Nearly new Intermeccanica for 27K?

I'm soliciting opinions about whether the car featured in the link below is a good deal at the asking price:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390037124510&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&viewitem=

All opinions welcome.

I didn't see anywhere that it says it's an Intermeccanica......
If that is true, then it's worth a lot more, If it's a Vintage, you can get a brand new one for less.....

I called and confirmed that it is indeed an Intermeccanica, buit in 2006 with the "Super 90" engine and has 1400 miles on it.

When I asked, the salesman said: "It is an Inter . .. Inter . . . Intermec . . ." To which I replied "Intermeccanica?" and he said "YES, that's it!"

That Ebay car is NOT an Intermeccanica. It's a Vintage Speedster from Kirk in Hawaiian Gardens, CA. The interior and engine compartment give it away.
As Vince said, the "buy-it-now" price exceeds what you could get a new one for if you ordered it in your own color choice.

As John said, this is a Vintage speedster, top configuration, interior, as well as the VS signature alt B+ wire running through the right firewall..... Overpriced !
I'll sell my triple black VS with only 4200km for $19k :) ~Alan

Plus "SUPER 90" engine is the 356 Porsche designation for their engine - it has a VW engine. I didn't see any details on the engine specs and a 1600cc VW engine puts out a little over half of 90HP. I'm sure he's looking at an emblem stuck to the back. Agree with the VS manf. Remember the old adage "If an auto salesmen's lips are moving - he's lying".

Hypothetically, what if I could buy this car for $22,500? A bad deal? Consider the leather interior, emblems, stereo, etc.

$22,500 would be a good price for this car. A bargain in fact based on current Vintage prices.

I say shame on that salesman for misrepresenting the car but you came to the right place for info.

I paid $24,000 for my Vintage with just 700 miles so this is a better deal. This car is equipped about like mine was back when I got it.

Nice paint too--real nice.

How did the price drop so suddenly from $30k+ to just $22k?


---Jack

I called and offered 20K after it had been listed for about 3 weeks. Check the feedback rating on E-Bay . . .perfect, right? So . . I called. We bartered and arrived at $22785 with the "processing fee". I am flying there to test-drive it, inspect it. Can walk away if I want to . . . Also transporting back to Colorado. All told:

Car 22,785 (cash sale)
Flights and hotel from SW Colorado to St. Louis 750
Transport for the car (enclosed) 1400
TTL including 5 year Collector plates 1250
1 year of comprehensive insurance (Progressive, no milage limit) 500

Total delivered and ready to drive: $26,800

Should I back-out of this deal???

As equipped, I believe this is about a $1000 - $2000 savings from a new one. I AM giving up a warranty, but gaining the ability to buy a car today that might have any bugs worked out of it, test drive it, etc. As for flights, transport, etc. . . all that would have been done if I were to have bought directly from Vintage as well.

If you want a deal, buy the REAL IM that is for sale in Pasadena from Dennis Clark. There is really no comparison between the car you are looking at and the IM that Dennis is selling.

Alan,

Their VS has no Super 90 motor in it, someone is blowing smoke, be cautious.

I know you have the itch to get into a speedster:)

Give Kirk a call at Vintage Speedsters, ask what a similar speedster will cost out the door as well as the currect build time.

I think you might be surprised and a VS comes with a warranty. ~Alan

Not sure if kinks would be worked out in 1400 miles over 3 years or not. You're buying "as is" with no warranty - a $1k saving won't fix much if you aren't doing repairs yourself. I'd like to know exactly what is in the engine - stock 1600 or a 2+L built engine. (VS might be able to tell you). There is easily a $3-4k difference in cost right there. You don't have your location listed - are there none closer? Economy is really bad there are great deals out there for those looking to buy - don't jump on first one - especially if its not from a private owner. That dealer gave you line with it being Intermeccanica and a Super 90 - I wouldn't trust him on anything. Ask him for contact info for previous owner - so you can find out why he sold it might be divorce or too many nagging little problems with it (like overheating).

It is a 1600cc engine. I'm not looking for a BIG engine though.

I have asked the dealer to verify the manufacturer of this car with a photo of the builders plate.

Alan, look, don't let these guys scare you, we will all agree that the Intermeccanica quality is the best, but Vintage makes a fine product and the price that you are getting is in the ballpark. The car looks like it was barely driven, some guys just jump in, without realizing what they are getting themselves into and sell quickly..
these cars are not for everyone...
You can drive that thing for years and lose very little money.

Alan,

I sent you a PM feel free to give me a call....
~Alan

That is not an Intermeccanica ...It may be a VS which is a great car as well. But don't buy it if they claim it's an Intermeccanica because they are lying to you.

get a new VS, warranty and all. car salesmen are on commission and will say ANYTHING to get the sale, after the sale the salesman could care less if you are unhappy, caveat emptor up the kazoo.

Alan,
Call Kirk at Vintage and price out a new one exact to your specs. It's a buyers market right now, even for new ones. You may be pleasantly surprised. It would certainly be worth the 5 minute time investment. I have had my VS for 3 years and haven't had any "kinks to work out" at all, just 4000+ miles of pleasure. And you would get the warranty. P.S., very few owners have remained happy with a 1600 for long. The 1915 is a bargain for a little more money. And don't waste any money on a radio, you'll never use it.

When the bullsheet gets deep, start walking.

Intermechanicca hasn't made pan based speedsters for a long time. Certainly not in 2006. What was it, the late 1980's when IM stopped using pans?

Others here say that's not a super 90 engine. I wouldn't know if you dropped in my foot, but if that is the case, now they have BS'd on two points.

It won't get better.

But it is a pretty little thing, isn't it? Offer them $17,500.

angela

I gotta say it may not be BS as much as ignorance. The last few car salesmen I've talked to didn't know their ass from a hole in the ground. (One was about a new Mistsu Evo, I knew more about the car than he did, and the other was at a pre-owned exotic place. He complimented my karmann ghia)
I would imagine the salesman just doesn't know what it is. That doesn't make it a good deal or a bad deal, but I would be careful nonetheless.

It was actually ignorance -- just talked to the dealer. He had called both Vintage and Inter . . . admitted it is not an Inter. I also personally had Inter and Vintage confirm it.

So . . . looks like the price will drop to $22,000

Fun afternoon!

Alan

Alan - FWIW, if DrClock offers to sell you his black Speedster at the price he mentioned, JUMP ON THAT DEAL!!

DrClock (Alan Merklin) has built nearly two dozen cars (Speedsters) all of which are well-sorted vehicles (all kinks worked out). I think you would be hard-pressed to find anyone on this site that would not vouch for Alan's fabrication skill and INTEGRITY!!

As much as you seem to be jonesing to get a SPeedster, a delay for research will save you thou$and$!!

Good luck with your quest!

"Delay for research" that's some excellent advice.

Thar Intermechannica on the West Coast mentioned earlier is a fantastic buy for a fabulous car.

But you will never go wrong with a Vintage. I am not the original owner of mine but Kirk had treated me beautifully and provided solid info and advice just as I had bought it new from him. He swapped out my in-op tach for no charge and how can you beat that care after the sale---that he really never made to me!

I have never seen so many options for finding a fantastic car at a super bargain price as right now. Do delay and research more and
do not rush---there's just no need to.

Last comment--I don't know that I personally would include so many things in the price such as your trip to St Louis, insurance and so forth. The car is really $22k. I guess everyone has their own feelings about that. I paid $24kfor mine which didn't include $1,000++ in tools, spare parts for road trips, extra this, additional this and that and the gas home from Monroe'LA but the fun I'm having is just completely priceless! And read Theron's post about "are you ready for a spedster" which is at the top of a couple of forum topics--every word is true.

Jezz--the fun you are having.---Good luck and stay tuned to this site for info you can count on.---Jack

Alan - Should you go throught with deal - make sure that you get valid title that you can actually register it with and drive it. Much depends on state you plan to title it in. Some builds are registered as build year/late year and they just won't pass applicable emissions for that year. Some are titled salvage - which may make insuring it difficult. Without a good title you have a classy flower planter. With his story line, I'd make seller provide valid title for your state as condition for being paid (or post bond that you can get registered or $ and costs back).

Alan,
You are in Colorado? Before you buy come visit me and see my Vintage Speedster and I will help educate you before you buy something that is too expensive. I am in Loveland. Drop me an email and come see me anytime.

Happy Trails,
Dusty

Alan,
Looks like a beautiful car! The paint looks like it's a foot deep!
Very nice detail job.
It's not an Intermeccanica, but it's a lot less than an Intermeccanica, even Dennis' '03 IM.
I'm sure you've already read the thread at the top of this forum, written by Paul Harford. And I'm sure you've checked into other makes and you have driven a few of them.
I'm sure you've made a list of what you're looking for and the type of driving you're going to do: weekend-fair-weather or daily-driving-damn-the-elements.
I'm sure your wife/significant other is on board with you as well and shares your dream or, at least, respects it.
Yes? No?
If it's a toy or an impulse buy, go at it. As Vince said, you won't lose much on the deal as long as there's a market(which could be debated).
You can always trade up to an IM (or a Beck, or get in the queue for a SAS)
But, if I was in the market for a used speedster, given what I've learned over the last six years I would try like hell to work out a deal with Mr. Clark on his gorgeous '03 IM.

This has me wondering if it might be one of the stolen cars from VS and it may have a reworked number with a wrecked IM title..

I'd be wanting to know who the previous original owner was and to get some contact info... along with the first bill of sale..

On theses,, that kind of flim flamin can be done..

Be careful.

I'd rather buy one from our club members upgrading to a new one. Than a eBay car..

Here's the deal as it stands now. The price is at $22,000 plus a documetation fee of $285. They came down $500 for the faux pas of not knowing what they are selling. The dealer has a 100% approval rating and seems to have a good reputation on ebay and in the real world. I don't have a lot of fear about scratched-out VINs or bad titles. I live in SW Colorado and have already called the DMV about this . . .seems like it will be easy. In SW Colorado, there is no inspection other than a VIN inspection when you title the car. No emissions test . hell, not even an annual inspection! Once a car is registered, it could literally fall apart on the roads and no one in my state cares . . .its great!

I am near Durango, CO, btw . . .so open top motoring is priceless around here. My drive to work looks like a trip through a national park, and our crime rate is super low. This new car will live in a climate controlled garage most of the time. I am intimately familiar with 1950s sports car technology . . bring on the drafts and rough ride, bring on the loud pipes. I'll probably only keep the radio installed for the remote chance of reselling the car someday.

So . . .if I buy this car, I plan on thrashing around in it for at least an hour test drive. I want to get the motor as hot as I can get it . . .I know to look for oil leaks, all the signs of a bad motor. I'll sample the tailpipe color, maybe ask them to pull a spark plug on #3. I'll check the oil level and color of the oil . . .etc etc. The car will be thorougly inspected. All said and done, I think I will be okay at that price if it checks-out perfectly. I will have saved a couple thousand dollars over what that car would cost from the manufacturer. Like I said . . .the flights, transport, tax . . .all a wash as I would have done that if I was buying a NEW car. I am taking a bit of a risk that it will be junk, but the dealer seems on the up-and-up. Though they did commit the somewhat forgivable sin of not being completely familiar with this crazy kind of car sale.

I have researched this car thoroughly . . . Vintage would be my choice for a zero-mile car anyway. This one has some upagrades that would bring it to about $24.5K new. If I can save a couple thousand and get the same car . . .maybe worth it . . . worst case, I don't think I will be "burned" too badly on this thing. Any additional thougthts about that line of logic?

So . . . off to St. Louis I go tomorrow and fly back Monday night. Camera and cashiers check in hand, as well as some phone numbers of members on this site for guidance during the shake-down drive and inspection . . .thanks to all who have responded.

Cheers Mates!
Alan Lloyd

Good luck, Alan

I just noticed that it looks like that fan shroud is chrome . . .horrors! If I recall, replacing a fan shroud with the motor in the car isn't terribly difficult. Can anyone out there in speedster-land confirm? Alternatively, how about a hell alot of masking and some kind of flat black paint that will adhere to chrome. Any suggestions?

According to the Calif. plate this used to belong to Jay.... Jay who?

Alan,

The chrome looks ok to me eyes. Just keep a coat of wax on it and it should last for years in your dry clmate. Hope you get it and become a regular.


Marty G.

Chrome isn't so bad to keep clean in dry climate - its just that most of the aftermarket shrouds are not nearly as efficient as the stock ones with cooling vanes and flappers that came from the VW factory. Jake did a study awhile back that compared OEM, 911 fans and his DTM. On a stock engine - not driven hard it probably won't be a problem.

Good move going to thoroughly check it out as I wonder how they keep a 100% rating with comments from buyer like this once car arrived (ok its from Elmer Fudd but still):

good communication, the seller are arranging transportation of the car. toroyvind68 ( 3 ) Mar-08-08 00:14

Follow-up by toroyvind68 (May-29-08 05:39):
This car is in so bad condition that it is werry unsafe to drive whit,werry bad

-- (#160212726637)

Alan - I guess it's not too early to offer the 'ol "Welcome to the Madness" cheer. Good luck on your quest and hope you have a safe and productive trip. I can already imagine the SEG on your face as you drive that black beauty through the Rockies!!

Peace - Out!

Alan, I think I can speak for most of us...we probably all have more $ into our cars than they are worth. Some of us up front, some of us over the years. Just have fun with it.

Alan; I did replace the fan housing in my car with the engine in. You have to take the deck lid off (very easy; two bolts) but it can be done. I upgraded to the OEM "doghouse" ('71-up) style and installed all the vanes, thermostat, OEM cylinder tin, etc. It was worth it.

Well, I own it. I flew to StL last night, inspected the car this morning, drove it for a half-hour and paid for it. I crawled all over this car, and there is NO way that it could have been driven more than the stated 1500 miles . . .and I'm guessing never in the rain. There is no way it could have been detailed to appear to be as new as it appeared to be. Examples: 1)Rust was found on only one part of the car. Tiny pin-head sized rust on the muffler. 2)The seat mounting bolts that appear under the pan were shiny and new looking. 3)The underside of the car was spotless and all black. 4) No oil leaks were found. 5) All gaps in body panels / doors, etc. were near perfect. 6) The engine ran strong, and cool. . .No transaxle problems could be detected.

The car was absolutely undeniably spotless otherwise -- even in areas that are hard to keep clean and detail (door jambs, etc.) I totaled all the options . . .Nardi wheel, REAL leather . . .yes, from a cow . . .Black paint, Kenwood stereo, Front discs, coco mats, trunk carpet, accurate Porsche script . . and the total new would have been $25,175. My purchase price: 22,285. With TTL, my travel expenses today, and enclosed transport to Colorado: $26,180. The way I look at it, I got the car I wanted . . . test-driven 1400 miles . . . and paid $1000 for all the misc. expenses, including transport. Assuming it doesn't blow-up on its first outting, I think I did okay.

ALAN YOUR A BRONCO FAN

EXCELLENT, Alan!!!! Welcome aboard! Now join in every group gathering that you can, because that's where much of the fun is.