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Symptoms:

One: On initial startup, the genny used to take between one and three seconds to get to the 12V range; the idiot light went out when the power came up. Now, it takes about three minutes of idling before the light goes out; The first time I rev it to more than 1,200 rpms, it goes out like it should. I generally let the car warm up for a few minutes before I drive it.

Two: After about 10 minutes of routine driving at 3,000 rpms and an engine oil temperature of 190 degrees (consistently), the light will come on. In my car, 3K is about 60-65 mph. I have noticed the light going out with a change in rpms, either speeding up or slowing down -- but the fix is not something I can troubleshoot because I'm at speed, which kind of makes this a good candidate for forum quorum diagnosis.

Three: The delay in the light going out has gotten longer and longer. When I was cruising in mostly third the other night with Kelly in his Red Baron, the light went on and off intermittently. On the way back home, the light never came on until I hit 3,000 again, in fourth. The car had been sufficiently cooled at Kelly's house to be considered a cold start on that trip back to my house.

Four: This has happened before, always with heat involved. It seems to take about 10 minutes for the car to get up to its operating range. I have a DTM shroud with the bus oil cooler sticking up out of a papoose on the forward side, with the ground wire for the voltage regulator running along the fiberglass at the base of the cooler. It's off the cooler by milimeters and wired on a logical route; there's not enough spare there to reroute the wire to a cooler position.

Five: After Carlisle, when I described to The Wrench what was happening with the generator light (remember the 7.5 quarts of oil and the ground wire on the starter being the source of my "oil" light pain?), he took all of the ground connections loose from the battery, the starter and the voltage regulator. He cleaned and remade the contacts, and then did the same for every wire on the generator. That seemed to have solved my problems for a time, but that's also when I got my cooler. ... So ...

My thoughts:

Either I'm generating heat too close to the voltage regulator's wiring by having it right up next to the cooler, I've got a generator going bad, or my electric fan which comes on at 180 degrees is sapping my car's ability to produce 14v and regulate it at 12v. I am not an electrical genius. I can re-route wires, I can install pieces and I understand magnetism and general electrical principles, but I have no idea how to tell (in the field) whether I need a new generator. If I buy one of those VR-having alternators, will my car be able to keep up with demand better -- or am I barking up the wrong tree?

Thoughts?

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Symptoms:

One: On initial startup, the genny used to take between one and three seconds to get to the 12V range; the idiot light went out when the power came up. Now, it takes about three minutes of idling before the light goes out; The first time I rev it to more than 1,200 rpms, it goes out like it should. I generally let the car warm up for a few minutes before I drive it.

Two: After about 10 minutes of routine driving at 3,000 rpms and an engine oil temperature of 190 degrees (consistently), the light will come on. In my car, 3K is about 60-65 mph. I have noticed the light going out with a change in rpms, either speeding up or slowing down -- but the fix is not something I can troubleshoot because I'm at speed, which kind of makes this a good candidate for forum quorum diagnosis.

Three: The delay in the light going out has gotten longer and longer. When I was cruising in mostly third the other night with Kelly in his Red Baron, the light went on and off intermittently. On the way back home, the light never came on until I hit 3,000 again, in fourth. The car had been sufficiently cooled at Kelly's house to be considered a cold start on that trip back to my house.

Four: This has happened before, always with heat involved. It seems to take about 10 minutes for the car to get up to its operating range. I have a DTM shroud with the bus oil cooler sticking up out of a papoose on the forward side, with the ground wire for the voltage regulator running along the fiberglass at the base of the cooler. It's off the cooler by milimeters and wired on a logical route; there's not enough spare there to reroute the wire to a cooler position.

Five: After Carlisle, when I described to The Wrench what was happening with the generator light (remember the 7.5 quarts of oil and the ground wire on the starter being the source of my "oil" light pain?), he took all of the ground connections loose from the battery, the starter and the voltage regulator. He cleaned and remade the contacts, and then did the same for every wire on the generator. That seemed to have solved my problems for a time, but that's also when I got my cooler. ... So ...

My thoughts:

Either I'm generating heat too close to the voltage regulator's wiring by having it right up next to the cooler, I've got a generator going bad, or my electric fan which comes on at 180 degrees is sapping my car's ability to produce 14v and regulate it at 12v. I am not an electrical genius. I can re-route wires, I can install pieces and I understand magnetism and general electrical principles, but I have no idea how to tell (in the field) whether I need a new generator. If I buy one of those VR-having alternators, will my car be able to keep up with demand better -- or am I barking up the wrong tree?

Thoughts?

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  • 060307 oil III
  • 060307 old cooler I
  • 060307 new cooler I
Cory,

Just a couple of thoughts, my first thougth is there is a very good reason that alternators have replaced generators 100% over the last 40 years world wide in new cars....they work better

Secondly a alternator will produce more power at lower RPM's.

3rdly an alternator should be available that provides much more power than a generator.

With all that said a generator can generally fail in 3 ways 1)worn brushes and yes they can be replaced 2) communtator has worn and has conductive garbage between the segments from worn brushes. under some circumstances the comutator can be "turned" (refinished) but there are fewer and fewer places that can or will do that these days 3)a segment of the wiring in the comutator can fail, requiring the communtator to be rewound...the chances of finding some place to do that is not good these days...

Cory, I don't know if a Type IV alternator is available as cheaply as a type I or if they interchange....I doubt it, but a type 1 alternator is less than $200 and high current ones are available for not much more..

given your symptoms I would bet on worn brushes and worn / contaminated commutator....I would replace it with an alternator with the internal regulator, get rid of the old external reg....
First replace the voltage regulator. Quick and easy. Go for a modern electronic one, the older original style has breaker points in it and they can stick. When you remove the regulator, check beneath it. There's usually an exposed slightly heavy gauge wire and a diode looking thingie. The wire often burns away from the contact area.

THEN check the brushes, top and bottom. Considering the age of the build and all the driving, you may have worn them down. If none of this helps Replace it all with an alternator for sure and send me the newly purchased replacement electronic regulator and the old generator. I can ALWAYS use a good generator core and can usually rebuild them to the point where the work well.

Luck ! ! !

TC
Jeeze, what is the big deal here? Just go buy a right alternator, and get modern. You might be in trouble w/ the current V regulator, but that is easy to isolate by changing it out. If that does't get you brighter headlights, then go get a proper alternator, and have a bunch of fun putting it in. That the symptoms come and go w/ running time and temperature, sorta tells me the generator might be the problem.

Also, look for a PM sent a little later.
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