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My visit to Specialty Autoworks

HossHoss
Howdee Speedster owners and future owners too. This is just a brief note to let you know that I had a long telephone conversation with Stephen Lawing, the president of Specialty Autoworks, Inc. earlier in the week and made an appointment for yesterday to visit his shop. After getting slightly lost due to poor mapquest driving instructions, I managed to arrive slightly late, or is it fashionably late.

Steve is a very personable fellow who has been in business in excess of twenty years and has a sizeable client base, many of whom have purchased multiple cars from him. I do not think that he intends to build many Speedsters since he does not have the capacity to do that.

Steve had been building pan-based Speedsters, in limited numbers, up to about three years ago. His main business seems to be street rods and a few exotics. He has concluded that there is a good deal of interest in the Speedster replica and has pursued the development of a prototype which he has referred to as generation one. Generation two is in pre-rolling chassis stage and has incorporated many suspension and floor pan changes as evolutionary design enhancements. Considerable effort has been put into getting the Speedster look right as evidenced by his attention to details.

Those of you who are interested in his car should visit his website www.specialtyauto.com to gain an appreciation of what his plans are and to gain a better understanding of the design parameters he is using. If you decide to call him, be prepared for a long telephone conversation. I think you will be impressed with his credentials and his ability to explain what he is doing and why.

As far as the car goes, I have posted some pictures of the generation one prototype. The car looks good, considering it is a pre-production vehicle without all systems working. I had an opportunity to ride in the car and it is indeed relatively quiet and quite quick. The car has the 165bhp 2.5 Sabaru engine which had a somewhat lopey idle and made its presence known only during fairly brisk acceleration and when backing off. The seats were comfortable and I sensed that I was sitting somewhat higher than in my VS. I liked it. Would I buy one? Too early to tell.

If you have the Speedster fever, you may be in for a bit of a wait, but check with Steve directly to confirm that fact. I will be happy to answer some specific questions offline as well as I can.
John H.

 

 

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HossHoss
Howdee Speedster owners and future owners too. This is just a brief note to let you know that I had a long telephone conversation with Stephen Lawing, the president of Specialty Autoworks, Inc. earlier in the week and made an appointment for yesterday to visit his shop. After getting slightly lost due to poor mapquest driving instructions, I managed to arrive slightly late, or is it fashionably late.

Steve is a very personable fellow who has been in business in excess of twenty years and has a sizeable client base, many of whom have purchased multiple cars from him. I do not think that he intends to build many Speedsters since he does not have the capacity to do that.

Steve had been building pan-based Speedsters, in limited numbers, up to about three years ago. His main business seems to be street rods and a few exotics. He has concluded that there is a good deal of interest in the Speedster replica and has pursued the development of a prototype which he has referred to as generation one. Generation two is in pre-rolling chassis stage and has incorporated many suspension and floor pan changes as evolutionary design enhancements. Considerable effort has been put into getting the Speedster look right as evidenced by his attention to details.

Those of you who are interested in his car should visit his website www.specialtyauto.com to gain an appreciation of what his plans are and to gain a better understanding of the design parameters he is using. If you decide to call him, be prepared for a long telephone conversation. I think you will be impressed with his credentials and his ability to explain what he is doing and why.

As far as the car goes, I have posted some pictures of the generation one prototype. The car looks good, considering it is a pre-production vehicle without all systems working. I had an opportunity to ride in the car and it is indeed relatively quiet and quite quick. The car has the 165bhp 2.5 Sabaru engine which had a somewhat lopey idle and made its presence known only during fairly brisk acceleration and when backing off. The seats were comfortable and I sensed that I was sitting somewhat higher than in my VS. I liked it. Would I buy one? Too early to tell.

If you have the Speedster fever, you may be in for a bit of a wait, but check with Steve directly to confirm that fact. I will be happy to answer some specific questions offline as well as I can.
John H.

FM Former Member
That was my first time for posting a picture to this site......if I can do it from the directions anyone can! Good directions Theron, now if you could just explain how to export an excel spreadsheet into my outlook so that I could then trusync my telephone to my outlook....believe me its impossible using their directions
(Message Edited 9/6/2003 6:04:17 PM)
guru39guru39
I believe the car that John was shown is automatic. As I understand it, the next car is to be a manual five-speed. The Subaru automatic transmission is much heavier than the manual and hence affects the front/rear weight distribution significantly. I suspect the manual car offers an opportunity for improved handling by lightening the car and allowing the weight distribution to approach 50/50. Let's hope Mr. Lawing is successful in his endeavors but his production rate will likely never approach Vintage, JPS or IM.
FM Former Member
I visited Steve's facility this spring and was very impressed. However, I decided to order a new IM (to be delivered around the end of Spetember). I saw the prototype (in pieces) and, yes, it is an automatic. Steve is sourcing the engine, tranny, brakes,etc. from wrecked cars, which was a negative for me. Nonetheless, the car is interesting and I plan to follow his progress.
HossHoss
Guys,
Yes, the generation one prototype is an automatic. The five speed close ratio Sabaru transmission will be an option, about a six hundred dollar extra. The car I rode in weighs just over 2000#, and has a weight distribution of about 47/63. The manual will be almost 200# lighter and will be close to 49/51 distributed. Being a prototype, it is hard to accurately guage how the finished product will look, but Steve's other cars look great. There will be a trunk in the front and the back. The Speedster cooling grill on the rear deck is a dummy, for looks only. The radiator is located in the driver's side rear wheel well behind the wheel. Provisions have been made for a second radiator on the other side if cooling becomes a problem with the auto trans and A/C. The two speed cooling fan seems to do a good job on the prototype, keeping the water temperature at about 190 degress F.
FM Former Member
now if the turbocharged version were possible and you used the second wheel location for backup cooling.......oh baby this car may require some driving lessons before delivery....it is neat to see someone trying to develop a new product, but I agree that SAW doesn't probably want to produce the same kind of numbers of cars as the other manufacturers.
HossHoss
The location looked a little questionable to me also. I would like to believe that there will have to be some kind of grill to prevent at least large objects from being thrown up into the radiator. As far as the turbo goes, I don't think that will happen. Someone asked about producing it as a "one off" and I don't think Steve went for it. It will be interesting to see how the project unfolds. There are already changes from the statements on the website. For example, coil overs will not be an option, they will be standard equipment.

Also, the way the donor car is utilized is foreign to us Speedster guys, but is apparently common practice with other "kit cars" and street rods. The Speedster will have an all new chassis and most of the steering and suspension will also be new except for the rear spindles. The cars which are selected will carefully screened, low mileage examples, I was told.
FM Former Member
I might be wrong about specifics, but in Japan they have laws that discourage people from keeping their cars for more than a few years and in a sense force you to keep buying new cars once your car is a few years old, or something like that. For that reason low mileage (30k or less) engines are imported here and can be had very reasonable. Complete import turbo Suby engines can be had for what I consider bargain prices. Their stock HP ratings would more than exceed my expectations, 100,000 between tune-ups, blast furnace heaters, air conditioning, cruise control... Japanese engineering, ah, but I know some will moan about breaking with tradition.
HossHoss
Good point, Erik. Keep in mind however that the SAW cars will probably not be a car for the shade tree mechanic. The engines will be incredibly complex computer controlled marvels which have ports for connection for electronic analysis. This may be just what some potential customers are looking for but an anathema for the do it yourselfers. It depends on which camp you are in. A Speedster with a catalytic converter.....think about it. You can drive your car proudly displaying a Green Peace sticker.
FM Former Member
It really comes back to the old replica versus kitcar debate.....it seems common place in the kitcar industry to use good donor parts....where as the replica manufacturers go with all new. I don't mind used good parts.....in fact sometimes the used ones are better then the new. Take for example the valve cover thread that is currently in progress, some guys have bought new stuff only to find out that the old stuff was better. It wouldn't bother me, just as long as the used parts are checked before installation. I would want to be a little more involved in any decisions on optional parts and would need a very detailed parts list for future repair reference.
guru39guru39
You bring up an interesting discussion when you mention the debate over kitcars versus replicas. Many people view these as the same but you seem to discern the difference. I have always built (or had built) what I call replicas or re-creations. However, anytime anyone approaches me, they always ask if it is a kitcar. Sometimes I really don
FM Former Member
I may be wrong but it seems that most people use three categories to define the manufacturing process for the car..

1. Kitcar, a car which comes in pieces to the end consumer to build and put together. A kitcar may be made to look like an original vintage of automobile or not an may come in different levels of completion, but is ultimately put together by the end user. This could be anyone willing to turn a wrench and assemble their own car.

2. Replica, a car which is built by a manufacturer to a rolling chassis or turnkey configuration. These cars are always made to look like an original vintage, but may not be perfect copies. A good example being the parking brake location. The last criteria being that the manufacturers name carries a brand association. Good examples would be Intermeccanica, and Vintage. Of course the rolling chassis option would be considered to be "coachwork by" that company and then the person may or may not describe who performed the rest of the work.

3. Professionally assembled is where things start to get a little grey for me....I think of these as usually a kit being built by someone other then the end user. But what I can't help is wondering which of these assemblers is producing work comparable to a replica manufacturer and sometimes maybe even better? What I do notice in some of the adds of cars for sale are "professionally built" and they don't say by who.....if the builder is without name recognition I don't think this automatically elevates the car above one built by someone at home. I find this distinction to be curious and worthless at the same time.
(Message Edited 9/9/2003 10:18:37 AM)
FM Former Member
Steven, I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that over 1,000 guys have had businesses that built "the kit of your choice, professionally assembled" in their garage or some rented work space only to go out of business in a very short period of time. The cars they produced were usually marginal in both mechanical and cosmetic ways. One of these might make a good project car if it was inexpensive to buy.
(Message Edited 9/9/2003 3:36:30 PM)
FM Former Member
I have to say my opinion for right now is that the liquid cooled design is in its infancy and is not ready for me, but I could also say that of the early IM vehicles and they are a great car at this time. As with most things the quality gets better with time, and if it doesn't.......like george says they will be gone quickly
HossHoss
Patrick,
I would have to say that I am definately considering a SAW Speedster in the future. I intend to keep in touch with Steve as the project unfolds. He has been in business for over twenty years, and unless he has read the market wrong, he will ultimately succeed. It will be interesting to see if he can hold his price to the level he has published on his website, especially as his cars get out there and the demand increases. I like the car for a reason beyond what has been mentioned, and that is emissions compliance. In Tennessee, we have discovered that we have major polution problems, among the worst in the country. Their was a meeting in my village regarding the sources, which include industrial, coal-fired power production, lawn and garden equipment, natural and motor vehicles. Motor vehicle inspections was raised as one of the treatment possibilities, which is ominous. Who knows how that one will play out. Currently, there are no such inspections in most of Tennessee, but isn't it the little guy who usually gets creamed when the do-gooders go on the warpath? That's one of the reasons an emissions compliant vehicle is attractive.
Oh well, maybe I'll be exempted due to age of vehicle, but the committee also talked about economic incentives to "encourage" people to take their old cars and off road equipment out of service. Yikes!
John H.
Stan GalatStan Galat
Johnny,
"... the committee also talked about economic incentives to "encourage" people to take their old cars and off road equipment out of service..."

and buy newer, more efficent vehicles (one would assume the logic would go).

Do you suppose anyone proposing this has actually considered the enviornmental impact of manufacturing "newer, more efficent vehicles"? I would just about guarantee that I could drive my speedster for the rest of my life, give it to my heirs, and have them drive it until they die, and still not BEGIN to approach the enviornmental impact of having one new car built. Most "greener than thou" people don't seem to connect their own consumerism with the pollution they decry. Saving old things is the "greenest" thing I can think of. Constantly buying newer, more efficent gadgets is not. As usual, most people's answer to any problem is to buy something...
(Message Edited 9/10/2003 10:56:21 PM)
HossHoss
Stan,
I think I am in agreement with you. We live in an age where it is OK to throw away many things which we should keep and buy everything which will make our lives better and make us happier. Bah, humbug. So maybe I'll just keep Algebra. I'll still keep an eye on SAW, though. Darn it all, now I'm being ambivalent.
FM Former Member
In our society everything has become transient - jobs, friends, religious and political affiliations, residences, and husbands or wives. I believe this is mostly due to the incredible growth of communications in the last half of the twentieth century and the rather cushy "have it now" life style we have enjoyed since World War II.
FM Former Member
John , could you tell me more about your visit to specialty autoworks ?. How is the quality and how does it compare to the other manufaturers? .performance? , handling? . The car should have excellent performance , does it ? . I am seriously considering this car in the future , but with a stsndard tranny . Does the car feel solid and safe ?. Sorry about the questions , but I think you are the only person to see and drive this car .
HossHoss
Patrick,
It's a bit premature to answer most of your questions. I rode in but did not drive the generation 1 prototype. Steve had to baby it a bit because he had been having problems breaking axles. He said he is having new ones built by one of his suppliers which can handle the power. The generation 1 has the 165bhp engine, so I'm sure it would go like stink if he had turned it loose. It is difficult to tell by evaluating the test bed vehicle alone how the final product will be, but based upon the quality of the street rods this company turns out, it will most likely be very nice. The fit and finish was good in my estimation. Anyone who has placed an order to this point (I think I heard Steve say that there were six orders when I visited) are going to have a bit of a wait. I'll be in touch with him periodically, but you may want to contact him directly and get the straight poop.

As far as impressions go, the car seemed to ride well and speed built up rapidly with minimal throttle applied. We were on a straight two lane road, so I can't comment on how it handles in the twisties. The weight distribution projections indicate to me it should handle great. It was rather quiet and it was interesting how slowly the engine was turning at road speed, reading the tach. If the Speedster is your dream and you like the idea of a modern, efficient powerplant, this may be the way to go. Darn, now I'm getting excited again! BTW, I took Algebra out for a ride yesterday morning top down and some good heat would have been nice.
John H.
(Message Edited 9/30/2003 7:33:51 AM)
FM Former Member
A couple of years ago I stumbled into a web site by this guy in England that fitted his Speedster with a Suby turbo engine with EFI, it from a wrecked car. Ever since I have been kicking myself that I am not a mechanical adventurist... but one look at the photo of the maze of wires for the EFI unit, etc., and I chickened out.

Nevertheless before heading to the tall grass I did call a local auto engine importer -- used low mileage engines (20,000 to 30,000 miles) from Japan -- the cost for a used turbo EFI Suby engine with a two year warranty?, around $1,500 if my memory is correct. THAT is a lot of engine for the money.

What I have wondered is why JPS, Vintage or IM doesn't do what Specialty Autoworks is doing, that is offer the Suby engine as an option for those that don't want to dick around with setting valve clearances twice a driving season, those that LIKE the idea of a blast funerace heater and not having to dick around with clogged jets in dang carbs... Turn the switch and go, and even if the top doesn't seal well you are warm with knowledge that engine won't need jack for a couple hundred thousand miles. I know the traditionalist will howl, the engine builders will growl but that is progress.

Good luck Specialty Autoworks!
HossHoss
I'm certain that if IM, JPS and VS thought that there was significant demand for it, a Sabaru powerplant would be an option. However, it isn't as simple as an engine swap. IM may be the closest since they are already into the "mid engine" concept. What it boils down to, for me at least, is what is most important: tradition or practicality.
Just my 2 kroner
John H.
guru39guru39
Two thoughts. Sometimes availability creates demand. At present, SAW cannot produce enough to meet too large of a demand but Steve is working on it. Secondly, this Subaru conversion is not a project for the faint hearted. The conversion from a rear engine VW or Porsche to a mid-engine Subaru is quite an engineering accomplishment and requires time and investment. I would think that as long as there is adequate demand for VW-powered Speedsters, IM, JPS and VS would have no reason to invest the time and energy into a Subaru or water cooled conversion. I suspect the SAW Speedster will occupy a unique position in the market place for some time to come. The queue will build up quickly.
FM Former Member
Vintage and JPS must keep their eye on the price point ball. John adds extra value to his cars by paying special attention to detail. IM doesn't want or need to worry about price point per se. You pay for their quality, though on the back-end their cars retain their value really well.

Specialty Autoworks is smart to position themselves away from the other three manufacturers. It was a practical and savvy move to go with rack and pinon and other non-Vw components and engineer their package around the engine / transmission rather than retro-fitting. If the car performs well it should generate a lot of attention by the non-traditionists at its estimated base price of $26k.

It boils down to useage. How many miles per year do you drive your replica? There are low maintainance cars and no maintainance cars. I supect for many of us the Speedster is our third car, mine is. For a daily year-round driver the Suby is an attractive alternative, though it would be a shame if a turbo version isn't offered, though I don't have a clue why you would need 300 horsepower in a car this light... because its there?
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