Jacking up the front using floor jack, then jack stands

Get herself a hockey puck and drill out the center to miss your beam adjusting nut. Put it in the cup of your floor jack. Or perhaps something like this would work.

Alternatively, you could probably find a welder that would be happy to make you some sort of cross-beam adapter, only with angle iron welded in a V on the uprights to grab your beam each side.

Wouldn’t need to be anywhere near as complicated as that. A simple plate to fit in the cup welded to a bit of U channel notched to a V-shape to fit the beam  

I used to jack up the front of my car by placing the jack under that beam adjuster all the time. Had the front end up in the arm a couple dozen times. Nothing was ever damaged on the car. If you’re worried cut a 4” piece of 2x4 and place it on top of the cup or saddle as it’s called. The bolt will press into the wood a little bit but it won’t shatter the wood or cause any other issues.

Not as convenient as a floor jack but if you have a pneumatic driver they’re not so bad.

@Robert M posted:

I used to jack up the front of my car by placing the jack under that beam adjuster all the time. Had the front end up in the arm a couple dozen times. Nothing was ever damaged on the car. If you’re worried cut a 4” piece of 2x4 and place it on top of the cup or saddle as it’s called. The bolt will press into the wood a little bit but it won’t shatter the wood or cause any other issues.

Exactly.

Lots of questions here, and a few good answers.  I am also assuming that you have never jacked up a Speedster based on a VW pan before.

(1)   Jacking up the front:

Center the floor jack under the threaded stud and nut in the center of the lower torsion bar.    Jack the F-ing thing up.  It was designed in the 1930’s and built in the 1960’s.  You’re not gonna hurt it.  It’s way stronger than you are.

Once you get it up high enough, place a jack stand under the lower torsion bar, close to where the trailing arms attach to the torsion bars, but inboard of the shock absorber vertical mounting arm. The stand should cradle the lower torsion tune.  The trailing arm attaches to the torsion bar tube at the shock absorber tower and goes back to attach to the wheel.  You can’t miss it.

Once you have the jack stands positioned under the ends of the lower torsion bars and inboard of the shock towers, gently lower the floor jack until the car has settled onto the jack stands but is still barely sitting on the floor jack.  Grab the front bumper and vigorously shake it to make sure it is held up securely. If nothing moves around and it feels solid, then you can get under there to work on stuff.  KEEP THE FLOOR JACK EXTENDED and locked UNDER THE TORSION TUBE AS A BACK-UP IN CASE IT SLIPS OFF THE JACK STANDS!!!!!!

You haven’t found the “Napolean Hat” because you don’t yet know what to look for.  Save that for later.  We’ll help you when the time is right.  Knowing where it is won’t help you in this exercise.

You found the two bolts on each side of the forward corner of the VW pan just ahead of the footwell and yes, they have un-equal length bolts.  Whomever installed them used two different length bolts.  No big deal.  Happens all the time.  You can center your floor jack under them and jack up each side with No I’ll effects, just be careful of any pan welds that project downward and maneuver around them as best you can.  If you jacked up under the torsion tube, then all of this sentence can be disregarded.

Jacking up the rear (this is what I do):

Look under the rear of the car just forward of the rear wheels.  

There is a space in the center of the car about 10” forward of the rear torsion bar tubes that forms a “Y” and on a Pan car has a little funnel thingie sticking down.  Center your floor jack under that funnel and jack the car up.  As it lifts off the floor, the rear wheels will hang down so you’ll have to go up a fair bit to get them off the ground.  Once you get it high enough, look just inside of, and about a foot forward of the tire for the end plate of the torsion tube.  You’ll see a thick metal end of the torsion tube at the outside ends of the tube and a big plate/arm goes from the center of the wheel to the torsion bar.  Place your jack stand under that end plate at the torsion tube with the jack stand top going left/right to cradle the torsion tube end piece.   Let your floor jack gently down onto the floor jacks, then grab the rear bumper and shake the hell out of it to insure that it is secure.  KEEP THE FLOOR JACK EXTENDED and locked UNDER THE TORSION TUBE AS A BACK-UP IN CASE IT SLIPS OFF THE JACK STANDS!!!!!

Now you can get under the car to work on stuff.  
Just be careful,OK?

What @Robert M and @DannyP said- with the piece of wood there making contact you won't hurt anything, as the front of your Speedster really isn't that heavy.

Thanks guys.  I simply raised it by placing the cup under the adjusting nut and pumped away (yes, rear wheels were chocked), easy peasy.

I placed the stands just inboard of the zirc fittings that are just inboard of the bumper brackets that are just inboard of the trailing arms.  I have the jacks on the lowest pawl for now, with the Jack touching lightly and valve closed.

It’s late, the garage is hot and I’ve already taken my shower.  I’ll revisit in the morning - any issue leaving the front end in the air for a bit?

Gordon I’ve jacked up a lot of things in my life.  I’ve not yet jacked up a pan based speedster and hopefully never will.  

Thanks again.

The first photo I posted that shows the contact point with the adjusting nut shows ‘image not found’ on my iPhone, so I’m posting again just for completeness.

Jack away. You won’t hurt it.

Get a rubber jack pad and you definitely won’t hurt it.

Kind of weird seeing that. My adjusters are further up on the beam. No way would a jack interfere.

I did and hopefully I didn’t.

By the way with the front wheels off, Napoleon's hat was in plain sight.  Not sure if I’ll ever need to know that, but I’ve checked off one more speedster scavenger hunt item.

I’m chasing a weird noise.  I will take my car to my air-cooled knowledgeable, and former JPS coupe owning mechanic tomorrow morning, I was just trying to look around for something odd looking.  

No signs of drum skin interference, nothing I grabbed seemed loose.  I did notice that the hubs were far from free wheeling.  They didn’t sound like they were scraping, but grabbing a stud and giving it a spin did not result in a few free spins before stopping.  I don’t think they turned a 1/4 turn on their own.  I know without a wheel there isn’t much mass to overcome bearing friction, bit what is normal?

If you are wondering what noise I speak of, I’m not sure how to describe it, and I figure asking for help by written words only is a silly request, but here goes.  The sound I hear has been present since close to the beginning.  I don’t recall if it was a month or three after having received my car when I first heard it, but I didn’t have but ~500 miles logged.  I would notice it only after having driven the car a while, and normally only at lower speeds, and often while slowing down (perhaps because engine and wind noise decreased allowing me to hear it).  I was still in the phase of becoming familiar with what sounded normal, so I just kept an ear on it.  In the past handful of months it is becoming clear the noise is more pronounced, and comes earlier in my drive.

The words I’d use is a rattling sound, and I imagine something not so light doing the rattling.   I don’t notice anything different in how my car handles or drives when I hear it.  It does not have a pitch that changes with engine revs, in fact when present it remains unchanged if I put the clutch in, take it out of gear, and remove my foot of the gas pedal and coast.  So I think I can eliminate power train.  It also does not change pitch with wheel rotational speed, bit once I get close to a stop at some point it goes away. It os always more a virus during deceleration or coasting, with the transaxle in gear or not. The sound origination is hard for me to pinpoint, but I’m more inclined to think it is below me and perhaps in front of me.  When present, say coasting at 30 mph on a quiet street), opening my door to see if I can hear the noise coming from beneath the car is of no help.  I also tried turning gently left and right and no change.  A few days ago I tried to gently apply the brakes, and this did appear to make the noise go away, only to return when I let off the brake.  This repeated a few more times, but only on a single drive.  After a 10 minute rest, I started the car back up and the noise did not return for at least a few minutes.

There was no evidence of brake fluid leaks and my reservoir remains full.  Handling and brake performance has been good throughout.  I’ve already put my wheels back on and set the car on the deck.  My mechanic is just a few miles away and I can take surface streets tomorrow morning.  

I’ll talk to my mechanic to check wheel bearings, suspension and brakes.  

In my head I can imagine the noise coming from something like a broken or loose torsion bar in one of my tubes, but I have no idea if that’s a thing or what that would sound like.

I know this is a silly ask, so maybe I’m not really asking.  Comments are always welcome.

Jon

Hmm, front brakes adjusted too tight?

“It also does not change pitch with wheel rotational speed, bit once I get close to a stop at some point it goes away.”

By “pitch” do you mean tone or frequency? (speed) If it speeds up and slows down with the car (sounding, for instance, like it happens once every revolution of the wheel) I’m with Michael, brakes are a little out of round. Or you bearings are loose/dry. Both noises generally go away when you apply the brakes  

FWIW, My Spyder does this on the LF wheel, too. But I haven’t worried about it because I’m due to replace the bearings and brake drums.

@Jon T posted:

I’ll talk to my mechanic to check wheel bearings

Given that your front wheels don't spin freely (they should), my money is on the wheel bearings. They might have been too tight and now bad. They will make a clicking noise when they're a bit too tight, and a growling, rattly noise when bad.

Let us know what your guys finds.

I took my car out for a short drive including a 1/4 mile stretch of gentle winding downhill and empty road.  Total drive was not more than 5 or 6 minutes.  During the downhill stretch I coasted out of gear at about 35 mph.  The noise of concern had not yet begun, but I could also hear a gentle thump-thump-thump that seemed to be directly related to wheel speed.  I did hear this yesterday, which was the first time I noticed it, but kept it out of my already excessively long post.  I also heard some squeaks that seem more present than before, but I am being a bit hypersensitive now.

When I was a block away from my garage the rattling noise appeared.  As before, there was no change in the frequency (high note, low note) of the sound as I slowed, and I would say there was obvious correlation between pace of the sound to wheel speed, but there was less and less noise as I came to a stop.

I rechecked my lug nuts, next drive is to the shop in the morning.

Let’s say it is related to wheel bearings.  Are the parts likely needed readily available?  Any unique aspect of the bearing assembly used by Greg’s setup that my mechanic may not know about?

Thanks again for all of the help.

Jon

Yes the parts are easy to get and the job is not hard, just messy.

Bearings might be the issue but I think you're short 1 or more anti-rattle spring clips on your brake pads. Or the slider pins are loose. Both easier fixes than the bearings.

The front wheel bearings are those for a late VW Beetle, ball joint front end, say, 1970 - 1974 or so.  The usual VW parts places should have them, even NAPA sometimes.

You could also have a rattle going on with the brake pads.  This is often helped by chamfering the forward edge (as the wheel spins) of the brake pads at a 30° - 40° angle with a coarse file to about half the pad thickness and about 1/4” back on the surface.

Did you mean the rearward edge of the pad, as that is what the rotor contacts first as it spins forward?

Ah, Danny......   You caught me.  Yes the leading edge of the pad as the rotor sees it.

Sometimes I don't know if I'm coming or going......  

Don't worry, this stuff is happening to me too, I'm just a little behind you in years.

@DannyP posted:

Don't worry, this stuff is happening to me too, I'm just a little behind you in years.

Jeanie and I started watching a BBC detective series on Netflix a couple of weeks ago. We got 5 minutes in when she said, “We’ve seen this. We watched it in Charleston when it was pouring rain”.

I had no recollection of ever having seen it. We watched it again (the whole series, in its entirety), and nothing at all about it rang a bell.

I’m going to make an EXCELLENT senile old man.

@Stan Galat posted:

Jeanie and I started watching a BBC detective series on Netflix a couple of weeks ago. We got 5 minutes in when she said, “We’ve seen this. We watched it in Charleston when it was pouring rain”.

I had no recollection of ever having seen it. We watched it again (in its entirety), and nothing at all about it rang a bell.

I’m going to make an EXCELLENT senile old man.

I did that not too long ago with some series on Netflix. I was 2-3 episodes in when I went “Hey, wait a minute…”

You don’t have to be old for those things to happen.  Back when I had hair and Blockbuster was a thing, more than once I rented a movie on my way home from work only to be lovingly told by my wife, as opening credits rolled, that we had rented the movie once before.

Beat you to it ,Stan!

My wife got me some Prevagen but I couldn't find it in the bathroom and then I forgot to take it anyway.

So I took my car by my mechanic.  His shop was full, more so than he predicted so he was not optimistic about having adequate time to diagnose and work on my car.  He did agree to go for a quick ride to hear the noise for himself.  So we went up and down the street two blocks and he got to hear it, although it was rather mild.  It sounded to him to simply be something that is loose.  We agreed I’d drive home and spend more time myself looking and prodding and if unsuccessful he may have improved availability next week.  

On my way home there was a stretch where the noise was in full bloom and I happen to be going a bit down hill at about 30 mph.  I repeated the test I did yesterday and gently tapped the brakes, and again the noise stops with light brake pedal pressure.  As soon as I let go it returns.  It did this three times in a row.  

So as soon as I complete a few chores around the house I will start my journey to learn about my disc brakes and discover what anti-rattle spring clips and sliding pins look like and where they are located, and if mine seem to be in hood order.  I may follow by at least looking at the outboard wheel bearing (after I buy thicker neoprene gloves).

I will start a new thread more appropriately titled.

I will leave you with a few pix of cars currently in George’s shop.

A ‘55 recently fully restored on the lift, replica with a 914 (?) engine on the ground.  The ‘55 was immaculate.  The replica is owned by a dealer so I would not be surprised to see this one on an auction site sometime soon.

The Morgan sits outside for now.


And there was a Spyder replica he is temporarily storing for a woman who bought it from George in 2017.  George says it was custom built from the ground up, it has a surprising amount of aluminum work, and is pretty special. George had a customer waiting so I was not able to learn more about it.

I'd say you've got a good shop. Nice cars, thanks for sharing.

After reading your last post, something else occurred to me. Your car being new I discounted it but worn ball joints can give off a kind of thud that will go away when you apply the brakes, too.  

I think it’s likely brake related, but it wouldn’t hurt to give everything in your front suspension/steering a good shake. It could easily be just something didn’t get tightened properly.