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Being somewhat new to all this and overwhelmed with the information available here can someone clarify the classification "outlaw" as I've seen it applied to certain speedsters. I have a CMC wide body and it seems that the wide body gets this designation from time to time. Mods? engines? wheels? etc. What makes it an outlaw?
1957 CMC(Flared Speedster)
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You gotcher low, low low sprung cars...or you gotcher loud tailpipes with some or one stickin' out the back...widebody is good but not mandatory, maybe no bumpers, but nerf bars. You could swap out stock 356 lamps for later model 911 lamps...hmmmmm maybe you wanna go with no hood handle or for that matter doorhandles. If I were doin' an outlaw I might consider frenching in twin beehive tail lamps.

I think an outlaw has to have radical wheels & tires again with the wide profile, but maybe painted out or powder coated or that cool billet business. Essentially it's gonna look like a speedster but on closer inspection there are some, "hey wait a minute, whaz that?" features.

...and it should reasonably fast, no shrinking violets need apply for outlaw status. lots of attitude.
Basically, everything Paul said, but think of it like a Porsche Street Rod........
It has the basic look of a 356A Speedster, but has some customizing done to it. Kinda like a stock '40 Ford coupe grandmother's car, versus a tricked out, chopped, channeled, shaved and decked '40 Ford coupe with a set of American or ET mags, frenched antenna, de-chromed, trick paint, well, you get the idea. I specifically went for a flared fendered body to build a 356 street rod.

There are a bunch of stock looking cars in the files, and then there are another bunch of us "outlaws" (although few of us think we're really outlaws) with the flared fenders, really wide trick wheels, nerf bars, 911 headlight conversions, Roll Bars, bigger engines and so forth in various stages of customization.

Take a look at Jerome Smith's file (JHS) or my file (nichols1) or Carey's (chines1) or Shambly's (shambly) from across the big pond and then look around the files section to see even more.

Back in the 50's and 60's when the 356 was getting established, and even now, there were the "purists" who kept them bone stock (there was a similar bunch of VW purists) and then there were the rest of us who took the base cars and made them "ours" with customized bodies, hotter engines, better wheels (or turning the stock VW rims around to make them look "deep"), all the same as the Ford/Chevy based hot rod crowd. Of course, having a "stealth" engine under the hood which let you devastate a Ford/Chevy V-8 helped with the "Outlaw" title, too! If your local "drag strip" had stop lights a couple of hundred yards apart you could collect a lot of beer money between lights from the V-8 crowd!!

Think of an "outlaw" as a customized 356 car, from mild to wild.

Gordon (Paul: Good post! I'm installing my exhaust megaphone tomorrow! Watch out, neighborhood!)
Talked with Carey at Beck a few weeks ago, and they are planning on providing a coupe later this year. They have several bodies being made up either now or soon, and, once they get the initial bugs out of them will be offering a production run.

Wish I was better with Photoshop or something, as I would LOVE to see the back of a coupe with flared fenders to see how it looks!! Wide rear end, filled with FAT tires and a really stout T4 in there, PLUS a non-leaking roof and roll-up windows - the dreams go on.......
This outlaw thing has been knawing at me and I was looking into the file section at the wide bodies and would it be possible to make the front flares little more fluid, like less pronounced? Keep the back flaring in the medium cast as opposed to the super wide option, just somehow 'shave' the front profile... Is that something a body shop can do? As many holes as I've drilled in my car I don't see fibreglas as very resistant to change, but sawing off a little bit might be different?
Outlaw?!...I thought we were calling the flared rides J'Lo's,

Hey Paul,

I agree with you about the front flares could be toned down a little. I also like the looks of the rear flares on the CMC/SB molds rather than the wide Vintage ones. What do you mean by "shave" the front end?

Jerome
I meant shave the flaring on the front wheel wells. Sort of incorporate it into the body surround more so that it doesn't look as if I bought a jeep fender flare kit, riveted it on, then slathered it in bondo and then started sanding... Or maybe no front flare at all.

Last couple times I went to Parts-Obsolete the picture section wasn't working
Wild Bill! What are you running for tires under that thing? I thought mine were wide 'til I looked at yours!

I could go along with the milder (narrower) flares on the front of a CMC, and I also agree that the flatter (and perhaps wider) look of the VS flares seems to look more "artificial" - in other words, the lines across the fenders don't flow as nicely, but that's just my opinion.

I run 205X16's in the front on 6-inch rims, and 225X16's at the rear on 7-inchers, but the front wheels don't fill the wells as far out as the rear so I'm almost tempted to try running 225's on 7-inch rims all around for the look. Might that might be similar to what you're running?

gn
Of course they do, but they still look "tough" (in my beholding eye) ;)

Then again, a classic body, decked out in all the trim (luggage racks, headlight grills, Nardii, louvered lid, badges front and rear and looking real German) looks pretty good, too. I ( and I guess a number of others here who refuse to grow up) prefer the wide, fat look. Hell, so did the factory, at times, when they built special factory racers with flares and big meats, and a whole lot of those guys out at Laguna Seca!

Long as we're all having fun!

gn
George,

It's deja-vu all over again! We already discussed the whole traditional vs. J'lo issue at nauseaum in a previous thread. We all know where you stand on the issue. Like I stated in that thread, one of the things that attract me to these cars are the personal touches that each owner adds to their ride. Every Speedster replica is a work of art.

You are a trip! Here we are have a jovial discussion about our fat rides and BAM!! you had to interject with your usual tact. Do you actualy talk to people the way you write your responses? Personally I love what your doing with your IM, it will truly set the standard for a long time. But it's almost like the only way to get anything other than "mine's better than yours" out of you is to build an exact clone of your ride.

When I built my car I had a vision of a certian look I wanted. Much like a sculptor looks at a chunk of rock and sees a beautiful statue. Goal #1 build the car with the look I wanted. Goal #2 make as fast as it looks. I'm well aware that the extra turning weight and width of the tires not only robs from performance but also add additional load to the bearings. My response to that is, so what, wide tires was part of my vision, I understand the risks and have accepted them. Beside with my little 75 hp 1600 I'm not exactly looking to tear up the neiborhood. I don't ever plan on racing my car. I don't have any desire to smoke a pimple faced teenager in a riceburner. I just want continually improve my sculpture, let the wind blow through my hair on a warm summer day and converse with the fine folks here on this site about our obsession.

George you have a wonderful gift of pushing the wrong button. I can't wait to meet you at Carlisle to see if you are for real! Should make an interesting weekend.

Jerome

PS: I would like to apologize to the rest of you. I know, I should know better.
Well I wouldn't disagree about add'l unsprung weight being generally bad, and not everyone thinks flares are an improvement, nor are they a requirement for going "Outlaw." I've been collecting pics of (real) Porsche 356 Outlaws on my web site (bruceclement.com/356/outlaw.htm), most of which are coupes, and very few have flares. I'm not saying flares are bad, I'm just saying that having a stock body does not preclude the Outlaw look.
Oh, the woes of the Non-comformist. Just like Jeeps, "It's a hot-rod thing, You wouldn't understand". Jerome, it's cool, nothin to get them hairs up about, just George being anal lytical. God love 'em.
George, It's true that the fat meats are heavy on the unsprung weight.
(bad) but what about grip on them curves thru them cones. I can't help to think that them 185's would roll outta their rims before mine or Jeromes would. And if they slow me down a little, Cool! Gives all them ladies a little extra time to get that thumb up for a ride. Yeah BABY! Life is good! BTW, I can't wait to check out the Silver Bullet at Carlisle! I'd
really like you to show me what a 2.4 can do.

BD
Hey guys, don't forget Carlisle has an SCCA "driving experience" available during the weekend. To quote from their site: "The Sports Car Club of America (SCCA) will conduct a drivers' training on Saturday and an autocross/time trial on Sunday on the Carlisle quarter-mile road course. For further information, visit the registration/information tent located next to the road course. Registration is Friday, 1-3 p.m., and Saturday, 9 a.m.-3 p.m. A limited number of spaces are available for Saturday or Sunday at $20 for either day or $30 for both days so register early during the show".

In the past I've seen a few Cobra's and other replicas do hot laps on this course. This is your chance to put those wide "meats" and horsepower to work. Barry Fuchs has already expressed an interest but I think I'll just watch. :>)
Jerome, your reply was right I believe. I too have a CMC wide body, I know yours is a Street Beasts. Anyone here can argue whatever the heck they want about "correctness" and "exacting" standards. BUT LET'S NOT FORGET . . . we are all driving friggin REPLICAS anyway! They WILL NEVER be "correct". They AIN'T REAL guys . . . hence the term REPLICA. So anyone can go on and on ad nauseum about how theirs is "perfect" . . . it's like having the "perfect" blow-up supermodel doll . . . IT AIN'T REAL ANYWAY! So let's just enjoy the one thing we ALL have in common - a love for cars!

Peace
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