thin skin, that would be like dealing with a woman and her "Gotcha" bag. You make a simple mistake that pisses off your woman but you take the high road and make peace and apologize for your misstep (she then stores that incident in her "Gotcha" bag). Time passes and everything seems to be fine. BUT, some time later (sometimes YEARS), you make a similar misstep, and POW, she pulls that sh*t from the "Gotcha" bag and pummels you with it. 

 

It's 2 guys talking, Jim, and it's what I would do. I've found (time and time again) that after tempers (and egos) cool down, sometimes you can still make it work. Maybe it won't, but you don't know until you try.

And my apologies for what follows, but I felt something had to be said....

The thing that's been bugging me about this whole sh*tstorm (and it's taken awhile to figure out) is why did you do this here? This should have been a private conversation with the person you're dealing with (where the rest of the conversation was being conducted) and not the public humiliation attempt you were looking for (I can see no other reason for doing this the way you did). I'm just calling it as I see it here- I'm a Samba-ite as well, have a lot of respect for your knowledge, and was 1 of the guys here suggesting to Ted that you would be a good choice for this, but now I don't really know what to think.

Before you reply to this please re-read Stan's post on the previous page and give it a little time to settle in. Al Blanchette

Who knows how people will react but at first vision it does not look good .... 

I find that many cannot agree to disagree if someone has a different opinion. 

But I have seen worse unreconciliable differences fixed but then, a lot would not go through the difficult work of keeping that relationship.  

x2 on the private conversation...

 

.......I feel as if Andy Rooney is about to do the closing segment.

 

ALB posted:

MusbJim posted:

"I would give it a few days, and talk to him again. How far away is he from you? Visiting his shop for a face to face would make it easier to clear the air, and if you can't save it at least you know you tried."

Right!

With that kind of thin skin, that would be like dealing with a woman and her "Gotcha" bag. You make a simple mistake that pisses off your woman but you take the high road and make peace and apologize for your misstep (she then stores that incident in her "Gotcha" bag). Time passes and everything seems to be fine. BUT, some time later (sometimes YEARS), you make a similar misstep, and POW, she pulls that sh*t from the "Gotcha" bag and pummels you with it. 

 

It's 2 guys talking, Jim, and it's what I would do. I've found (time and time again) that after tempers (and egos) cool down, sometimes you can still make it work. Maybe it won't, but you don't know until you try.

And my apologies for what follows, but I felt something had to be said....

mcmscott posted:

I take great pride in my work, I want all my customers to be pleased with the outcome. After a few e-mails regarding your transmission I know that you will not be satisfied. I suggest you have the people selling you parts build your trans. I decline your offer to let me help you with your transmission.

 Scott Sebastian, Metalcraft motorsports.

Teby can now get off your lawn

The thing that's been bugging me about this whole sh*tstorm (and it's taken awhile to figure out) is why did you do this here? This should have been a private conversation with the person you're dealing with (where the rest of the conversation was being conducted) and not the public humiliation attempt you were looking for (I can see no other reason for doing this the way you did). I'm just calling it as I see it here- I'm a Samba-ite as well, have a lot of respect for your knowledge, and was 1 of the guys here suggesting to Ted that you would be a good choice for this, but now I don't really know what to think.

Before you reply to this please re-read Stan's post on the previous page and give it a little time to settle in. Al Blanchette

You are correct in that I probably should not have posted this here, my bad, however it seems as if every customer that comes to me from this site has the "internet build" going on and only wants to do what the internet says, they ask for your opinion only to hope it matches what the internet people say, when you give your own opinion, basically you are told you are wrong but they still want you to work for them. That is a slap in the face. After been "slapped in the face" numerous times from this site I have a very low tollerance. I consider myself very knowelegable (spelling?) in every thing VW related, I have been doing this since 1984. So understand that I think my opinion weighs more than some one's that just does this as a hobby. The whole "customer is always right" is some times wrong. If I sense the customer will not be happy before we engage in an agreement I feel it is best for both parties to seperate before any money or parts are exchanged, kind of "nip it in the bud" if you will. Did I act hastely? Damn right I did, I shouldn't have but I did, sorry for that.

 Stans post hits every car person, myself included. The difference tho, is when I do something for you, I am more exited to see it turn out great than you, the customer, so when I am, in not so many words, told I dont know what I am talking about, and I am going to buy my parts elsewhere, I know at the end of the tunnel there is a "let down" awaiting. I don't want that let down on my shoulders. And I don't want you to be let down.

 I hope this kinda explains my reasoning, I also did act entirely too hastily and opoligize for it again, my bad. After doing this for more than 30 years I get a "little" impatiant.

                        Scott Sebastian,  Metalcraft motorsports. AKA MCM Scott  

What would you have done different than what Ted wanted, Scott?

The guy apologized publicly.  Can't we let this go?

If you're referring to me, Jim, I didn't see this as dragging it out, but an opportunity to possibly learn something from someone very knowledgable. If Scott will take the time to answer my question, great; if not, I understand that as well.

Good on you Scott for explaining your side. I know exactly how you feel and I hope you two can work this out.

Though sometimes, you have to part ways to keep the peace...

ALB posted:

What would you have done different than what Ted wanted, Scott?

Honestly, just not take it to a public forum, once again, my bad. Other than that as a builder, I don't like to get pushed around, so, not much else. I respect all my customers very much, you know what I want in exchange? Just the same and nothing more. When the customer thinks, or acts as he is "above me" then we are on different playing fields.

 I have a "pet peve" about bieng belittled 

Quite honestly, any transbuilder doesn't get to build a 5 speed every day, so I was actually looking forward to it. But I just saw too many red flags initially to let it go further. 

mcmscott posted:

ALB posted:

What would you have done different than what Ted wanted, Scott?

Honestly, just not take it to a public forum, once again, my bad. Other than that as a builder, I don't like to get pushed around, so, not much else. I respect all my customers very much, you know what I want in exchange? Just the same and nothing more. When the customer thinks, or acts as he is "above me" then we are on different playing fields.

 I have a "pet peve" about bieng belittled 

Scott, I think Al is asking "what would you have done different" with the trans vs what Ted wanted.

This is way above my paygrade but I'm trying to learn also.

FYI

Clutch pedal shaft 

the new shaft you purchased are nice  I use a double shear bracket step up.  The reason for my post is to warn you that most likely you have a aftermarket pedal assembly - meaning an "empi part"  and they are not made to factory specs  they have there own shaft diamension.  On Mitch's pedal assembly I had to get one custom made to fit the pedal assembly. Also when you remove the pedal assembly to change the clutch cross shaft you may also want to box the clutch pedal.. Call me and I will explain.  Or send it up.

regarding your trans gearing, keep in mind my answers to your questions of gearing and parts are from my experience around having driven them with several gear combos. I have ran some other combos that were from great stop light to stoplight and the compromise was the gap to fifth gear.  Your tire size is an important factor. I have a tall rear tire and with your shorter tire the gear combo changes slightly. Again, you will see the difference in the gearing between fourth and fifth up shifting and downshifting relating to the tire size. Think about it!  Your cuising along at 65+- and want to pass someone or you want to speed up do to a slight hill. That fourth gear ratio is important.  Your driving 152 towards Watsonville and in either third or fourth gear thru the turns moving pretty good and come to a tight corner and drop down to third or second. This is where those gear combos make the difference. Now think of those same situations with your four speed box. You got it?  You can't drive it like you really want to.  I driven 17 up and down in my 63 loaded with a few vangan trans in the car in fourth gear passing several bmws and honda, Toyotas because of the gearing combos.. Your trans builder or experienced berg five users are the only ones you may give you recommendations!

then once you finally get it in the car and drive it. You will drive it harder on the twistys and fine you need good brakes you slow you down quicker also.. I know  I had a few close calls driving from auburn to placervile having to brake hard to avoid going down the canyon because your confidence becomes higher which relate to faster corner speeds. Someday I will up grade to the CSP brakes sitting in the box on the floor of the old shop......excuse me for babbling.

 

 

;

 

Anthony, "babbling" is good....that's how we all learn.

Scott, You're absolutely right!....Being "slapped in the face" and "pushed around" by a mere hobbyist who isn't immediately taking into account your superior knowledge, that far exceeds internet babbling, is indeed  "insulting" and shouldn't be tolerated. Fortunately I don't think you're going to be irritated in the future by questions/opinions from this site (that's mostly frequented by "ignorant hobbyist") because most of us are penny-pinchers and would balk at  $32.50 charged for a consulting telephone call.   

I think that perhaps it would be good to let Ted and Scott sort this out between themselves now.  Excitement about a build, and wanting to learn all you can is so natural (it happened to me with my IM6), but sometimes - on a public forum such as this where there are so many likewise interested guys - it can lead to misunderstandings and even some degree of upset.

This thread has had a good run, so let's wait and see what the outcome is.  Hopefully, it's a positive one for those two personally involved, and we all will be interested in what that outcome is.

MusbJim posted:

"I would give it a few days, and talk to him again. How far away is he from you? Visiting his shop for a face to face would make it easier to clear the air, and if you can't save it at least you know you tried."

Right!

With that kind of thin skin, that would be like dealing with a woman and her "Gotcha" bag. You make a simple mistake that pisses off your woman but you take the high road and make peace and apologize for your misstep (she then stores that incident in her "Gotcha" bag). Time passes and everything seems to be fine. BUT, some time later (sometimes YEARS), you make a similar misstep, and POW, she pulls that sh*t from the "Gotcha" bag and pummels you with it. 

 

I know I'm a little late reading this but I laughed so hard I almost pissed myself.  Jim you have such sage wisdom.  My wife even laughed.  She knows its true.

But hey we know this only applies to women.  You guys need to talk this out privately and get a tranny built cause I might need a 5 speed one day.

I've just been accused (in a PM) of sarcastically throwing gasoline on the fire that others are trying to extinguish....Not so!...Scott has verbally reduced to smoldering ashes that bridge of possible reconciliation. I was merely (and accurately) indicating my understanding of his mind-set by framing his own (justifying?) words.

BTW, I miscalculated his minimum half-hour telephone 'consulting fee'....It's $37.50, not $32.50!.....I never was much good at math. 

mcmscott posted:

ALB posted:

What would you have done different than what Ted wanted, Scott?

Honestly, just not take it to a public forum, once again, my bad. Other than that as a builder, I don't like to get pushed around, so, not much else. I respect all my customers very much, you know what I want in exchange? Just the same and nothing more. When the customer thinks, or acts as he is "above me" then we are on different playing fields.

 I have a "pet peve" about bieng belittled 

Scott,

I've really tried to take the high road on this. I've even taken more of the blame than I should have. I'm going to ask one more time to let this go.

I appreciate you coming here and trying to apologize for airing this nonsense on a public forum. Thank you.  I don't understand why you are belaboring the situation with comments of 'red flags',  'internet builds', 'disrespect', 'belittling', 'customer acts like he is above me' and 'not knowing what I want'. Comments like those are a starting to make me second guess the position I've taken with this fiasco.  

I have read and reread every message between the two of us. You misread the entire transaction. Not once did anything of that nature transpire. You started to acknowledge that. You apologized... then went right back to pointing fingers and right back to trying to justify your actions because of what you thought I said or did. That's not an apology. That's sorry, not sorry. Reread what you wrote. You said sorry and then went right back into justification of your behavior. The worst part is that it's based on a misunderstanding. You recommended one set. I said I wanted something different. You then got pissed because it went against your professional opinion. You called that a slap in your face. That was not my intention. If you'd like, I can post our e-mail exchange here. I am so far from the character you are trying to use as justification for the giant chip on your shoulder. 

Bottom line is this - You have a reputation for being a very skilled fabricator. You are known for your knowledge of VW transmissions. Nobody is going to dispute that. Unfortunately you are also known to be a hot head and difficult person to work with.  You are only reinforcing that reputation.

I genuinely regret every damn thing about this 5 speed. The parts are going on a shelf. At this point I'd rather make a damn ashtray out of it. For **** sake. It's a damned gearbox not a magnum opus. I labored more over these stupid gear ratios than I did over naming my kids.  The perspective on this **** is ridiculously warped. ITS A GEARBOX!!!! NOT THE CUP OF CHRIST. 

Scott, we need to see other people. It's not you, it's me.

Can we move on now?

 

TRP posted:

mcmscott posted:

ALB posted:

What would you have done different than what Ted wanted, Scott?

Honestly, just not take it to a public forum, once again, my bad. Other than that as a builder, I don't like to get pushed around, so, not much else. I respect all my customers very much, you know what I want in exchange? Just the same and nothing more. When the customer thinks, or acts as he is "above me" then we are on different playing fields.

 I have a "pet peve" about bieng belittled 

Scott,

I've really tried to take the high road on this. I've even taken more of the blame than I should have. I'm going to ask one more time to let this go.

I appreciate you coming here and trying to apologize for airing this nonsense on a public forum. Thank you.  I don't understand why you are belaboring the situation with comments of 'red flags',  'internet builds', 'disrespect', 'belittling', 'customer acts like he is above me' and 'not knowing what I want'. Comments like those are a starting to make me second guess the position I've taken with this fiasco.  

I have read and reread every message between the two of us. You misread the entire transaction. Not once did anything of that nature transpire. You started to acknowledge that. You apologized... then went right back to pointing fingers and right back to trying to justify your actions because of what you thought I said or did. That's not an apology. That's sorry, not sorry. Reread what you wrote. You said sorry and then went right back into justification of your behavior. The worst part is that it's based on a misunderstanding. You recommended one set. I said I wanted something different. You then got pissed because it went against your professional opinion. You called that a slap in your face. That was not my intention. If you'd like, I can post our e-mail exchange here. I am so far from the character you are trying to use as justification for the giant chip on your shoulder. 

Bottom line is this - You have a reputation for being a very skilled fabricator. You are known for your knowledge of VW transmissions. Nobody is going to dispute that. Unfortunately you are also known to be a hot head and difficult person to work with.  You are only reinforcing that reputation.

I genuinely regret every damn thing about this 5 speed. The parts are going on a shelf. At this point I'd rather make a damn ashtray out of it. For **** sake. It's a damned gearbox not a magnum opus. I labored more over these stupid gear ratios than I did over naming my kids.  The perspective on this **** is ridiculously warped. ITS A GEARBOX!!!! NOT THE CUP OF CHRIST. 

Scott, we need to see other people. It's not you, it's me.

Can we move on now?

 

"I labored more over these stupid gear ratios than I did over naming my kids."

BTW, how are Adobe, Acrobat, and PDF doing these days?

Robert M (Not a Poopiehead) posted:

TRP posted:

mcmscott posted:

ALB posted:

What would you have done different than what Ted wanted, Scott?

Honestly, just not take it to a public forum, once again, my bad. Other than that as a builder, I don't like to get pushed around, so, not much else. I respect all my customers very much, you know what I want in exchange? Just the same and nothing more. When the customer thinks, or acts as he is "above me" then we are on different playing fields.

 I have a "pet peve" about bieng belittled 

Scott,

I've really tried to take the high road on this. I've even taken more of the blame than I should have. I'm going to ask one more time to let this go.

I appreciate you coming here and trying to apologize for airing this nonsense on a public forum. Thank you.  I don't understand why you are belaboring the situation with comments of 'red flags',  'internet builds', 'disrespect', 'belittling', 'customer acts like he is above me' and 'not knowing what I want'. Comments like those are a starting to make me second guess the position I've taken with this fiasco.  

I have read and reread every message between the two of us. You misread the entire transaction. Not once did anything of that nature transpire. You started to acknowledge that. You apologized... then went right back to pointing fingers and right back to trying to justify your actions because of what you thought I said or did. That's not an apology. That's sorry, not sorry. Reread what you wrote. You said sorry and then went right back into justification of your behavior. The worst part is that it's based on a misunderstanding. You recommended one set. I said I wanted something different. You then got pissed because it went against your professional opinion. You called that a slap in your face. That was not my intention. If you'd like, I can post our e-mail exchange here. I am so far from the character you are trying to use as justification for the giant chip on your shoulder. 

Bottom line is this - You have a reputation for being a very skilled fabricator. You are known for your knowledge of VW transmissions. Nobody is going to dispute that. Unfortunately you are also known to be a hot head and difficult person to work with.  You are only reinforcing that reputation.

I genuinely regret every damn thing about this 5 speed. The parts are going on a shelf. At this point I'd rather make a damn ashtray out of it. For **** sake. It's a damned gearbox not a magnum opus. I labored more over these stupid gear ratios than I did over naming my kids.  The perspective on this **** is ridiculously warped. ITS A GEARBOX!!!! NOT THE CUP OF CHRIST. 

Scott, we need to see other people. It's not you, it's me.

Can we move on now?

 

"I labored more over these stupid gear ratios than I did over naming my kids."

BTW, how are Adobe, Acrobat, and PDF doing these days?

HA! Those aren't my kids! Acrobat and PDF are hoodlums.    

Ok, I'm glad there's still some sense of humor in all this!

And I apologize for the question after the fact; I was hoping to learn something technical, and not stir up the pot for another round...