Looking for info on installing oil cooler

I am going to install an oil cooler for my 2054cc engine.......I really need some help on this one. Any information and pictures of installations would be greatly appreciated. Help HElp HELp HELP

No one around here has a clue where and how to do it so I need to do it myself. I don't have any choice as everything in the engine is exactly to spec and after having a good tune up I'm still getting hot on days over 80 degrees.

Steve: Do a search on oil coolers on this forum - we covered this a few months ago and that info might be useful for you.

Also, make sure that all of your engine compartment shields are in place (NOT the engine tins, but the shields that seal off the entire engine compartment as you look into the rear hood). The top side of the engine should be completely sealed off from everything else, especially the lower part of the engine where all of the heat is. Make sure you have an opening in the firewall directly in front of the fan intake on the front of the engine so you get as much fresh air into the intake as is possible.

A couple oil cooler location alternatives I've seen that look pretty trick: Henry at Intermechannica mounted George Browns' cooler in the drivers side engine compartment wall, between the left rear wheel and the engine, with the fan blowing OUT. Bear in mind that he also installed a Carrera-style louvered engine cover to get more air in there in the first place, but that is probably overkill.

Another place I've seen that looks really good, is to mount the cooler in front, on a shallow angle (think Ford GT-40 cooling, here), between the bumper mounts with airflow running up through and down toward the rear, with the fan blowing down. For this, you'll have to run oil lines through the central tunnel from the engine to the front.

For the best oil cooling, IMHO you should only be considering a POWERED cooler with an integral fan. For a really good one, take a look at the Derale 15820 at:

www.derale.com/fanmountedoilcoolers.shtml

It has AN8 connectors attached for oil lines, is a 16-pass low-profile version and it does a great job. While it's about 3 1/2 inches thick, it has beefy mounting tabs and is pretty easy to locate. It would fit onto that left side wall nicely, if you haven't anything else there already.

Hope this helps........gn

I agree with Gordon and would add the Setrab cooler to the list of good external oil coolers. John, at Air Cooled Net sells them. Very compact and efficient.
I have my fan/cooler mounted over the tranny (not a Setrab). I'm not really crazy about this location, but it fits okay (this is a fairly common location). I'm running a 911 shroud and this is my only oil cooler.
Ron

thanks i will try and figure out how to mount one like george has and duplicate his inlet air for the fan.......im also going to convert to the OEM 356 pulley and welded and balanced fan. If these things dont work I may be in trouble.

Steven:

These pictures don't show much, but my oil cooler is installed above the rear driver's side tire (99 IM). Has a thermo operated fan.

About Ron O's cooler over the tranny:

That's almost a perfect location on a CMC (and looks like other bodies as well), as the body has a couple of reinforcing points behind the back seat (they look suspiciously like wood 2 X 4's glassed between the bulkheads). It would be really easy to mount a cooler on those 2 X 4's, blowing down. Size would be important to fit the space, but it would still mount easily, and running the oil lines would be easy, too.

There have been discussions on this forum about how much air gets up in there, but the entire bottom of that void is open so I don't believe this to be too much of an issue, and you could isolate the input and output with aluminum flashing to make it more efficient.

I would try it without the flashing first, to see if you think you need it.

I think all go with the wheel well location just for ease of maintenance and installation........im also going to cut a hole for the fan inlet to get better air to the inlet......anyone have picures or suggestions on this upgrade?

I have the oil cooler and the install pretty much figured out, looks pretty straight forward, but since im going with the 356 fan pulley and welded and balanced fan i just as well do the inlet hole and complete the total running cool upgrade. Im going to get medieval on this thing!!!!!

Gordon, just a note of interest; when I re-enstalled the motor last year I forgot to hook up the oil cooler fan (remember that I'm running a 911 shroud, so the cooler over the tranny is the only one). I was really worried when my temps headed towards the red zone while driving around town, until I realized that my fan wasn't on. The oil temp seems to level off at around 210 to 220 while driving around town with the fan off. If I could do it all over again I'd go with a doghouse shroud, stock or T4 oil cooler and mount something like a narrow Setrab cooler in the front. Maybe cut an opening under the bumper, like Henry at Intermeccanica does for the air conditioning. Ahnendorp of Germany sells them, but they're worth a fortune.
Ron

Ron: why your current 911 cooling system is not convincing you? is it not cooling right?, because in my opinion is a very cool looking and very efficient system.

For what it is worth, I installed the oil cooler at the back of the driver's side front wheel well. (VS Speedster) I used copper tubing to and from the engine that I ran under the left side of the frame. The oil cooler has a fan, but because the oil temp is within acceptable limits even when traveling at 70+ in Florida, I have not connected power to the fan. My engine is close to 2.0 liters with Gene Berg heads. I'm almost afraid to ask for comments.

I thought that unless you had a dry sump (aka Porsche 911) that it was not a good idea to place cooler very far from the engine -- due to drop in oil pressure? Makes sense to me in that most stock pumps are designed to pump oil maybe a total of 2-3 feet. Any thoughts on how long a hose could be before it affects oil pressure? Would a heavy duty Melling oil pump compensate?

I cut the inlet hole yesterday, and today I am installing the oil cooler. I decided after going back and forth to put it in behind the drivers side rear wheel well. I did this because the oil lines were the shortest this way and I didn't want to create extra heat above the transmission right where I am pulling air in for the inlet on the doghouse fan.

Steve, nothing wrong with the system. It's just that it was very expensive.
Ron

I ended up doing the inlet, external oil cooler, and balanced and welded fan............didnt have time to get the 356 pully but can now do it easily if necessary later.........i couldnt do the oil cooler up front as you mentioned because i have the air conditioning system already there

Steven,

Don't keep us in suspense- how'd it work?

I have the car in for professional final tuning today.........when I have a little more time I will start doing it myself, but I'm trying to get the car done and working on other things at the same time. I will give you official report after I have driven it this week.

I made the inlet the same size as the inlet opening to the fan...about 5.5". I will make a really nice block off plate for when it gets cooler out, but I don't think that will be a problem until september and I will do the work then. For now I just have a fine wire mesh protecting from pulling in any road debris.

George S. Actually, I believe that I have an upgraded oil pump. I bought the engine form a friend who built it up with Berg parts. At any rate, any pressure drop caused by the length of tubing is negligible. Sharp bends are more important (to avoid). The size of the tubing is also a factor. Too small a diameter will cause an unacceptable pressure drop. One reason I used copper tubing was because of the smooth interior surface which also affects pressure drop.
I looked over the available locations for the cooler and was not pleased with any location. Above the transmission was a nightmare. The rear fender wells did not have the space I deemed required and there is the problem of heat from the exhaust and engine. Thus, I chose up front where I at least know the air is cool. But, choices are individual and as long as it works, that's what counts. The fact than I do not need to use the fan says something.

Steven, and others,
It sounds like we're doing about the same thing; installing oil coolers above/behind the left rear wheel. I've just comleted my relocation from under the tranny, where upon driving the car for the first time, I hit something that cracked one of the two coolers that were there (dual 11" sq. coolers w/fans). I haven't had the car out enough to tell about heat generation since the car isn't finished. The one thing about this location is vulnerability to damage. What do you think the best protection might be?
-Tim

Has anyone considered a thin, long cooler under the front bumper, or just below the front part of the fiberglass body? The airflow would be excellent and unless you hit the parking curb (while parking) it would be safe from damage. The distance is fairly long but I thing that most hd pumps could handle it, as long as the lines were the correct diameter. A good combo with this would be a big 3 quart sump.
Ron

I'd given that under the front bumper location a lot of thought, but more in line with a cooler angled back at 20 - 30 degrees above horizontal at the rear, with a small scoop lip just below the body line to direct air up and through the cooler. There's just enough room in there to mount one between the bumper mounts, and the feed tubes could either be metal and mount under the pan (rigid copper tubing comes to mind), or flexible and run through the tunnel. Any of the full-flow pumps would be able to handle the flow, as you're not pumping any height, just pushing it around at the same level.

I put it in the far back and I ran it with the fittings facing down to keep it as far away from the wheel and to give the best clearance from the road.......I only have one cooler and it is a 10" unit from
Derale. I bought the thin line with the 8 pass and 650cfm.....this should be plenty for my appication, but we shall soon see?

I've seen many 356 coupes run oil coolers in the front of the cars
in the Monterey Historic Races. I really beleive this is the best choice. Currently I'm running two ext. coolers one above the trans with a fan and one hanging off the rear torsion beam horizontal with the bottom of the car. The oil still heats up but the heads stay cool...go figure. Still could use more cooling for the oil. I did add a duct to direct the air to the cooler above the fan once...that helped with a 10 deg. drop in temps. Really need air passing over the coolers.

J-P

Ron, I'll post a picture of my cooler installation today or tomorrow. I've got a cooler from an RX7 and its about 5 inches high by about 24 or so wide. It sits just behind the front bumper up tight to the bottom of the fiberglass area that houses my battery. I fabricated a little aluminum box with a lip that just dips about and inch or so below the front bumper catch the airflow.

Its plumbed back to a Mocal thermostat that sits under the rear "seat" area as close to the motor as possible. All AN12 braided stainless hose to a from.

I'll get a couple of pictures tonight if it gets above zero degrees here today.

Brian

Thanks Brian. I'm running an 'S' type cooler in my 911 pickup. The cooler is located just behind the front beam. Now that is a lllooonnnggg line, way back to the 2.7. No pump/pressure problems etc (65,000 miles on the motor). Mind you, it's a 911 Porsche motor.
Ron

Well here's a few pictures but I'm not a very good camera person. And I didn't realize how dirty the car was under there until I snapped these pictures! I'm more than a bit ashamed...;( If it ever gets above zero I'll get under there with a scrub brush, wire brush and some POR-15.

The Mazda RX7 cooler is a nice fit. Fits right between the points where the beam attached to the frame. It supposedly has the same flow rate as a 911 cooler but I think I paid $30 for this one. Not bad compared to a 911 cooler. I put some mesh on the front that I cut out of an old filter I found at the dump...looked like a large, indistrial type of oil/material filter but the mesh on the outside is SS.

Brian

"if it ever gets above zero" ?????????????

What the heck is the temperature up there?

I can see that we're going to have to stage a big "Event" in Niagara when you move down there - I can just see it......20 - 30 356's lined up and down your street to welcome you to the lower lats.

gn

Gordon:

Count me in for that!

Bob

Brian...that's the best solution I've seen yet. Can you please take a couple more pics showing how the cooler attaches to the frame. I think I'll be going that rout myself. Which Rx-7 was the cooler from? How's the performance in 90+ deg. weather?

J-P

Snowed last night and I left the tub out uncovered ;(

I'll see if I can't jack up the front of the car this weekend and get some more pictures.

The Mazda coolers are cheap...there's a few on Ebay now. The top one below is at $26 and the one below it is at $5. Its a good idea to have them cleaned though to be sure no one's engine blew up and filled the cooler with bits of metal.

cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46095&item=2478821483&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46095&item=2479052070&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

You can buy adapters but after buying a couple (and they're expensive metric to AN) I ended up cutting the two banjo fittings just after where the hose hooks on and then cutting one AN union (steel male to male) in half and welding each half onto the end of the each banjo...works great for about $5.

The coolers have aluminum tabs (the coolers are all aluminum by the way) on each side with two mounting holes. I went to our local Crappy Tire and bought a length of 1/8 alum stock and bent two simple brackets that each bolted to the tabs and the sides of the coolers then went up with another bend to mount on the two front support members going from the frame/beam to the bumpers. The cooler just fits between those two.

As far as how does it work at 90 degrees...what's 90 degrees? It snowed here last night! To tell the truth I wouldn't know but I do know that a lot of guys who race Porsche 911's on a budget use these coolers as they are much cheaper than a Porsche unit. They claim they're perfect. I've got a Conair aviation 12 volt fan that I plan to eventually hook up behind the cooler but its not needed now!

Brian

Gordon/Robert...

I may putting that move off for a bit as the wife got a new job that's too good to pass up. Probably be another couple of years at least...

But I'll be down that way in a couple of weeks. Son graduates from university in TO and bought a car in Kitchener. So we'll pick up car, visit with son, put the car on train back to Edmonton, fly to
Florida for a few days (have to get some beach in this year) then back to Edmonton then drive up to YK. Hopefully the ferry will be running accross the MacKenzie ... touch and go at that time as Great SLave Lake has to break up and all that ice has to flow down river disrupting ferry service for a few days to a week...

Looking forward to fishing up here this year though as bought a boat at the end of last season, just before I went into the hospital, and never really got to use it. World class fishing up here!

Brian

Brian, I wonder if you would win the award for the guy who owns a speedster replica and lives the closest to the north pole?
Your cooler is an excellent way to go. After all, when do you need the extra cooling? Probably at higher speeds, on the highway. And the air flow would be awesome. Probably won't even need the fan.
By the way...I took my 911 pickup through air care (and easily passed), but it took me 30 minutes to go through Aircare and the temperature hit 210. Two block away I ran into a traffic jam and had to sit there for another 20 minutes and the temperature guage hit 230. I was getting a bit concerned, as I don't have a fan on my external cooler. Oil pressure dropped too...(I wonder why). She was okay once I got moving again, but a fan on my external oil cooler would have been nice....maybe next year. On the other hand, my IM can sit and idle for a long time and the temperature guage doesn't move much (then again, my external cooler has a fan).
Ron

Update on the cooling project...I got the car on the interstate today and drove for about 30 minutes at 75mph with 90 degree outside air temp. Oil temp did get up to 230 eventually but stabilized there and never went above.........I think I will be happy with this and it should be just fine??? Time will tell.

So Steve, was this an improvement? It's a weird thing about these cars, they get the oil hot but the heads always stay the same temp. even on hot days. Go figure. I really think the key is to get air to pass over/through the cooler....that RX7 cooler seems like just the trick as it's in the airflow and the unit sits at the same level as the sump thus no pressure or bleed back problems. I only worry about curb damage.

Brian...how did you rout the lines back to the engine...with copper, or flexable tubing ...through the center channel....down the rocker?

J-P

Braided stainless lines up under the rockers. In talking to some of the 911 guys they've used hydraulic hose that was rated for oil and the temps that we hit. Cheaper than the stainless.

The 911 was overheating in the IM even with the temps only getting 20 or so Celcius. Part of that was due to poor sealing of the engine compartment and advanced timing/hot plugs to compensate for rich carbs. I talked to Henry and he said that the cooler, with fan, was the only way he knew of to cool the 911 in the IM. He suggested Mocal but they're about $800US...but their website does have a very good PDF install, parts and pricing guide. Worth a look at...I think its under BAT in Florida.

Brian

Steven,
Glad to hear it worked out for you

I was running hotter before even with 70f outside temp and today it was 89f. Driving around town it maintains 200-210 and the head temps are now 290+or-10 all the time. Funny thing about the heads is they run about the same no matter what the outside temperature is. It was the oil temperature and oil lubricating properties failing that really worried me, so with the rebuilt heads and the air inlet the head temps are really good, and the oil cooler is helping keep the oil temps from reaching critical levels in all driving regimes. Top speed on my test......105mph......I don't think I would want to go faster that was scary enough for me. Speed was measured with GPS roadmap unit so I know it was real accurate. Although after figuring the speedometer back to MPH it was within 8MPH of being accurate at top speed and was more accurate at lower speeds.

The only other place I can think to mount a cooler and be really effective is just behind the horn grills. I think I've seen some 356 guys do this. Makes good sense.....out of harms way and good airflow. I'm not sure how to fab a bracket to get the coolers there but I bet it might be another good solution. Two coolers behind the horn grills with thermal switched fans helping to pull air through the cooler.

J-P

My new exhaust ships tomorrow, so yesterday, I thought I