IRS Transaxle Recommendations

I bought my Berg-5 from Wright Gearbox.

@Michael McKelvey  How were they would you buy from them again? Thanks Mike

Arden- What kind of driving do you like to do? What kind of track time?  Do you see yourself spending a lot of time on the freeway?  Do you know what camshaft is in the 2165, and how high does it rev with power?

I think I would buy from them.

The sole reason I bought from them was that they had the parts to build my Berg-5 and there would be an indefinite wait from other sources.

The only issue I had was I had to modify the venting of the transmission which involved drilling and tapping a hole in the transmission while it was installed in the car.

Arden, do you know what gearing you want? As far as I can tell, Weddle seems to be the only source of all the aftermarket gearing these days.  That said, a lot of the  gears are out of stock.  I bought a mainshaft 4 months ago, without the idler gears as they weren’t available. Just 2 weeks ago I received 1 of the 2 idlers needed.  I’m expecting the other idler sometime in May, but who knows?  
Moral of this story, ask whichever builders you speak with, do they actually have the gearing you want available.

@ALB Let’s say I like to drive a little Spirited some freeway but not a lot. Al to be honest I don’t know a lot about this motor just what the guy told me it came with the chassis I bought. He said it was a 2165 built by CB performance I don’t think it has even been put into a car. It has a  MSD distributor duel 40 or 44 carbs and A1 sidewinder exhaust. I didn’t even know it was coming but when chassis arrived so did this motor and new windshield, two sets of seats and I think 7 or 8 boxes of stuff. To say the least I was Pleasantly Surprised!!

@LI-Rick Thanks Rick this is the first time for me on these Transaxels any recommendations on gearing? Like I said I like To drive a little spirited every once in a while and may end up taking it to the track once in a while who knows.

@Former Member, Gearing needs to be matched to weight and torque. VW picked their gearing for approximately 1800 lbs and 80 lb-ft of torque. Your motor is going to make significantly more torque, at a similar weight. Imho, you can get away with a taller 1st-2nd gear combination.  There are two downsides, one is cost, as a mainshaft is $1000.  The second is acceleration from a stop. The upside is more usable first and second gears, and a reduced rpm drop to 3rd.  
I know a lot of people here speak of getting a 3.44 r&p, which would do much the same thing as the mainshaft change, but I don’t think they are available anywhere.

Go to Weddle.com and play with the gear calculator, you can get a good idea what gear changes will do for speed and rpm in each gear. Pay particular attention to the rpm drop between gears. You want to see less rpm drop between gears as you go up.

For reference, I’m going with 3.11, 1.93, 1.32, .93 with a 3.88 r&p.  This is in a Spyder, which will weigh several hundred pounds less than a Speedster, and I’m estimating about 160 hp.

As for transmission builders, I used to use Harold Carter, at Carter’s Gearbox Shop, but I don’t think he is around any longer.  

Last gearing/transmission thread we had I think @DannyP had it nailed.

I finally got all my 4 gears from Weddle two weeks ago. Yeah, you heard me right! I ordered them in September.

Custom main shaft and 1st and 2nd idler gears easily costs $1000. Custom 3rd and 4th is $800. That's $1800, plus synchros and anything else that's worn. A new ring and pinion is $500 to $1500, if you can find one. VW did make a 3.88 from 1972-3 to 1979.

Add bearings, a ring and pinion, labor, and gaskets. And maybe a Super-Diff or Torque Biasing Differential(TBD).

Rick's ratios are pretty good for a 3.88 R&P. If I had decided on a 3.88 I'd  go with his gearing.

I went with a 3.44 1st, 1.93 2nd(1st and second are a permanent part of the mainshaft, so not many choices), 1.30 3rd, and 1.0 4th and a 3.44 ring and pinion.

These ratios should create the perfect mountain slayer 4 speed transmission, without revving too much for short highway stints. It gets rid of the factory 1-2 which are too short even with the tall final drive. The rpm drop from 2nd to 3rd, and 3rd to 4th are WAY tighter than factory spacing. But even more important is the even spacing so the engine stays on the powerband at all times(percentage of pull between each gear is as even as is possible).

With the VW factory 1-4, 2nd is too short and 3rd is too tall, and forget about using 4th in the mountains. Perfect for the flats and highway, not so much for canyon-carving.

All of these machinations are done(for me) because a 5 speed is more difficult than I have the desire to fabricate in a swing-axle, cable-shifter Spyder.

Just stating this last fact before the usual characters tell me to build a 5 speed.

@Former Member posted:

@ALB Let’s say I like to drive a little Spirited some freeway but not a lot. Al to be honest I don’t know a lot about this motor just what the guy told me it came with the chassis I bought. He said it was a 2165 built by CB performance I don’t think it has even been put into a car. It has a  MSD distributor duel 40 or 44 carbs and A1 sidewinder exhaust. I didn’t even know it was coming but when chassis arrived so did this motor and new windshield, two sets of seats and I think 7 or 8 boxes of stuff. To say the least I was Pleasantly Surprised!!

I'm going to guess that it goes to at least 6,000 and quite possibly 6500 (or even a little higher) rpm with power.  Being a 2165 it'll still have a sh*t pile of bottom end/lower midrange power so for general driving I'm inclined to tell you to leave 1st through 4th alone unless you're really serious about track performance, and you have experience driving a bigger Type 1 engine with stock gears so YOU'RE SURE you know what you want.  Ring & pinion- if you want it to be really zippy around town, 4.12; if you like to lope along the highway for hours (think weekend trips?)- 3.88. 

Some reading- https://www.speedsterowners.co...1#564965618986679951

https://www.speedsterowners.co...1#588895125725179061

I'd expect 44 IDF carbs and 36 vents with a 2165, 40 would be too small.

The best bang for the buck is now and always will be a stock 1973-1979 SSC(single side cover) Beetle transmission: stronger 3.78 1st, 2.06 second, 1.26 3rd and 0.89 4th with a 3.88 final drive(came with this too).

Weld 3-4 synchro hubs to the gears, new bearings and synchros, and install a 4-spider-gear Super Diff. If you can find an early 1.32 3rd and a 0.93 4th and get that in there you're doing VERY well. These are all FACTORY VW gears.

What are your thoughts Super Diff or a Limited Slip? Also my tires are 23’ tall

23" is short. My 195/60R15 rears are 24.2" tall. That might have you wanting the 3.44 R&P. But it also depends on HOW YOU use the car and where. With your tires and the same gearing, the difference between 3.44 and 3.88 is about 300 rpm at 55mph.

Use this calculator(there are many on the web):

https://weddleindustries.com/gear-calculator

What is the purpose of this car? Gentle cruising? Highway long-distance guy? Mountain road slayer? Light 'em up at every start?

I've never had the LSD/Torsen. A Super diff with 4 spider gears works for me, and I'm running 180hp through it. Believe me, I'd have one if I could but the word is they don't fit with the 3.44. They WILL fit with 3.88 and shorter ratios.

My light car leaves two equal patches when launched, and it has an open(Super) diff.

Got my Transaxle ordered 3.78 1st 2.06 2nd 1.30 3rd .89 4th 3.44 RP and a limited slip diff. Thanks for all the Info @LI-Rick, @DannyP, @ALB Greatly Appreciated

@Former Member, who did you order it from?

@Michael McKelvey I got it from Wright Gear Box

@Former Member

What you've chosen sounds decent, but you'd get nicer rpm drops(not too much drop) with a 1.35 3rd and a 1.0 4th. Plot it out, works nicely with a 23" high tire.

You're going custom 3rd with 1.30 correct? Change it to 1.35, it will tighten your 2-3 shift nicely. Also change 4th to 1.0, since you just shortened 3rd. I'm advocating just one more custom gearset, adding about $400 to your cost. They're in stock right now at Weddle. You'll need for each ratio: gear, splined idler, and splined cone.

But in my defense, what I typed just above is about the most even trans you can get with a stock 1-2 mainshaft.

Check out the "percentage pull" chart on the Weddle gear calculator. With a 4 speed, you get 3 percentages, so try to get them at as close to 33% as you can.

Here's a chart

Here's another calculator:

From what I've seen and read, you want your rpm drops between changes to decrease as you upshift. 1-2 2700, 2-3 2068, and 3-4 1556.

By comparison, my rpm drops will be 1-2 2634, 2-3 1959, and 3-4 1385.

Boy, that's close! Why did I spend all that money? I could have saved $1000! LOL!

@Former Member posted:

Got my Transaxle ordered 3.78 1st 2.06 2nd 1.30 3rd .89 4th 3.44 RP and a limited slip diff. Thanks for all the Info @LI-Rick, @DannyP, @ALB Greatly Appreciated

What brand LSD fits with the 3.44 Ring and pinion? I'd like to know. And how much is it?

Another thing: The Weddle 3rd and 4th gears have SPLINES for the hub to idler gear interface. There is NO welding necessary.

@DannyP I don’t know the brand I can find out tomorrow for you. I can tell you it was a extra $ 1400. I decided to go with it after talking with Rick from Wright Gear Box I told him that in the future I may be going with a larger engine with more HP and I wanted to make sure it could handle it.

@Former Member posted:

Got my Transaxle ordered 3.78 1st 2.06 2nd 1.30 3rd .89 4th 3.44 RP and a limited slip diff. Thanks for all the Info @LI-Rick, @DannyP, @ALB Greatly Appreciated

Do you know what LSD they're providing?

@DannyP After looking at the calculator I believe your spot on I’m going to call tomorrow and change 3rd to 1.35 and 4th to 1.0 Thanks for the Heads Up.

@ALB I’m going to get the Brand name tomorrow and will let you know

@Former Member , when you speak with Rick, ask him who is the supplier of  the 3.44 r&p. I couldn’t find anyone that has had one available in a long time now.  

@LI-Rick posted:

@Former Member , when you speak with Rick, ask him who is the supplier of  the 3.44 r&p. I couldn’t find anyone that has had one available in a long time now.  

They probably bought a bunch of them and have them for customers' transaxles.  It's paid off- if you want 1 right now he seems to be the only game in town.  I'd bet that IF he'll sell just the r&p without a rebuild attached he wants a fair bit of coin for it.

@ALB posted:

Do you know what LSD they're providing?

Far out man.  Like, it's the best...

@ALB posted:

They probably bought a bunch of them and have them for customers' transaxles.  It's paid off- if you want 1 right now he seems to be the only game in town.  I'd bet that IF he'll sell just the r&p without a rebuild attached he wants a fair bit of coin for it.

I planned around the 3.44, and will have the same final gear ratios, just using a 3.88 instead. I just find it unusual that people keep saying they ordered a 3.44, and nobody seems to have one in stock.  You may be right that he has a bunch he bought earlier, but I'm always a little suspect.

@Former Member posted:

@DannyP I don’t know the brand I can find out tomorrow for you. I can tell you it was a extra $ 1400. I decided to go with it after talking with Rick from Wright Gear Box I told him that in the future I may be going with a larger engine with more HP and I wanted to make sure it could handle it.

Thank you. I'd appreciate that.

Anybody have an old 1.22 Bus 3rd gear? I'm looking for one for a FV trans.

@LI-Rick posted:

I planned around the 3.44, and will have the same final gear ratios, just using a 3.88 instead. I just find it unusual that people keep saying they ordered a 3.44, and nobody seems to have one in stock.  You may be right that he has a bunch he bought earlier, but I'm always a little suspect.

Yeah, that's why I asked about the LSD fitment also, since that is a known issue with the 3.44.

AFAIK, there are a few Torsen-geared: Quaife in England, Peloquin, Paul Guard of Guard Transmissions and maybe Weddle($1560 for IRS, with 091 Bus output splines, In Stock). These are all TBD(torque-biasing-differential) and not a true LSD(limited slip differential).

I heard the factory ZF will fit the 3.44, but you'd have to find one in good enough condition to use and then get friction plates for it. This is the only LSD that's ever been available, and it's rarer than hen's teeth. It's about as rare as finding a pristine barn find aluminum 550 in perfect condition, for $50.

If all the parts are available(and they're not right now at Weddle), a plain old 4 spider gear Super Diff for a swing axle with side gears and spiders will run $350 or so.

I’m glad you guys are telling me this. I am going to ask him because to the average Joe like me this is all foreign. He could be selling me a bunch of stuff that’s not in the transaxle.I will let you know.

@DannyP, @LI-Rick, @ALB I found out the name brand of the limited slip diff. It’s a Peloquin with a 091 out put.

@LI-Rick On the 3.44 RP he said he gets them directly from the gear manufacturer and the manufacturer wont sell to private individuals. He said he has them and to give him a call. His name is Rick at Wright Gear Box.  # 951-372-0404

@Former Member posted:

@DannyP, @LI-Rick, @ALB I found out the name brand of the limited slip diff. It’s a Peloquin with a 091 out put.

@LI-Rick On the 3.44 RP he said he gets them directly from the gear manufacturer and the manufacturer wont sell to private individuals. He said he has them and to give him a call. His name is Rick at Wright Gear Box.  # 951-372-0404

Thanks Arden!

For those needing to ship a transaxle, I found a plastic storage box at Costco that was a good size and the top can be bolted on.  I filled space on the sides of the transaxle with spray foam into plastic bags to keep it from moving around.

If 3.44s are available, that's GREAT for the hobby.

@Stan Galat posted:

If 3.44s are available, that's GREAT for the hobby.

Sure, as long as they’re not made out of chinesium.

@dlearl476 posted:

Sure, as long as they’re not made out of chinesium.

Almost all R/P gearsets have been Chinese for 10+ years, David.

Welcome to the "global village".