Just Saying Hi...

This article will surely help clear the confusion:
http://www.aircooled.net/vw-ha...g-suspension-tuning/

I have a 1960 pan based, Vintage Speedster built Speedster with swing axles in the rear.  I have an Empi anti-sway bar in the front and a CB Performance Camber Compensator in the rear.

 

Prior to having the CC in the rear I had a few incidents of body roll that were significant.  Of course I was burning up the twistys in the mountains around here and that was causing the body roll.  After I installed the CC I eliminated the body roll and now take the twistys even faster without fear of body roll. Now I just need to worry about the overall capabilities of the car itself whilst I push her to her limits.

 

If you are going to be on surface streets and highways all of the time and you don't ever plan on doing any spirited driving you may not need to put an anti-sway bar or a CC on the car.  They won't do anything for mundane Sunday morning drives.

 

Here's my previous write up with part numbers etc.

 

https://www.speedsterowners.com...y-bar-and-cc-upgrade

Get both.  A lot of value/performance/security for not a lot of money.

 

David - I have no sway bar on the front as it is nearly impossible to add one to the standard Beck chassis.  So far the car hasn't shown any nasty tendencies and sticks quite well any any curves I've subjected it to.

Thanks everyone! It helps a LOT with putting my Speedster together. Glad I joined the forum!

 

After doing some research, Tom has a good point about both having "a lot of value/performance/security for not a lot of money..."

 

I'll start researching brands for both front and back now.

       
       

Now what fun would that be? 100hp is for scooters, LOL

What's so different about it, Lane, that you can't add an anti-sway bar?

Yeah - The typical Sway-Away from bar mounts to the lower trailing arms which are VW all the way - nothing gets mounted to the frame.  Should bolt right in, with the usual mods to the front bumper hangers to provide bar clearance as the car unweights and the front of the bar swings upwards.

The Beck frame is made up of two 3" mandrel-bent tubes running front to rear.  In the front, the suspension is welded into the main tubes forming the forward-most cross beam.  The large tubes are in the way of mounting a sway bar.  Carey told me some time ago that adding one was not possible, nor was it needed.  I'd like to have one anyway, but I don't see how to do it.  Here's a picture of the frame.

 

^ Looks fun!

 

That was one thing I noticed when doing a bit of research last night; the need to modify the bumper hangers...

 

Once my chassis is complete, I'll be transporting it up to Kirk to assist in mounting the body. There might be some little mods needed and his Team can help...

After seeing that picture of a Beck Frame (pretty impressive, that), I still don't see why a Sway-Away or something similar wouldn't fit, but then I've never installed one on a Beck, either.  The bar doesn't touch anything forward of the torsion tubes except for the bumper mounts, and all mounting is done to the trailing arms.

 

In a pinch, I would look at a bar off of a Toyota or Nissan - the type with dog-bone links on the ends - and mount it to the torsion bars with the free ends attached to the lower shock absorber mounts with the dog-bone links, just like an original Speedster.

 

Has anyone installed a front anti-sway bar on a Beck Speedster??

Chiming in here, probably saying something stupid, but, let me make sure I understand what is being discussed: You several people are trying to figure out a way to put a front sway bar on a car that did not come with one from the factory, and which the factory owner/builder says it won't fit and is not needed, and that builder/owner also built this car, which his son is driving hard and well in races on race tracks?

 

Is that about right? 

Ed- Volkswagen recognized the value of front anti-sway bars and so equipped beetles starting about 1955 or '56. I'm sure someone here will know when Porsche started putting them on their cars. Enterprising individuals quickly realized the bar could be heavier and bolted up 2 bars on their cars' front ends until (I believe) Empi started selling a heavier bar. Any Volkswagen (or VW based car) handles better (more predictably) with a front anti-sway bar.

 

Lane, Carey is correct in saying that it's "not needed" but I think he's doing his customers a dis-service by designing their cars so existing sway bars don't fit. You could argue that chocolate, alcohol, having enough money to build/buy these cars and any number of other "life's pleasures" aren't needed, but they do make our time on this planet more bearable (especially the alcohol if you have kids!). 

 

PS- Ed, if you were to look at that car closely, I'll bet there are sway bars on that car, and I'd put money on them being adjustable.

"Mounting the body"  This is your chance to make a good waterproof bond between the body and the pan. Many pan based Speedsters can get deep water on the floor when going through a really heavy downpour.  Better to make it waterproof during construction than after the fact.

 

Also--find those cavities that are in front of the rear tires where the water is thrown up against the rear of the body---one on each side.  Fill those suckers with silicone or similar so no water can enter the car's floor through that route. At Carlisle one year John Steele showed me this secret and it made a permanent water barrier and the floor is always dry now.

 

And while you are in the build process slather the floor with a good pliable truck bed liner then install Dynamat before the carpet goes in.

 

If I had it to do over (which I don't) I'd source some of those fabulous German square weave carpets that go into the IMs.  Fantastic stuff---real, not fake square weave.  Gorgeous stuff.  Henry let me look through his sample books at Carlisle 

one year and I couldn't believe the quality and appearance of his carpet.

 

Your car is coming along so nicely and surprisingly fast. Can't wait to see it completed--I already know it will be sensational judging from the care you ae taking so far.  Congrats!

 

My goal is to seal the crap out of everything, even though it won't see any rain/water (that's the goal).

 

I did seal everything underneath before I sprayed the underside coating (rubberized spray from Restoleum). I didn't think about Dynomat, but it makes sense. Does that add a lot of weight to the car?

 

I definitely plan on using German square weave for the interior. It will be worth it in the long run

 

I'm pretty OCD with my builds

Down side is that wet wool square weave carpet smells just like a dirty old wet shaggy dog - and takes forever to dry out.  Great look but only if you live in desert conditions. 

That might be a good reason why original Speedsters only came with rubber mats on the floor.

 

Some owners added coco mats later on (mostly in Cabs and coupes, not Speedsters) but they still were delivered to dealers with rubber mats.

Dynomat?---damned skippie!  Makes a world of difference.  Put it in the door too---against the inside against the fiberglass.  What a satisfying "thunk' it makes when the door is closed.  Doesn't weigh much--you will have an overpowered less than 1,700 pound car so the Dynomat isn't a factor.  I'd never have a Speedster without it!  Also the engine noise is cut in half by the piece of Dynomat between the cabin and the engine.

 

Someone is gonna jump in here with some cheaper tar based stuff you can get at lowes but I like the real Dynomat!

 

Do some others here have Dynomat in your cars?   (But let's not turn this into a Dynomat thread!)

 

 

Another thing that hasn't been mentioned yet, Brian, is upping the caster in the front suspension when you install the beam. VW's came with the minimum caster that made the car track properly at freeway speeds, as this also made the care easier to maneuver at parking lot speeds for really lightweight (think 105lb ladies) drivers. The car will wander at higher freeway speeds, and as you go faster it can be downright scary, not to mention dangerous.

 

The Bentley manual will tell you that caster isn't adjustable (I just looked) but VW has made caster wedges since the late '50's or very early '60's, and the aftermarket makes them as well- http://www.geneberg.com/advanc...dge&x=9&y=12

 

They go under the bottom beam and a pair will make the car just that much more safe and fun while you're going fast, and the added low speed steering effort is minor. Al

 

 

Already done

 

It was recommended by Kirk and his techs. They gave me a pair for each side. I installed them when I mounted the front beam.

 

I plan on never introducing the Speedster to water. I have a daily driver that I toy around with too.

 

I'm also planning on Opti Coating the paint to help with protection and easy washes (minimize water usage since I'm in CA).

My floor hasn't been wet in over 40,000 miles.  I'd love that IM carpet if I hadn't replaced my carpet set a while back.

 

Of course if your car takes on lots of water and gets your interior wet there's always indoor-outdoor carpet.

I asked Henry to add into the door cavities on my recent Turbo upgrade.  His research led him to this product.  http://www.ballistic-online.com/ 

I can notice the difference, was already good but ultra quite now.

 

I hear that a lot. I've had two cars with wool square weave and one with synthetic loop carpet. The wool carpet has never smelled at all, nor has it taken a long time to dry when it does get wet. Not once. If wool was synthetic and had a name like "wic-tec" or some such malarkey, people would be going ape over it.

 

Wool is all that, and a bag of chips.

Yep.  German square weave is excellent carpeting. 

 

Lasts forever and looks classy.

Some more photos...

More photos...

Nicely done but I would like to suggest you replace the chassis silicone caulk with 3M or NAPA brand seam sealer as the caulk isn't the best permanent solution.

Send me the measurements when you can this weekend.....tnx!

Looks great - I'm sure that's far more attention than a "factory" build would have gotten.  I don't like using silicon for exposed body sealing of seams - it does peel off and paint doesn't stick long to it.  I prefer urethane body sealer in caulking tubes or brush-on - Auveco, 3M or Eastwood are popular brands. I did use silicon (lots of it) when mounting the body to the pan.

 

 

Liquid nails is another inexpensive option . It really works well and Lowes or Home depot have it. Plus there open late and on the weekends when you local paint and body shop supple store is closed. I got caught working late one night like 3:00 am and needed some seam sealer, Wal-mart was open. Liquid nail fit the bill. No problems thus far. I have used it in the past on other cars. Cheap and easy to get. Buy the least expensive as it works just fine as a seam sealer.Just my two cents

Here is what I used for the underside prior to spraying the heavy duty rubberized undercoating. I am planning to use it on the top side before laying the dynomat down. It may not be the "best" stuff, but I believe it will suite my build...

Seam sealer the only way to correctly do that job and only do it just once.  Alan

Not my words - from internet (so must be true):

 

 

Silicone rubber has acetic acid in it and can make metal rust and rot pretty badly. Its a common problem with novices putting in auto windshields, the frames wind up rotting out.

Use seam sealer.

 

Looks like I will get some Eastwood Seam Sealer via Amazon... The under body is already done and sprayed over... but I'll get the inside done using the seam sealer instead of what I got... Thanks!

Got some more work done today. It was my Thanksgiving treat (the wifey took care of the baby). Although, I am a little pissed. The rear disc brake kit I got from So Cal Imports had TWO RIGHT REAR calipers. WTF?!? I was in a rush and didn't open the entire box while at the shop, but I shouldn't have to.

 

Nonetheless, I was able to custom make the hard brake lines to the rear and got the e-brake cables/handle set up. With a shorten pan/chassis, I wanted to custom make the hard brake lines.

 

Posts are useless without photos... enjoy! Happy Thanksgiving!

 

Looking at the photos I see quality workmanship!

In building a speedster you'll have more than one part sent wrong or doesn't quite fit...it's all part of the Madness ~

Thanks, Alan!

My only concern is the flares at the end of each hard brake line. I haven't tested the system yet and I hope the tool I was using did a good job. It's the proper European flare, but I did it all by hand so we will see...

This isn't the first time the parts were wrong. It gets a little frustrating since I don't have a lot of time to work on it with a new baby and all... I get SO excited to have parts and start working... BOMB... Damn parts are wrong... Oh well...