Hi,
This may have been discussed before but I can
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Hi,
This may have been discussed before but I can
This may have been discussed before but I can
Frank, the VW booster fan setup is still actively advertised in VW Trends and Hot VW's. You also need to make sure your heater channels aren't rusted through if you have a pan based car.
Frank, I've been attempting to do the same thing. Most of the fan motors that I identified as usable, had plastic fan blades, or other plastic components that would be susceptible to the hi heat that close to the VW motor. I looked at marine bilge blowers and others in-line type blowers. Just couldn't find the right ones. It seems the key may be to suck heat from the underdash area and disperse it into the cabin rather than "blow" heat from the motor area. Let us know if you come up with anything.
Gclarke "The vacaville Guy"
Gclarke "The vacaville Guy"
I have a blower mounted between the firewall and the passenger back wall. Use it to blow cool air through the heater boxes, was concerned about hot air vs. blower longevity. Works OK. There seems to be a high pressure area where the fan is mounted and at road speeds I get a good air flow with no fan. No connection to engine cooling shroud at all.
FWIW
Bill
FWIW
Bill
Or you could park your car in a heated garage. The car's heater would work dandy then.
Careful, Erik, you're beginning to sound like me...:o)
Gary,
That idea to suck rather than blow air is rather erotic isn't it?
By the way, saw an item for sale in the Sunday supplement yesterday. a heater that works from your cigarette lighter. All this for I think $12.95. Got to be from Popiel!
Bruce
That idea to suck rather than blow air is rather erotic isn't it?
By the way, saw an item for sale in the Sunday supplement yesterday. a heater that works from your cigarette lighter. All this for I think $12.95. Got to be from Popiel!
Bruce
Is Popeil.......one of the Ron's? Theres a thought to ponder !
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
Frank, I called the manufacterer of those units. They are basically plastic marine bilge blowers. They are intended to be positioned inside the car, generally in the back seat of a volkswagen. By the time the heated air gets through to that position it has cooled down considerably, and the plastic won't melt.
On my speedster as with most of them, the heat is carried through the steel boxed support frame. The only position available to place a blower is just forward of the exhaust where two 2" thickwall steel tubes exit pointing toward the engine tubes. When I sent photos to the manufacterer that advertises in VW magazines....he said that was too darn close to the engine. After about 6 miles you would just have two melted globs of plastic, where the blowers used to be. Those blowers are made to suck fumes away from a boats engine compartment before you fire the motor. ( no heat at all)
Gclarke
"The Vacaville Guy"
On my speedster as with most of them, the heat is carried through the steel boxed support frame. The only position available to place a blower is just forward of the exhaust where two 2" thickwall steel tubes exit pointing toward the engine tubes. When I sent photos to the manufacterer that advertises in VW magazines....he said that was too darn close to the engine. After about 6 miles you would just have two melted globs of plastic, where the blowers used to be. Those blowers are made to suck fumes away from a boats engine compartment before you fire the motor. ( no heat at all)
Gclarke
"The Vacaville Guy"
Which fan shroud you use will make a difference. The 36hp style doghouse shroud pushes less air to the heater boxes than the factory doghouse shroud. I changed back to the factory shroud after hearing the 36hp shroud might not cool as well. The temp didn't change, but I noticed a lot more air coming through the heater vents. My 2 cents. :)
Gary
I have not poked my head under my car yet looking at where the air flows, is there any chance to fit in bilge blowers just before the air enters the foot well? Maybe after I get under and look it will become obvious that will not work. Right now all I get is slightly warm air, but I will be checking the flow of air (per GB) from the heater boxes to the front looking for possible rust torn hoses ect.
I have not poked my head under my car yet looking at where the air flows, is there any chance to fit in bilge blowers just before the air enters the foot well? Maybe after I get under and look it will become obvious that will not work. Right now all I get is slightly warm air, but I will be checking the flow of air (per GB) from the heater boxes to the front looking for possible rust torn hoses ect.
I am a bit foggy on this but do recall a VW buss had an assist fan for the heater .....anybody ?
Alan M
Alan M
Alan Yes, your correct. I haven't checked to see if they'll fit. They are pretty good size. It may be that his heat flaps are not opening fully, or they're not even hooked up because his fan should be pushing enough air from the shroud.
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
About those booster fans that are advertised in HotVW or VWTrends...
I put a set of those guys between the heater boxes and port that goes inside the car and...
They were noisy... OK so I could live with some more noise for the extra heat. BUT...
They only lasted about a week before they started making strange noises and stopped altogether. I removed and inspected them to find that the plastic fan blades had melted. They ended up in the trash!
I guess you have to mount them way away from any real heat.
I'm back to using the stock set up and jackets, and gloves, and ...
Greg B
I put a set of those guys between the heater boxes and port that goes inside the car and...
They were noisy... OK so I could live with some more noise for the extra heat. BUT...
They only lasted about a week before they started making strange noises and stopped altogether. I removed and inspected them to find that the plastic fan blades had melted. They ended up in the trash!
I guess you have to mount them way away from any real heat.
I'm back to using the stock set up and jackets, and gloves, and ...
Greg B
It may be that you could augment the defrosters with the fan motors they put in computers. Check them out....
Jack,
But are they 12 volt?
Bruce
But are they 12 volt?
Bruce
Can also use a 12v trans cooler fan that are used in street rods they measure about 6" x 6" and 3/4" think
Alan M
Alan M
Bruce
Yup, they're 12v
Yup, they're 12v
I actually got the Speedster in the snow at 8500 feet up, yes it does snow in CA. My normal engine heaters were only luke warm at this point even though I put alot of effort into wrapping insulation around all the duct work. The heaters still worked just not like the typical burn your ankle off heat that it ussually puts out at fifty deg. while cruising on the highway.
What did save us in the cold was the two electric heaters stashed up under the dash. They don't do a huge amount of heat but they do recirculate the air inside to give you better heating and they're positioned right above our laps, it was enough that my wife only complained once about the cold. I'm currently running a 55amp alt however there is a new alt now that puts out a whopping 90 amps. I have a feeling that new alt. will be coming shortly as winter decends as I'm sure those heaters really suck the power. Funny huh, winter in CA, yes it can get cold out here too.
Anyway it's a simple relatively inexpensive way to get an added heat source to a Speedster. Below 30 deg, I guess I'd dodge traveling in that car.
J-P
What did save us in the cold was the two electric heaters stashed up under the dash. They don't do a huge amount of heat but they do recirculate the air inside to give you better heating and they're positioned right above our laps, it was enough that my wife only complained once about the cold. I'm currently running a 55amp alt however there is a new alt now that puts out a whopping 90 amps. I have a feeling that new alt. will be coming shortly as winter decends as I'm sure those heaters really suck the power. Funny huh, winter in CA, yes it can get cold out here too.
Anyway it's a simple relatively inexpensive way to get an added heat source to a Speedster. Below 30 deg, I guess I'd dodge traveling in that car.
J-P
Jean Paul....Where did you get them, can you paste a photo, or give us some useful information so that those who are intersted can get warm too?
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
I bought the 12v electric blanket from JC Whitney last winter. Placed it on my seat & wrapped myself in it. Works great in 40 degree weather in the desert winter nights.
I have one of those electric blankets also that I got off of ebay, mine doesn't work so well even though it was new in the box. Perhaps you got a good one.
I'll send pics right away for the heaters. J-P
I'll send pics right away for the heaters. J-P
J.P
Thanks for the pictures, they came through very good. Where could one buy those units? And what was the approx cost?
Gclarke"The Vacaville Guy"
Thanks for the pictures, they came through very good. Where could one buy those units? And what was the approx cost?
Gclarke"The Vacaville Guy"
So here goes....
The heaters are both up under the dash as you can see and are plugged into a relay to turn on and off with the car. I positioned them here so that they might blow warm on your lap and will not be seen. These heaters are called "back seat heat plus" and can be bought from many RV stores however they are least expensive off e-bay, especially during summer time. I got mine for around twenty a peice however I think they go for around a hundred a pop new. Hope this helps.
J-P
The heaters are both up under the dash as you can see and are plugged into a relay to turn on and off with the car. I positioned them here so that they might blow warm on your lap and will not be seen. These heaters are called "back seat heat plus" and can be bought from many RV stores however they are least expensive off e-bay, especially during summer time. I got mine for around twenty a peice however I think they go for around a hundred a pop new. Hope this helps.
J-P
I found them. They are made by thermotec, retail for $135.00 and are available thru most Rv dealers. My concern is the amperage draw. J.P. do you notice using them at night....the haedlights dimming when you turn the heaters on? New article in the newest Hot VW's ( just came out on the newstand today) regarding installation of 100 amp alternators.
GClarke "The Vacaville Guy"
GClarke "The Vacaville Guy"
Bingo!!!
Yes it's all about the amps. I've run both heaters on without the headlights for about 2hrs straight and didn't notice any battery difficulties however I'm sure it can't be good. I think I did the math at one time and figured that each of these units runs about 20 amps. So with both heaters on and the headlights on your definately in trouble with the stock 55 amp alt. I did read up on that new 100 amp alt. and I think I'm going to spring for one of those even at the crazy 250 price. 250 is a bargain if my wife doesn't complain about how cold it is and you know she's right. Anyway there is a place only a couple miles away that carries those new alt., I may pick one up shortly. My advice is to pick those heaters up used on e-bay as 135 seems to be a little pricey for what they are and yes you'll need two of them.
J-P
Yes it's all about the amps. I've run both heaters on without the headlights for about 2hrs straight and didn't notice any battery difficulties however I'm sure it can't be good. I think I did the math at one time and figured that each of these units runs about 20 amps. So with both heaters on and the headlights on your definately in trouble with the stock 55 amp alt. I did read up on that new 100 amp alt. and I think I'm going to spring for one of those even at the crazy 250 price. 250 is a bargain if my wife doesn't complain about how cold it is and you know she's right. Anyway there is a place only a couple miles away that carries those new alt., I may pick one up shortly. My advice is to pick those heaters up used on e-bay as 135 seems to be a little pricey for what they are and yes you'll need two of them.
J-P
Found one of J.P.'s heaters on E-bay, got it "in the box" for $45.00.
Since I live in Northern Cal I'll try to install just one, and see if it cuts the chill enough this winter, if not...keep adding them suckers until the commodore screams "ENOUGH"!
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
Since I live in Northern Cal I'll try to install just one, and see if it cuts the chill enough this winter, if not...keep adding them suckers until the commodore screams "ENOUGH"!
Gclarke "The Vacaville Guy"
OK, just got back from a run at under 45 degrees (seems even colder down along the ocean) and am really starting to think about one of those Espar gas heaters........anyone using one? About how much do they cost? I have a lot of room between the firewall and the rear seat back and suppose that I could mount one up in there but where are they usually mounted?
Comments? Thanks, Gordon
Comments? Thanks, Gordon
The Espar is really the best way to go IF you've got the space. If you've ever seen one in person they look like some old WWII German buzz bombs. Those things are heavy, large and require some plumbing. It's going to be difficult but if you can manage putting one of those in do tell. Again, best place to get one of those is e-bay or TheSamba.com as new they are well over a thousand if you can find one.
Best thing you can do for heat is not let any of it out. You can buy some extra snaps at a craft store and lock the side curtains in place, also get some glue on velcro and velcro the backside of the curtain to the top. Lastly seal of any other air leaks. This works really well and will allow you to drive at 90 mph without having the top flutter or leak tons of air in the car.
And if you want your stocck heaters to work...insulate the heat duct all the up the car so that the heat can make it to your feat.
J-P
Best thing you can do for heat is not let any of it out. You can buy some extra snaps at a craft store and lock the side curtains in place, also get some glue on velcro and velcro the backside of the curtain to the top. Lastly seal of any other air leaks. This works really well and will allow you to drive at 90 mph without having the top flutter or leak tons of air in the car.
And if you want your stocck heaters to work...insulate the heat duct all the up the car so that the heat can make it to your feat.
J-P
J.P.
Speaking of top flutter, I experienced that this summer. I inserted the right side curtain and that stopped some of the flutter but still had some. Kind of annoying and I'm sure would soon weaken the sewed seams with the constant flexing of the canvas. Kind of caught between a rock and a hard place it seems. One solution is to remove the top and go topless but then I lose my hat and bald head gets cooked. If I put both curtains in then it probably gets too hot inside. What is a fellow to do? I almost considered some kind of upright going from the floor to the top which might create more tension on the top and prevent the flutter. Suggestions?
Bruce
Speaking of top flutter, I experienced that this summer. I inserted the right side curtain and that stopped some of the flutter but still had some. Kind of annoying and I'm sure would soon weaken the sewed seams with the constant flexing of the canvas. Kind of caught between a rock and a hard place it seems. One solution is to remove the top and go topless but then I lose my hat and bald head gets cooked. If I put both curtains in then it probably gets too hot inside. What is a fellow to do? I almost considered some kind of upright going from the floor to the top which might create more tension on the top and prevent the flutter. Suggestions?
Bruce
Bruce,
Top down, hat on. Top up, side-curtains in.
Top down, hat on. Top up, side-curtains in.
Henry, at IM mentioned that gluing a strip of form-type insulation board along the heat channels in the pan can really help. A lot of heat is lost as the air travels along that channel. Spray paint the 'out' side black and you'll never notice it. I'm going to do that his winter, while the car is off the road.
Ron
Ron
Actually yes, insulating the heater channels was a benifit to the heating system. I used insulation from Home Depot that came in a roll and has a self adhesive back to it. I looked for the highest R factor to get the best results. Wrapping the the duct work was a one Sat. job.
As for the snaps I added to the side curtains that attached to the top, it does stop the flutter. I've have traveled some prettty high speeds with the top up and yet there was no flutter. The upside is no flutter while having a much better seal for the window and the downside is when you want to open the door you need to undo two snaps per door. It doesn't seem to bother me that much as when I go somewhere with the top up it's ussually for a long drive however I'm sure it would become a pain if you lived in a state with lots of tolls unless of course you just zip under the toll gate.
J-P
As for the snaps I added to the side curtains that attached to the top, it does stop the flutter. I've have traveled some prettty high speeds with the top up and yet there was no flutter. The upside is no flutter while having a much better seal for the window and the downside is when you want to open the door you need to undo two snaps per door. It doesn't seem to bother me that much as when I go somewhere with the top up it's ussually for a long drive however I'm sure it would become a pain if you lived in a state with lots of tolls unless of course you just zip under the toll gate.
J-P
My new IM is being built with the small Espar gass heater; should work very well...
Yup, Espar will do the job although nothing will beat a water cooled car for heat. I'm in So. Cal so life without tons of heat is no prob. Sunny days 360 days a year and some of the most fantastic roads around.
J-P
J-P
JP,
Yeah the 360 days of sunshine are a positive, but how about those 5 days of liquid sunshine on your recently denuded hills? Has there been any forecasts what that will do as far as mud and land slides? I'm thinking about Knotts Berry in late April. Are the rains pretty much over by then?
Bruce
Yeah the 360 days of sunshine are a positive, but how about those 5 days of liquid sunshine on your recently denuded hills? Has there been any forecasts what that will do as far as mud and land slides? I'm thinking about Knotts Berry in late April. Are the rains pretty much over by then?
Bruce
Sealing the air leaks in the body and top will probably make more difference than almost anything else you can do. I made some small ($60 at an upholstery shop) changes to the top on my car which made a PROFOUND difference. I went into length describing what I did under the "Latching the Top" thread in this forum. I hope you can understand what I did, it really made a big difference.
Yes, it hardly ever rains out here however a little rain could help every once in a while esspecially with the wildfires that happen ever now and then.
Stan, thats an interesting solution to the top sealing. I think I understand what you meant, could you post some pics of your clever method.
I went the velcro method as it doesn't detract vissually and it does seal the car up tight but yes you do have an issue with getting in and out of the car. The velcro is just at the back edge of the window to stop the air from coming in so it's not that big of a deal to unzipp the top. I'm glad to hear other people coming up with solutions to these problems as it's the details like this that can make the car more pleasant to drive not just a big motor.
J-P
Stan, thats an interesting solution to the top sealing. I think I understand what you meant, could you post some pics of your clever method.
I went the velcro method as it doesn't detract vissually and it does seal the car up tight but yes you do have an issue with getting in and out of the car. The velcro is just at the back edge of the window to stop the air from coming in so it's not that big of a deal to unzipp the top. I'm glad to hear other people coming up with solutions to these problems as it's the details like this that can make the car more pleasant to drive not just a big motor.
J-P