Need advice

Friends, let me tell you more about wire wheels....

Eighteen!!!!!!

I have a feeling this thread is going to hit page 20, whether we have anything pertinent to say or not!

ALB, I think the pertinence quotient has been low for a while - just how I like 'em! 

Hold on there Albert.  My comments on this thread have been very pertinent.  If you don't believe me go back and reread all the posts to find my very relevant, pertinent and extremely informative comments. 

VERY VERY VERY unusual......   A blast of "relevant" Canadian hot air this time of year....   Could be just what we need to thaw this part of the continent out....  Thanks Ron.....

It might be a good idea to find out why you are getting gas in your oil. Changing your oil every 100 miles at $50 a pop will get expensive quickly. Jus' sayin'.

Has he decided that it is gas rather than just over-filling?

 

If there is gas in the oil, even a little bit, it floats to the top and liberally coats the dipstick as you pull it out so you can REALLY smell it.  I thought up above, that Lane said there was no gas smell........

 

Just debating this, along with the usual, multi-dimensional thread drift we see on here, should certainly get us to 19 pages.

 

No indication of gas at all.  I just wondered about it being a possibility since I discovered that the dipstick indicated I had at least a quart too much.  I knew that I had been running extremely rich due to the carb issue and realized (after some driving) that there could be a connection.  That is the only reason I brought this up.  Given the total lack of gas smell or appearance on the dipstick or in the oil that I drained, I am probably safe.  I'll do an oil change soon just for insurance.

You missed the 19 pages of epic tale, Al?

Lane,

Do you have an O'reilly's Auto Parts store near you? I am able to get the Brad Penn 20w50 from them. $58.00/case. If not in stock,they can order it for you.I'm sure your paying quite a premium buying through Summit Racing! No shipping charges makes quite a difference in what you pay!

That makes me wonder if other local FLAPS might be able to special order it for us for a good price.  I can get it locally from a lubricants supplier (that's all they do, no auto parts), running around $65 per case.  Maybe we should just ask places like Autozone or Carquest if they can get it?

That's a great tip, Al. I'm able to get it from a local hot-rod speed shop. It was $5/qt and went up to $6 last year.

 

Every town of any size has a speed shop. The guys behind the counter are every bit as condescending and territorial as the PCA-gang (but about 'merican iron), but they all have (or can get) Brad Penn oil. They have flat-tappet engines too.

As a matter of fact there is an O'Reilly's nearby.  I'll have to check them out.  Thanks, Al.  Are you And Bobbi coming to Carlisle this year?

Not sure if Bobbi will be with me,but I am planning on attending.

Ok, oil changed.  Supposed to be rainy for several days starting tomorrow so no driving likely.  Oh well.

I have always used Brad Penn oil in my Speedster.

 

After reading this I am thinking about switching to Valvoline VR-1:

 

http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30483 

 

The VR-1 would probably be easier to find too.

Wow, that's a shock!  I have been using Brad Penn because of an article I read from Jake Raby.  Now I'm confused.

There is a 179 page (and counting) thread on theSamba titled Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic

 

Motor oil (and gear lube too, there's a 45 page thread on that as well) is one of those topics that borders on "holy war" status. There's soooo much opinion, conflicting tests, and peeing a circle around your respective tree that it's difficult (impossible) to get to the truth in any of it. Read far enough in any oil forum, and some engineer or another is going to find some fault with the methodology in any test. In the test referenced above, the tester didn't think the ASME test had the oil hot enough, so he heated it to 230*F. A responder didn't think that was hot enough, because at the bearing surface, the oil is hotter still. At some point, small stuff greatly effects the test.

 

There's an entire (large) website devoted to oil called Bob is the Oil Guy (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/). If you ever have an evening you'd like to spend getting even more confused on the topic, take a trip over there.

 

My take? Any oil that starts from good stock (synthetic is always preferable to dino oil, IMHO) and has a decent zinc number, and comes from a place that can afford a robust engineering staff to research it is probably going to be as good as the next similar oil. They might be just fine, but I avoid house-brand oils, since oil seems like a really silly place to economize (why would I care if I saved $10/yr, but shelled my engine in the process?).

 

I really don't like the idea of additives, as it's the oil additive pack working together that is the secret sauce of modern oils. Too much zinc is just going to leave a bunch of sludge inside your engine as it cokes etc. There's a fine line between, "enough" and "too much", and I have no way of knowing what that line is. I don't trust Lucas to have the same engineering horsepower that Valvoline or Exxon/Mobil have (Read the story of how Lucas got started. It seems borderline apocryphal).

 

The VR1 looks good in most tests, and I can get it in both 10W30 and 20W50 from Autozone. I've used Brad Penn for years, but I'm not married to the formula. I'd try the VR1 if I didn't have good access to Brad Penn.

 

I have been using Castrol or Valvoline oil for the last five years or so.

 

But, I go to the small special oil area at Autozone, generic auto stores etc.....

 

I buy the V-twin oil for Harleys, almost always in 20w50. Sometimes it is on sale and I end up cleaning them out of stock.

 

It has what we need.

I am a firm believer in research, and always advocate for folks to gather info from several sources.  However, there does seem to be a limit for the lay person in some areas, notably automotive lubrication.

 

Tribologists, the engineers who study friction, lubrication et al for a living, have little consensus on testing methodology or interpretation of results that is helpful for the average gearhead.  The skeptic in me believes that is not accidental.  Do oil companies publish white papers/documents that are beneficial to their product and leave the not-so-flattering results buried on the hard drive, never to see publication?  Does the lubrication industry pressure governmental testing agencies to stay out of the fight, so that their product doesn't receive an unbiased (and possibly unflattering) comparison?  Remember Mark Twain's comments about statistics?

 

I have read reams of data on oil research, with lots of time spent on "bob'stheoilguy" and other sites, and I'm not sure my knowledge has increased.  Admittedly, I am not a scientist, but I understand comparative data.  

 

I eventually decided to fall back on old-fashioned advice I heard decades ago, that seems as topical now as it was then: "choose a quality oil, and change it at recommended intervals".  With modern engines, oils, and filters, those "recommended intervals" have tripled since many of us first started driving.

 

Some general principles do apply, as many of us know.  A/c engines, especially high HP, need zinc additives in the oil, dino oil is best for break-in, and synthetic oil works well for an engine that is broken in.  However, even in those accepted categories, there is room for disagreement.

 

If you can buy in quantity when a quality oil goes on sale, you would seem to have the best of both worlds, in terms of quality and value.

Well said!

How many oil related failures are there in our world?   Perhaps this should be pretty low on the worry list?   Or is my head under a rock?   In fifty years of driving I've always changed oil at 3000 miles and used a name brand often synthetic and I've very had a hint of a problem.   Rust has killed my cars.  That seems to have gotten better with time as well?   I understand this is just for a fun discussion but I certainly wouldn't get too excited especially when we know even the most expert don't even come close a consensus

Oil is Oil...the big, all media advertising, development concerns all tout 'their' oil as 'the best' on the market...thus everyone buys that product. Yes there is some oil that is definitely better than others according to use data.

People in the hi-po V-8 area often proclaim to use dino oil for break-in then go to synthetic for use. I've never done that and I've built some hi-po engines or had them built...the '48 Anglia I built a few years ago had a Ford 351 W built to the max...dynoed at 575hp....nasty engine...it'd pull the front end off the ground at about 2500rpm on a hard launch...I ran 20-50w Castrol Racing oil in it and never had a problem. Same with my '55 Chevy with a built 383 stroker, it dynoed at 425hp...have never had an issue with it and it now has about 16K on it...again Castrol oil. I change oil on all my cars about every 3-5K, including the daily drivers...Oil is Oil...

 

 

Oil is oil. Just my humble opinion.

 

I've always used whatever (20-50) was on sale at Pep Boys or Auto Zone. 1835cc mild performer that logged 100,000 miles (through city traffic, desert heat, mountain altitudes, 3-hour stretches at hwy speeds of 70-80mph) without an oil related failure (aside from a burst oil cooler return line. Crappy oil line from China, never again).

 

In fact, I've never used anything but Pep Boys sale-priced oil in any of my VW, Porsches, Mercedes, BMWs, Range Rovers when done on my own. Again, never an oil related failure. 

 

I guess I saved enough that I could have bought a $300 shifter. 

Jim;

 

LMAO

The Vintage Speed, speedster shifter is approx. $200.00 

 

 Cheers

You still can buy that shifter, Jim, and do a video of it. Make it funny. We'll thank you for it.

 

I'm not an oil industry engineer, and I don't play one on TV.

 

So, I have no idea if these new oil 'tests' are scientifically valid and relevant to the problem of engine wear or are just so much gobbledygook. I do know that lab tests can be designed to support one theory or another, or sell one product or another. And I know the language of snake oil salesmen when I hear it, and there's more than a little of that in that post on the new oil test.

 

To me, the only experts worth listening to are the mechanics who spend their days rebuilding other people's failed engines. Who would know better than those guys what oil works and what doesn't? And if we're talking about engines that have been around for sixty years, I'd look for the mechanic with the grayest hair and listen to what he says.

 

I've found such a mechanic, and he's transformed my car from one that hardly ran at all into one that runs pretty well.

 

He says use the green stuff, so that's what I do.

 

So, how do you explain MusbJim's great luck with engine longevity using whatever's on sale? Maybe it's not just luck. Maybe engine life is about more than just what oil you use. Maybe it's got something to do with how you use an engine.

 

That old man Jimbo - he must know somethin', but he don't say nothin'.

 

He just keeps rollin' along.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In my opinion, the only good reason for this is that dino oil is cheaper, thus saving some coin on those first quick oil changes. If break-in is the concern, use an actual break-in oil that's chemically designed for it, not a regular motor oil.

My two engine builders, one Ford man and the other A GM man, with over 70yrs combined knowledge would tend to disagree. These two guys dyno test/break-in every engine they build with break-in oil. They then drain the break-in oil, change the filter and fill with dino oil, then deliver it to the customer. The customer is then told to put about 300-500 miles on the engine, then change oil...both have recommended to me to use a sythi-blend but I have not done so and the engines are just as strong as the day they were delivered. My Cobra has around 28,000 miles on the 347 stroker W/Weber 48 IDA induction...some of the miles are under racing conditions.

In my opinion a lot of engine/oil related problems are due to the quality of the build and the owners maintenance of said engine. Having a set routine maintenance on your engine as well as the whole car goes a long way in preserving the mechanics of the car...any car 

Gary,

I have heard similiar ideas to "break in" a new/rebuilt engine. I have friends that did not use break in oil and spun the bearings. Also synthetic was too slippery to seat the rings to the cylinder walls for a new/rebuilt engine. For me, I would do what you referred to: break in oil > dino oil > semi-synthetic oil > synthetic oil.

If only going dino oil, just change often and should have no problems.  There is not that much oil in the engines so no real excuse as it is too much $$$.

 

I sure am not an oil expert and after reading tons of info on Bob the oil guy, I think I know less.  I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express tho....  

 

Gary

 

 

My engine builder wants me to use non-synthetic oil for the first 2000 km and that's what I plan on doing.

I bought a 24 pack of Swepco 10/30 to get me through the first few years.

Now all I need is my car back.

OK, I see where this is going . . .  We need to get to 20+ pages, and what better way than to start a pissing contest about engine oil.  That will do it for sure.

 

I use Brad-Penn, obtained from a hot-rod shop in B'more.  He was very cool about the whole thing, no uppity 'tude about his iron over mine.  Said he'd order up an extra case or two whenever I needed. I did ask him why he used B-P, and he said because it's green.  Said he could see it better when it leaked: easier to find out where and why.  That's what he said . . .

What about MMO ?   :-)

I am going to piss off the Pope..... Unless you have the need for a high heat producing big cc motor....a quality straight 30 weight that still has some zinc in it and drive .  

Even when single weight was all you could get, you were still supposed to change to an appropriate weight based on the prevalent outside temperature. Even as far back as 1956, VW manuals mention multi-grade oil was fine for year-round use.

Hoooooooo boy....

 

It's ALIIIIIIIVE!!!!!!!!! 

.....and so it goes:~)

FRANKENTHREAD !!!!!

The Drivers Manual for my old 356s said 30 wt single viscosity in the summer, 20 wt in the winter.  and that is what I did.  I never could figure out why multi-visc was not recommended and nobody I knew at the time did anything other than the prescribed single wt.