Where they at fellas? By the way, I was praying the car was ready for the 3rd. Steve Lawing assured it would be, but I had an uneasy feeling. Crap it.
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Where they at fellas? By the way, I was praying the car was ready for the 3rd. Steve Lawing assured it would be, but I had an uneasy feeling. Crap it.
I'm hoping this is an indication of how quickly mine finishes up??? Of course he hasn't officially left town yet??
It seems very quite?
Now I'm getting worried. Or is no news good news? jkl
What the heck?! 12:24 pm in Tennessee and nothing. Nothing! Come on SAW, a lot of speedster people are watching!!! Going to let us down?
Just talked to Lisa. Stuart has been out driving the car and is very impressed with the power. There seems to be a small glitch with the speedometer, but he should be shoving off in about an hour or two. More later when I know more.
Hoss
Hoss
As a guy who just had a baby less than a month ago (well ok, technically my wife had the baby but hey - I was there!), I have to say, it's funny to watch the SOC crew get this excited about a new arrival. :)
And yes, I can't wait for more info and photos too. Hehe.
-Jeff
And yes, I can't wait for more info and photos too. Hehe.
-Jeff
Stuart just called me, and he drove the car from Knoxville to Nashville last night. He loves the car. He still has some things that need to be sorted out, but they sound like relatively small items and I'm sure he can take care of them at home.
Here's the scoop. The speedo was apparently fixed and Stu headed out about 9:00 PM last night. There was an idle glitch, which was caused by the computer which has to relearn after it has been powered down/disconnected. This takes some drive time and perhaps up to 30 start cycles.
Unfortunately, it was reported to me that there was also a problem with the shifter, causing the the car to jump out of 5th gear. I suspect this is an adjustment, but I think Stuart is out of time and had to make arrangements to fly to Sun Valley, Idaho to rendevous with his wife.
IMHO, the deadline resulted in not enough test drive time. My car had 852 miles on it when it was delivered. One might normally think that this would seem excessive, but considering that mine was the first example to be delivered into a customer's hands, I was very grateful; I have not had any of the above-mentioned problems.
While my car has evolved since it was first delivered, this process sometimes involving protracted waits for my baby to be returned, I suggest that both Steve's current and future customers will appreciate this continuing attention to the design details. It has been frustrating at times, but it has also been an exciting journey.
Would I do this again? Hmmmmmm. I would just as soon let somebody else take a turn at being the guinea pig. The product, however, in its current and future states, is a good one and that's the bottom line for me. I got what I paid for and I love the car.
Hoss
Unfortunately, it was reported to me that there was also a problem with the shifter, causing the the car to jump out of 5th gear. I suspect this is an adjustment, but I think Stuart is out of time and had to make arrangements to fly to Sun Valley, Idaho to rendevous with his wife.
IMHO, the deadline resulted in not enough test drive time. My car had 852 miles on it when it was delivered. One might normally think that this would seem excessive, but considering that mine was the first example to be delivered into a customer's hands, I was very grateful; I have not had any of the above-mentioned problems.
While my car has evolved since it was first delivered, this process sometimes involving protracted waits for my baby to be returned, I suggest that both Steve's current and future customers will appreciate this continuing attention to the design details. It has been frustrating at times, but it has also been an exciting journey.
Would I do this again? Hmmmmmm. I would just as soon let somebody else take a turn at being the guinea pig. The product, however, in its current and future states, is a good one and that's the bottom line for me. I got what I paid for and I love the car.
Hoss
The idle thing will take care of itself, see the knowledge section on computer relearn after disconnecting the battery
Thanks , I think, for the update Hoss. One of the IM's, maybe Jim Ward's, had 400 miles at delivery. Seems like this must be a predelivery program Lawing must institute. On my VS the carb linkage fell off one carb (thank goodness not at high speed) and I found the engine temp guage not hooked up--all on the first day. On the 300 mile valve set they were so far off don't think anyone had ever checked them. Fellows picking up a new car and planing a same day trip across the county are very brave souls. jkl
OK, I'm not sure if I won my bet or not? Technically, I bet when he would leave or not leave on time, and since he did leave I lost, but the intention of the bet was different....LOL I'm glad nobody took the bet or we would have a real problem figuring this one out?
Its starting to feel like a bad episode of PINKS
Its starting to feel like a bad episode of PINKS
Steve, Yeah he left, but without the car. I agree. Who can figure out that bet. I was promised by Steve Lawing at SAW that if I came on the 30th, I could test-drive the car. Trip was planed for weeks. After driving three hours to get there, Stuart's car was not ready for me to drive. i was very upset, but so was my pregnant wife. I loved the looks of Stuart's car, but not the broken promise by SAW. I really feel for Stuart. He was so excited and looking forward to his drive back. After my experience, I decided to buy another brand. Just the truth, guys.
"You never get a second chance to make a first impression."
On the one hand, I like things on time too. On the other hand, these are hand built cars, and these are some of the single digit build number cars. I don't think it's unreasonable to allow a window in which to make final tweaks, and also to test drive your new ride around the local area for a few days. It's not that different from many new large scale made cars really.
I'll happily wait to here how the "finished" product looks.
-Jeff
I'll happily wait to here how the "finished" product looks.
-Jeff
When someone promises a deadline, and the buyer flies in from New York City like Stuart or drives in like me, I think that is unreasonable. At least call the customer and tell them, so it's not a wasted trip. Shame on SAW
I agree, expectation management includes letting someone know when there is a delay. I think the delays are not necessarily reflective of anything other than the reality of putting the finishing touches on the product and are not a surprise given the fact these are very early production models.
Communication though, goes a long way. :) In that vein, I think a significant update of photos on the SAW website, including details of these recent builds, would be a nice touch. But its hard to update sites and build cars, especially on time, all at once. :)
-Jeff
Communication though, goes a long way. :) In that vein, I think a significant update of photos on the SAW website, including details of these recent builds, would be a nice touch. But its hard to update sites and build cars, especially on time, all at once. :)
-Jeff
Updating the site tends to make for a lot more phone inquiries and initial emails. I'm sure SAW will update the site, but not until things are moving at a faster pace and with more ease on the builds. Steve just doesn't have a lot of extra time right now and increasing the volume of calls and emails is not a good idea at this point. Every business needs to control its growth and not become overwhelmed, and while we would love to see a daily picture of progress, it generates so many calls it becomes impossible to actually work on the cars. Its a balancing act. They will hopefully, get things moving smoother and able to balance everything out in the future?
As more builders toy with water cooler options, and the market matures to more modern parts under the bodies, I'm curious to see if someone like SAW or the Beck Subaru work will get licensed to other builders so they can also do Subaru or other water powered cars. Given all the engineering work SAW has done, it seems like licensing the work makes a lot of sense, and could accelerate a whole new generation of water powered cars with modern gear...
I agree on not updating the site to keep traffic down. Frustrating as it is, it certainly is one way to manage traffic. I'm guilty of that myself with our own website and I'm in the internet business...
-Jeff
I agree on not updating the site to keep traffic down. Frustrating as it is, it certainly is one way to manage traffic. I'm guilty of that myself with our own website and I'm in the internet business...
-Jeff
Jeff et al.,
I think you will see the industry continue to grow. I've been around it all of my life, and the stigma has changed from the bad "kit car" image. I hear more and more that our cars are considered a viable alternative to the original. I even have several owners that own trailer queen originals and use our car to DRIVE. My best salesman ever was a guy at the Vintage Gran Prix in PA. He had a BEAUTIFULLY restored carrera (claimed over $150K in restoration). He spent all weekend pointing at my speedster yeling "this is the way to go! You can DRIVE this one!) It was a riot.
We developed the watercooled version of the spyder several years ago ('01-02). The work was done by a friend of ours in Brazil and a German racer friend of his (sorry, his name eludes my AM memory). Originally designed around the AlfaSUD engine, at the time many said "why". Just a few years later, it seems to be the trend. I was SHOCKED with Chuck's reaction when we brought it to Atlanta. He drove it for 15-20 minutes, got out and said "yea, this will work". Which coming from Chuck (for those of you who don't know about him) is the equivelant of most people saying "this is the best thing since sliced bread!!" Especially as an initial reaction from him. A few months later he was talking about how he thought it was the "wave of the future" for the spyder.
RE: websites. I can also agree. I run our site (first one ever) and I am always updating it (it is currently 1/2 way between updates) It takes a lot of time! And as soon as you post something new the phone DOES start ringing about it. This is why you will not find anything on my site about the roll up windows, Subaru (maybe a blurb), hardtop, etc... When I really wanted to do the coupe I had TONS of calls and emails, just from a small posting here! Imagine what comes from a website with global advertising...
BTW I need to turn over my current website to someone with more talent/time. I also have two others that need designed. I have spoken with a few people, but for them it would be a side job, and they seem to be too busy at the moment. Any suggestions would be appreciated. I have all of the photos/details, and need some flash work done. My skills are seriously lacking in this dept.
I think you will see the industry continue to grow. I've been around it all of my life, and the stigma has changed from the bad "kit car" image. I hear more and more that our cars are considered a viable alternative to the original. I even have several owners that own trailer queen originals and use our car to DRIVE. My best salesman ever was a guy at the Vintage Gran Prix in PA. He had a BEAUTIFULLY restored carrera (claimed over $150K in restoration). He spent all weekend pointing at my speedster yeling "this is the way to go! You can DRIVE this one!) It was a riot.
We developed the watercooled version of the spyder several years ago ('01-02). The work was done by a friend of ours in Brazil and a German racer friend of his (sorry, his name eludes my AM memory). Originally designed around the AlfaSUD engine, at the time many said "why". Just a few years later, it seems to be the trend. I was SHOCKED with Chuck's reaction when we brought it to Atlanta. He drove it for 15-20 minutes, got out and said "yea, this will work". Which coming from Chuck (for those of you who don't know about him) is the equivelant of most people saying "this is the best thing since sliced bread!!" Especially as an initial reaction from him. A few months later he was talking about how he thought it was the "wave of the future" for the spyder.
RE: websites. I can also agree. I run our site (first one ever) and I am always updating it (it is currently 1/2 way between updates) It takes a lot of time! And as soon as you post something new the phone DOES start ringing about it. This is why you will not find anything on my site about the roll up windows, Subaru (maybe a blurb), hardtop, etc... When I really wanted to do the coupe I had TONS of calls and emails, just from a small posting here! Imagine what comes from a website with global advertising...
BTW I need to turn over my current website to someone with more talent/time. I also have two others that need designed. I have spoken with a few people, but for them it would be a side job, and they seem to be too busy at the moment. Any suggestions would be appreciated. I have all of the photos/details, and need some flash work done. My skills are seriously lacking in this dept.
Hoss posted a picture of Stuarts speedster, he will have to post it in this thread or you will need to go to his area to take a look.
The first thing I thought was, HEY its like a resurection of the prototype car!!!!!! Except with some really cool dual tip exhaust on it. I really like the dual tip look for some reason?
In fact this will be my first car with dual tips since I was just a kid? I know what your thinking, he still acts like a kid?
The first thing I thought was, HEY its like a resurection of the prototype car!!!!!! Except with some really cool dual tip exhaust on it. I really like the dual tip look for some reason?
In fact this will be my first car with dual tips since I was just a kid? I know what your thinking, he still acts like a kid?
Holy smokes...............Everyone has an opinion but.........
John has it pretty solid with his post.
I did post this morning with a complete explaination of events.
I do not blame Steve and SAW for anything.
I am totally wowed by the car in both appearance and in performance.
The car is fast, and I mean very fast!!! Has no problem getting up to 80 in a heart beat. Step on the gas in 5th gear and you still get snap. It handles like a dream, muc better than expectd.
I drove about 430 miles to N of Nashville and back. there are three issues. 1) THE SPEEDO needs was complex with the newer engine 2)THE RELAY There was a defective relay which caused the car to die when all electrics were on with the fan at full blast. This almost made me crap my pants at 70 miles an hour in pitch dark Jeez you got no idea. everything came back on in like 3 seconds the first time and 5 seconds the second time. 3) 5TH GEAR, Fifth gear disengaged and there is hopefully an adjustment which needs to be made.
Before everyone jumps to conclusions, makes indictments of SAW and Steve you should know the following;
1) the car fell behind schedule cause of the painter and serious wet humid weather. 2) Steve was a little behind and told me prior to flying down. He suggested I come down a day or two later so he could test drive the car more. 3) HE HAS BEEN very RESPONSIVE FOLLOWING UP ON THESE ISSUES. The relay is already fixed. the speedo he is doing and will have anew one Monday or Tuesday the latest. And Tom his transmission guy is back from vacation MOnday and we will sort that out. IN the interim Steve has been on the blower with Subaru re the issue.
Now the bad news....... I paid Steve an extra $1,000 to work exclusively on my car and not OBY's (JUST KIDDING!!!!!!)
Lisa and Steve are already hooking up the shipping.
Now here is the motto(s) to the story.
- apply pressure but let the process take it's natural course
- Listen to the builder's common sense. Steve at SAW did not want me to do what I did. He has been straight forward and honest with me all the way. I would like him to work faster but this is real life not the guy with the glasses (you guys know who I mean).
- Make sure you go to the builder. Stay local and test drive the BJesus out of the car. I suggest at least 400 miles at varying speeds and conditions.
- Don't set unrealistic objectives for either yourseld or the builder since as I think it was Jeff who said this, these are ground up builds and need to be vetted.
Conclusion:
I am very very VERY happy with the car. It is a beast!!!
Things turned out for the best as these issues were discovered and are being fixed at the builder and not in Sun Valley by stupid me.
As it turned out the weather turned on me big time so I would havebeen driving through heavey rains IN A SPEEDSTER!!! FOR MANY MILES!!! So in the end shipping ain't so bad.
Steve and Lisa are good people with a good product.
more to come but I expect to have my car in days not weeks.
That is the whole truth and nuttin but the truth so help me God.
PS
The worst thing that happened however which is totally Karma was when driving in to Sun Valley coming at me on the other side ofthe road was a red speedster which has moved into town ahead of mine Can you believe it. Insult to injury.
John has it pretty solid with his post.
I did post this morning with a complete explaination of events.
I do not blame Steve and SAW for anything.
I am totally wowed by the car in both appearance and in performance.
The car is fast, and I mean very fast!!! Has no problem getting up to 80 in a heart beat. Step on the gas in 5th gear and you still get snap. It handles like a dream, muc better than expectd.
I drove about 430 miles to N of Nashville and back. there are three issues. 1) THE SPEEDO needs was complex with the newer engine 2)THE RELAY There was a defective relay which caused the car to die when all electrics were on with the fan at full blast. This almost made me crap my pants at 70 miles an hour in pitch dark Jeez you got no idea. everything came back on in like 3 seconds the first time and 5 seconds the second time. 3) 5TH GEAR, Fifth gear disengaged and there is hopefully an adjustment which needs to be made.
Before everyone jumps to conclusions, makes indictments of SAW and Steve you should know the following;
1) the car fell behind schedule cause of the painter and serious wet humid weather. 2) Steve was a little behind and told me prior to flying down. He suggested I come down a day or two later so he could test drive the car more. 3) HE HAS BEEN very RESPONSIVE FOLLOWING UP ON THESE ISSUES. The relay is already fixed. the speedo he is doing and will have anew one Monday or Tuesday the latest. And Tom his transmission guy is back from vacation MOnday and we will sort that out. IN the interim Steve has been on the blower with Subaru re the issue.
Now the bad news....... I paid Steve an extra $1,000 to work exclusively on my car and not OBY's (JUST KIDDING!!!!!!)
Lisa and Steve are already hooking up the shipping.
Now here is the motto(s) to the story.
- apply pressure but let the process take it's natural course
- Listen to the builder's common sense. Steve at SAW did not want me to do what I did. He has been straight forward and honest with me all the way. I would like him to work faster but this is real life not the guy with the glasses (you guys know who I mean).
- Make sure you go to the builder. Stay local and test drive the BJesus out of the car. I suggest at least 400 miles at varying speeds and conditions.
- Don't set unrealistic objectives for either yourseld or the builder since as I think it was Jeff who said this, these are ground up builds and need to be vetted.
Conclusion:
I am very very VERY happy with the car. It is a beast!!!
Things turned out for the best as these issues were discovered and are being fixed at the builder and not in Sun Valley by stupid me.
As it turned out the weather turned on me big time so I would havebeen driving through heavey rains IN A SPEEDSTER!!! FOR MANY MILES!!! So in the end shipping ain't so bad.
Steve and Lisa are good people with a good product.
more to come but I expect to have my car in days not weeks.
That is the whole truth and nuttin but the truth so help me God.
PS
The worst thing that happened however which is totally Karma was when driving in to Sun Valley coming at me on the other side ofthe road was a red speedster which has moved into town ahead of mine Can you believe it. Insult to injury.
Stuart, I don't think they were looking to hang anybody, just normal wondering what was going on and frustrations resulting for things not going perfectly. Of course, how often do things go perfectly? I told them if they were short on any parts to just take them off of your car...LOL.
I'm sure it won't take long even worse case scenerio with the transmission, and your right it all turned out to be for the best, as eventually you would need the 5th gear problem solved anyway and the car should have less break in problems now that you have given it such a good drive around to catch anything that might be needing looked at?
I guess I missed something? What post are you talking about from this morning?
I'm sure it won't take long even worse case scenerio with the transmission, and your right it all turned out to be for the best, as eventually you would need the 5th gear problem solved anyway and the car should have less break in problems now that you have given it such a good drive around to catch anything that might be needing looked at?
I guess I missed something? What post are you talking about from this morning?
I just serched for it and can't find it which pisses me off since it was a master piece with humor etc and gave a blow by blow.
It probably took so long that it didn't post??????
Sorry
It probably took so long that it didn't post??????
Sorry
All I can say is I'm glad I didn't get that car - Shawn you made the right decision
Steve et al
I re-read the postings.
Without being in possessin of the entire fact pattern from me or from Steve I think in fairness the chain is a bit harsh. It is only to easy to jump to conclusions which in turn can become fact when IN FACT those conclusions are not based upon pattern which took place. I can only speak to my experinces and not to Shawns which I can understand. I truly appreciate everyones support and condolences. While I do have some frustrations about the build time table etc I still stand by my first hand evaluation of events including some of my frustrations. In my case the rain and humidity palyed a role in painting. things could have been more focused and moved a bit faster in my opinion but that is only my opinion and I am only starting to understand the dominos of putting one of these cars togeather which I am certain Mr. Hines having been around this business will atest to.
I wish Steve was faster and I have been frustrated at points but I also wish I was 6' and 200 pounds. I got the 6 foot part covered.........not the 200 pounds. In the end, the most important thing to me is I get excellent product at a fair price.
I think based upon my experince (which has not been without frustrations) I have a very fast car, that handles well and looks very good. The car has exceeded my expectations. to be truthful while there are some areas that erk me I have had worse experinces a new car dealerships like Mercedes with my CL 500. The guy with the glasses I was thinking about was Boyd Coddington. Ever seen anything on his show go without a skip and speed bump. By the way it must be the network that keeps his garage/shop looking like a surgery cause I have never seen anywhere like it. A question for you all. Has anyopne ever seen a garage/shop that produces cars with a clean shinny floor like on TV or am I just off the wall here?
I re-read the postings.
Without being in possessin of the entire fact pattern from me or from Steve I think in fairness the chain is a bit harsh. It is only to easy to jump to conclusions which in turn can become fact when IN FACT those conclusions are not based upon pattern which took place. I can only speak to my experinces and not to Shawns which I can understand. I truly appreciate everyones support and condolences. While I do have some frustrations about the build time table etc I still stand by my first hand evaluation of events including some of my frustrations. In my case the rain and humidity palyed a role in painting. things could have been more focused and moved a bit faster in my opinion but that is only my opinion and I am only starting to understand the dominos of putting one of these cars togeather which I am certain Mr. Hines having been around this business will atest to.
I wish Steve was faster and I have been frustrated at points but I also wish I was 6' and 200 pounds. I got the 6 foot part covered.........not the 200 pounds. In the end, the most important thing to me is I get excellent product at a fair price.
I think based upon my experince (which has not been without frustrations) I have a very fast car, that handles well and looks very good. The car has exceeded my expectations. to be truthful while there are some areas that erk me I have had worse experinces a new car dealerships like Mercedes with my CL 500. The guy with the glasses I was thinking about was Boyd Coddington. Ever seen anything on his show go without a skip and speed bump. By the way it must be the network that keeps his garage/shop looking like a surgery cause I have never seen anywhere like it. A question for you all. Has anyopne ever seen a garage/shop that produces cars with a clean shinny floor like on TV or am I just off the wall here?
Luigi:
What car are you buying Luigi or are you out of the speedster market?
I hate to say this but I am happy you didn't get it as well. I don't mean disrespect but this will be car which I expect to have many miles and hours of driving pleasure. Itis a beast!
John Legate...... You are so right. I was not brave but stupid. What a Newbie I was/am!!!! Building these cars is not a perfect science. it ain't a new car dealership with an assembly line. I hold to the stay local on pick up and vett the car!!!! I cannnot speak to your experince Luigi as only you can. My experince with Steve was not as same as yours which may be understandable since circumstances did not permit you to achieve satisfaction. I am sorry you feel so bitter
I can tell you however, the car exceeded my expectations both in performance and looks. Johns car I have already commented on. Pictures do not do it justice.
I guess at the end of the day buying a "kit car" has it's own frustrations for each individual in very individual ways depending upon the circumstances.
Just for the heck of it has anyone picked up a car without issues of any sort either delays or mechanical issues. If so lets here it if you have or if you haven't.
What car are you buying Luigi or are you out of the speedster market?
I hate to say this but I am happy you didn't get it as well. I don't mean disrespect but this will be car which I expect to have many miles and hours of driving pleasure. Itis a beast!
John Legate...... You are so right. I was not brave but stupid. What a Newbie I was/am!!!! Building these cars is not a perfect science. it ain't a new car dealership with an assembly line. I hold to the stay local on pick up and vett the car!!!! I cannnot speak to your experince Luigi as only you can. My experince with Steve was not as same as yours which may be understandable since circumstances did not permit you to achieve satisfaction. I am sorry you feel so bitter
I can tell you however, the car exceeded my expectations both in performance and looks. Johns car I have already commented on. Pictures do not do it justice.
I guess at the end of the day buying a "kit car" has it's own frustrations for each individual in very individual ways depending upon the circumstances.
Just for the heck of it has anyone picked up a car without issues of any sort either delays or mechanical issues. If so lets here it if you have or if you haven't.
Oh god, let me tell you my last new car was a mazda protege'. 2003 it was brand new and every 500 miles or so it would make a bang sound and the whole car would jerk. Oh this drove me nuts, I even tried to turn the car back in because they couldn't find any codes and couldn't figure out what was wrong with it. I don't really mind problems, but when no one can seem to fix them I usually get rid of the problem rather then continue to chase it.
Well they wanted to nail me so bad on the trade in that I just kept it and did a lot of documentation on the problem so that if when it was out of warranty they would still have to fix it because it was a known problem before the warranty ran out. It also had a windshield crack that was NOT from road debris even though they tried to say it was, I got 3 glass companies to all say it was a burr or something in the channel that caused it to crack as it was obvious it started from the channel the windshield sits in.
The sad thing is I did my maintenanc by the dealership and by the book so they couldn't try to weasle out later on some technicality. At 30,000 miles the spark plugs were scheduled to be replaced. Now some things I consider to be hogwash and changing out perfectly good platinum plugs is one of them, but I did it just for the reasons above. You guessed it the problem went away and never returned. 30,000 miles and I was just waiting for the axle or the trans to quit, but in the end it was just a bad spark plug. Should they have figured it out? Probably, but we have all been there.
Stuart, yes there is a time limit and a total space limit on each post so if you want to do a long post type it up and cut and paste it in sections. After 20 minutes, it will let you keep typing but it won't register and after so many words it will reject it. You are such a newbie....LOL.
Well they wanted to nail me so bad on the trade in that I just kept it and did a lot of documentation on the problem so that if when it was out of warranty they would still have to fix it because it was a known problem before the warranty ran out. It also had a windshield crack that was NOT from road debris even though they tried to say it was, I got 3 glass companies to all say it was a burr or something in the channel that caused it to crack as it was obvious it started from the channel the windshield sits in.
The sad thing is I did my maintenanc by the dealership and by the book so they couldn't try to weasle out later on some technicality. At 30,000 miles the spark plugs were scheduled to be replaced. Now some things I consider to be hogwash and changing out perfectly good platinum plugs is one of them, but I did it just for the reasons above. You guessed it the problem went away and never returned. 30,000 miles and I was just waiting for the axle or the trans to quit, but in the end it was just a bad spark plug. Should they have figured it out? Probably, but we have all been there.
Stuart, yes there is a time limit and a total space limit on each post so if you want to do a long post type it up and cut and paste it in sections. After 20 minutes, it will let you keep typing but it won't register and after so many words it will reject it. You are such a newbie....LOL.
Stuart, I feel horrible for what happened to you. Not only you, but we were all excited and counted on the 3rd to be the "go" day. You're going to love your car. My problem is with what happened on my trip there. John Hallstrand is a FANTASTIC person and I enjoyed meeting him. Super fella! In spite of John's warm greetings, SAW let me down. SAW lost me as a customer because of my trip there, and their broken promises. A little better customer service would have went a long way with me. That being said, don't mind what the rest of us say. Sometimes we yack too much. You're going to have a great Speedster. I was very disappointed, but I wish you and Steve O'Brien all the best. You guys have actually been fantastic to chat with. I greatly appreciate all of your Speedster advice. My Vintage should arrive within a week. I will post photos.
Shawn
Thanks for that. Good luck on the VS. Can't wait to see pictures and wish you best of luck with it.
All the best
Stu
Thanks for that. Good luck on the VS. Can't wait to see pictures and wish you best of luck with it.
All the best
Stu
Here it is. I wish that I had come over on the 4th to see it and get a picture of the two cars together. I'm sure the camera doesn't do justice to this beauty.
Hoss
Hoss
Just picking up on Carey and Shawn's comments. I think Carey has pointed out something really interesting. As the 356 replica market has matured over the last few years, it has gained more and more respect as a viable alternative to mainstream cars instead of being a fringe kit-car kind of thing. As that has happened, more mainstream buyers who may have never considered what were essentially "hobby cars" before, are now prepared to buy a replica. That has brought more mainstream expectations and demands to the table, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the work require to put the cars together or the size and scale of the shops doing the work, has changed. So I think there is a bit of an expectation gap between what is available in the market and what a new breed of buyer is looking for.
I'm very schedule driven person, like I think Shawn is, and it would have really upset me to make those plans and not be able to drive the car. However, the logical side of my brain also knows that we're dealing with hand built cars and I know that the last 5% of any project, especially one of this magnitude, is the trickiest. That's a tough balance, and what it may speak to is the need to have a dedicated demonstrator on hand all the time (and perhaps SAW does?).
It all kind of brings me back to one of my earlier comments. If there is a broad and skilled assembly market out there, and SAW has the engineering chops to bring an entirely new chasis and drivetrain combo to market, licensing these developments to the assembly shops may be a way to earn back some of the R&D dollars while also feeding the expanding interest in the product. Of course this suggest is rife with issues, not the least of which is how do you successfully license that work to an industry that makes its living replicating others engineering. :) I just don't know the answer to that one.
In any event, just wanted to build on what Carey said and say that it seems like the growing interest in replica cars from more "mainstream" buyers is creating an expectation gap but I think everyone is benefiting from the overall advances in how the cars are built and sold...
-Jeff
I'm very schedule driven person, like I think Shawn is, and it would have really upset me to make those plans and not be able to drive the car. However, the logical side of my brain also knows that we're dealing with hand built cars and I know that the last 5% of any project, especially one of this magnitude, is the trickiest. That's a tough balance, and what it may speak to is the need to have a dedicated demonstrator on hand all the time (and perhaps SAW does?).
It all kind of brings me back to one of my earlier comments. If there is a broad and skilled assembly market out there, and SAW has the engineering chops to bring an entirely new chasis and drivetrain combo to market, licensing these developments to the assembly shops may be a way to earn back some of the R&D dollars while also feeding the expanding interest in the product. Of course this suggest is rife with issues, not the least of which is how do you successfully license that work to an industry that makes its living replicating others engineering. :) I just don't know the answer to that one.
In any event, just wanted to build on what Carey said and say that it seems like the growing interest in replica cars from more "mainstream" buyers is creating an expectation gap but I think everyone is benefiting from the overall advances in how the cars are built and sold...
-Jeff
Hoss it is there now It would be great if you could do that cause I would love to have pictures of them side by side at an angle from the front to show off the front of your car as well.
Also you should take it for a drive. It is a trip. I would be interested to hear your thoughts in terms of comparison.
Jeff: I agree with what you said. Being a Newbie and pretty head strong I made some mistakes. The biggest mistake as John Legate so eloquently put it was to think I could pick the car up right out of the shop and go 2,000 miles. That was just plan dumb I have no doubt (once everything is right) the car can do it cause of the reliability of the power plant. In hind site (which of course is 20-20) I am not sure even then it would be a wise decision. John (Hoss"s car has a different configuration and I think is more up to a drive of that distance in a short time frame as I had attempted.
Anyway chalk it all up to experince and something to laugh about which my wife has done with me and at me. Truth be known she wanted it shipped from day one!!!!
Next time I air a crazy idea will someone with common sense please point out what might be a lapse of judgement on my part.
Most of you guys know so much more than I do from having "been there done that.
LOL to everyone.
Stu
Also you should take it for a drive. It is a trip. I would be interested to hear your thoughts in terms of comparison.
Jeff: I agree with what you said. Being a Newbie and pretty head strong I made some mistakes. The biggest mistake as John Legate so eloquently put it was to think I could pick the car up right out of the shop and go 2,000 miles. That was just plan dumb I have no doubt (once everything is right) the car can do it cause of the reliability of the power plant. In hind site (which of course is 20-20) I am not sure even then it would be a wise decision. John (Hoss"s car has a different configuration and I think is more up to a drive of that distance in a short time frame as I had attempted.
Anyway chalk it all up to experince and something to laugh about which my wife has done with me and at me. Truth be known she wanted it shipped from day one!!!!
Next time I air a crazy idea will someone with common sense please point out what might be a lapse of judgement on my part.
Most of you guys know so much more than I do from having "been there done that.
LOL to everyone.
Stu
The need for more test driving was certainly the root cause of your Speedster's problems Stu. However, I should like to point out to all of you that it is not uncommon at all for one of Steve's cars to do a cross country drive shortly after it hits the streets. Case in point, one of his rods that drove to LA and back only experiencing one small problem, a blown fuse in the electric window circuit. It occured when the owner activated both switches simultaneously. Other than that the car purportedly performed flawlessly. Incidently, that car has made a second cross country passage since delivery.
My point is that Steve wants to build cars that can drive out the door and be virtually trouble-free. This was the whole idea of designing a car around a modern drive train.
Shawn, I feel bad that you were disappointed that you were not able to test drive a car. If I had known that you were counting on it, I would have turned my left seat over to you on the way back from the turn around point. I'm sure you would have driven it carefully and would not have done anything that would have made my ass pucker up.
In the meantime, look for great things from SAW everyone. The pace may seem slow, but, speaking as an owner, the wait is worth it.
Hoss
My point is that Steve wants to build cars that can drive out the door and be virtually trouble-free. This was the whole idea of designing a car around a modern drive train.
Shawn, I feel bad that you were disappointed that you were not able to test drive a car. If I had known that you were counting on it, I would have turned my left seat over to you on the way back from the turn around point. I'm sure you would have driven it carefully and would not have done anything that would have made my ass pucker up.
In the meantime, look for great things from SAW everyone. The pace may seem slow, but, speaking as an owner, the wait is worth it.
Hoss
Stuart, to your point. Our wives are often the wiser of the front seat passengers in life. :) I've learned that over and over.
-Jeff "Marry Up" Campbell
-Jeff "Marry Up" Campbell
This is a vent!!!!!
There seems to be only two guys touting the late SAW delivery. One who evidently tried to buy and could not finish the car--amazing when Stuart came on the scene the car was out the door in a VERY few weeks. I don't hear Stuart complaining. The contrary, braging about the performance and the finish. The second a man who has admitted twice on this board he didn't have enough money to pay for the car but expected to drive one of two cars the owner's hadn't even seen.
'Am I all wrong here???
The SAW web site says 9 to 10 months to build me a Cabriolet. Pay or shut up. jkl
There seems to be only two guys touting the late SAW delivery. One who evidently tried to buy and could not finish the car--amazing when Stuart came on the scene the car was out the door in a VERY few weeks. I don't hear Stuart complaining. The contrary, braging about the performance and the finish. The second a man who has admitted twice on this board he didn't have enough money to pay for the car but expected to drive one of two cars the owner's hadn't even seen.
'Am I all wrong here???
The SAW web site says 9 to 10 months to build me a Cabriolet. Pay or shut up. jkl
Just as an observer.... I don't see what all the fuss about conflict is. Outside of John and C.Hines post, this has been a 4-5 person thread. Mostly a lovefest, which is cool when one is getting a new car. Good luck on your new car, it sounds like you are happy.. and after all, that IS the bottom line. Too bad you don't have time to drive it home though. That's always a great adventure.
As far as clean shops? "Has anyopne ever seen a garage/shop that produces cars with a clean shinny floor like on TV or am I just off the wall here?" Yes, I have. Several shops.
Anyway, enjoy your new Speedster, and someone post some detail pics.
As far as clean shops? "Has anyopne ever seen a garage/shop that produces cars with a clean shinny floor like on TV or am I just off the wall here?" Yes, I have. Several shops.
Anyway, enjoy your new Speedster, and someone post some detail pics.
Stu: Your car is gorgeous and to all the distractors, I'm sure to be seeing more of your posts in the technical forums asking how to fix this or that. I visited SAW and met with Steve and Hoss and was warmly greeted and shown around the shop and given a road trip. All which impressed me to the point that I ordered my SAW Cabrio, which would be more suited to my right seater than the Speedster, and even went with the automatic tranny so she could also enjoy driving it. As far as expectations, I expect Steve to produce a beautiful, reliable, long-distant and daily driver that antone would be proud to own. I've built kits cars, have purchased new as well as used cars, have suffered through delivery times, missing parts, defective parts, blown engines, recalls and depreciation. I don't harbor any grand thoughts of the car being finished on a specific date because unlike having a baby in nine months, give or take a few days or weeks, I want Steve to be the perfectionist I consider myself and not to deliver the car until he's satified it mets his standards. I considered other replica builders and find them to be as beautiful as SAW's products and I have also rebuilt type I and IV engines. I use to love to tweak and wrench on all my cars but now I no longer enjoy or can endure the strains and scrapes as it takes too long for the pain to go way at my age. So Stu, Steve O', John L and Hoss let's enjoy the easy driving, long sunsets and the admiring glances as we cruise the 'main'.
Well said Nolan. jkl