rear marker lights quit... help

Make sure your bulbs aren't burnt out, clean up all your connections and make sure you have a solid ground.

Ok... Im home and went to the shop. I bought a new switch for the "year" beetle I thought we had. You know how that goes. Anyway, since we bought the harness from VS and wired accordingly... my white wire labeled "rr lights" is dead at the switch. No matter what position it's in, its dead. The rheostat has never worked on that switch since day 1 ( 7 years ago I bought the car). I am really wondering if it's not the switch. It's very worn feeling and the stat' is junk. Perhaps its in the switch? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6U2TPMBi28 Here is my current switch... 

 

I would like to order a new switch if nothing else to get the dimmer working again. The VS diagram list " 1968-1970. I ordered a 1968-70 from a major parts house and got a switch with way too many spades. Of course they don't take back electrical parts. So I am stuck with a new mystery switch. I'm not sure what I have on the car either. I would just like to get what the harness uses and be done with this. Here are a couple of pics of what I have and what the diagram shows. Perhaps you guys can tell me where I can get the VS switch. 

If you got a 68-70 VW switch - it probably has dome light connection.  It can probably be used - just pull up VW wiring diagram from the SAMBA site and see which terminals are needed.  I bet the VS harness just uses a generic3 position switch (like used on boats - Cole Hersee). 

Here is a 6 prong headlight switch that you could order if you want to plug'n play without having to learn how your wiring works.

 

http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDe...de=VWC-311-941-531-B

 

VW changed their switches throughout the years but the cool thing is that they kept using the same prong numbers for the same functions ... kinda. So even though the new switch you have has more prongs than your "original" switch, the insides just allow for more functions. Your new switch can be used, but you need to understand the numbers and know the wires that connect to them. It can be difficult to follow the wires from under the dash through your car, so the best way is to search for one wire at a time by starting at the end user ... the lights. Identify the colour wire(s) and where they appear under your dash. BE careful because your manufacturer, or the previous owner, may have installed several wires of the same colour having different functions. This is a big no-no but I've seen it done, but not from the VW factory. A full wiring diagram from your manufacturer would be essential to get this right.

 

Prongs:

 

X    - connected to ignition switch prong X (this is the same as prong 30 for wire to ignition switch of newer Beetles)

30  - power connected to fuse box and 30 on ignition switch

56  - sends to headlight relay prong 56

57  - sends power to front parking lights

58  - sends power to rear tail lights and licence plate light AND front parking lights if there is no 57 prong on the switch

58b - controls dimmable instrument lights

 

You can ignore 58R and 58L.

 

I've never seen a 56a prong as shown in your wiring diagram. Is 56a labelled anywhere on your original switch?

 

Here are excellent wiring diagrams for many VW headlight switches.

 

http://www.oldvolkshome.com/headlight_switch_OVH.pdf

 

Once the X and/or 30 prongs are connected you can hook up other prongs one at a time. It's easier to learn this way and isolate when/where you encounter a problem.

 

Hopefully all goes well!

 

Thinking of what Bill said ... start with the simple problems/solutions. Check that fuses are good, power is getting through circuit (multimeter or light tester is minimum required for this), wire connections are solid and clean at bulb and switch/relay, bulbs are good (even though the filament may look fine replace the non-lighting bulb with one that you know works to test the bulb), wires are not broken at stress points in bends or through body, switch and relay are most expensive and last to check. It's always a shame when someone (been there done that) waits for delivery of an expensive part to find out that it didn't need to be replaced.

This thread I started about my own headlight switch woes may help:

 

https://www.speedsterowners.com...t-a-headlight-switch

 

 

There are two basic problems:

 

- it's hard to find a decent quality switch any more 

- neither VW or VS included relays in their lighting circuits

 

Back in the day, VW's switch was beefy enough to handle the current for the lighting circuits without a relay, but most of the junk available today is marginal at best.

 

My switch is a different model than yours, but I'm reposting this photo because it identifies the different colored wires from my VS wiring harness. Hopefully, your harness is the same. If you know what the different wires are, you should be able to make any switch work. If you still can't, the guy who hooked up your harness should be able to figure it out with this information.

 

 

 

 

After the original post, I put in proper relays (one for the headlights and one for all of the running lights, front and rear). I was then able to use a replacement switch from VS because now the switch was handling only the current to run the relays, which is much less than an amp - a small fraction of what was passing through the switch when it was wired directly to the lights.

 

The biggest surprise for me was that the circuit for dimming the instrument lights - controlled by the cheesy rheostat in the headlight switch - was causing most of the problems. That rheostat has to dissipate A LOT more power (and heat) than the contacts for the light circuits do. That heat is what burned up my switch (smoke was actually pouring from the switch).

 

I ended up making a separate dimming circuit for the instrument lights and now everything runs cool.

If the turn signal and brake lights work and are bright, I would believe there is no ground problem.....  (assuming 1157 or similar bulbs)   Therefore the problem would seem to be input power....  Start by "metering" the socket to assure the loss of power, and then work backwards toward the light switch, fuse block...  May be just a loose wire or broken connection....

Thanks to all who took the time to reply. That's a bunch of good ideas and places to start! I will take that new switch that I boight 6 months ago that didn't match and just try to get the markers going. My markers worked before, and now that spade is dead on the switch in all positions... I'll try the switch I have and test it. Thanks guys.

Be careful that while disconnecting and reconnecting wires that they do not touch where they are not supposed to ... this could fry your switch before blowing the fuse.

Yeah I hear you.  Thanks.

Honestly I would like to just replace the headlight switch with the old crusty Vw switch that's in it... The one I pictured above, not the NEW one I posted that I bought. I've been to 2 VW aircooled shops and neither had ever seen the switch I am using. I can't find it online anywhere. I guess VW made it as a prototype and I got it. Haha. Thanks guys.

 

Do you have a multimeter (volt/ohmeter)? If not, and you have a Speedster, you'll need one eventually to sort out problems like this one.

 

For most basic testing, even the cheapest meters (like this one) are OK:

 

http://tinyurl.com/nqy4p92

 

With the meter, it's pretty easy to figure out what the pins on any headlight switch do, so you could use the new switch you bought.

 

First find the 'hot' terminal on the switch. It's probably labelled '30', like the key in Canuck356's post explains. (Note that it's also labelled '30' in the picture I posted of my switch).

 

Then, hook up a 12 volt source to the hot terminal on the switch. Use the meter to see which terminal is off when the switch is off, but becomes 'hot' when the switch is moved to its first click. That's either the terminal to hook up the running lights or the instrument lights to - see below to distinguish the two.

 

Then pull the switch out to its second click, and the terminal that then becomes hot is the terminal to hook up the headlights to.

 

The only thing left to do is find the terminal for the instrument lights. That also becomes 'hot' when the switch is moved to the first click, but, using the meter, you'll see the voltage on that terminal vary as you rotate the knob to dim the lights.

 

It's that simple.

 

Well, sort of. Various switches have different sized shafts and threads for the plastic knob and little metal bezel that holds the switch in the dash. Hopefully, the switch you bought will match up with the threaded bits you have.

 

I have a multimeter. I'm just going to dig in as you guys have suggested. I know basic electronics and that's it. I will do just that next week when I get some time off. Thanks guys. I'm also thinking headlight relay down the road. I've been reading way too many "extremely hot" switches searching the forums here! That's a fire waiting to happen. Ugghh

While we're on a similar topic...can anyone speculate why I get a "snapping sound" from the area of my light switch about every hour or so? It sounds like a breaker going off. No smoke, no smell.  Thanks

Could be a normal relay click, but don't know if you have used some or all of the Subi wiring, relays, etc.  If a relay is going to make a noise, it's usually only once, when it's initially turned on.  

I'm a newbie Speedster owner, in fact I'm still awaiting arrival from the shipping company so what I say here may not apply to a Speedster regarding wiring.

 

I've built or rebuilt or helped friends on about a dozen cars/trucks over the years, muscle cars, Street rods, hot rods, tri-five Chevy's. Everyone of my cars I've done I have rewired discarding the factory harnesses and replacing them with Painless, AAW or EZ Wire kits, some specific to make, others universal like for street rods.

The nice thing about all these kits is all the wiring is color coded and marked along it's length and readable about every 6-12" with what that wire does and where it goes ie:ltblueRR or ltbluew/stripeLR for the taillight circuit. Makes it easy to trace and find a 'electrical gremlin'(one of Murphy's henchmen).

 

Other than faulty switches or relays one of the biggest factors of a circuit not working or working intermittently is poor grounding at least from my experience.

 

When I got my FIA Cobra it was a project car. The original harness came out of a Mustang and NAF did a good job of wiring the car with it but the two PO had butchered the harness up quiet a bit. Before rebuilding the car I had a multitude of electrical issues ie; lights would quit working, gauge lights would go dark, turn signals would quit. So when I tore down the car I pulled the old harness out and started new. I used a Cobra specific harness made for Nardi by AAW back then. Finding a good grounding point on a 'glas car is difficult at best so I created my own by using a Cole-Heerse grounding block tucked up under the dash high on the passenger firewall, an idea I got from another Cobra owning friend of mine.

This made it convenient to run all of the wiring grounds for everything to one location, bundle it up and hide it out of sight, much like the marine industry does in wiring boats, and from the grounding block used two heavy gauge wires from the grounding block, one to engine block and another to the frame to ground the block.

To this date after nearly 14 years with this car, other than having a couple Lucas switches go bad or bulbs burn out, I've not had an electrical problem.

If I find I develop wiring issues with Speedster I'll probably do the same on it. 

Finally home after a road trip. Last night I pulled the rear marker lights off the spade on the switch and put them on the front marker spade... LIGHT! As suspected, the spade went dead on the old switch. I got the new switch that was sent to me ( different spades configuration). I could not find but one spade that was hot and it was only in the marker light position on the switch. Is X not marked as power in? I will get my multimeter out and check it today. I thought X was power in though.

Do you see numbers on your switch like 30, 57, 58 ?

If so, 30 should be power in. If you've got power going into the right lug on the switch, then you should be getting power out on at least three other terminals depending on switch position.

I am still wondering what rear marker lights are.

I was too, Michael and yes...Schwartz ( sp ? )is about the best downtown...or anywhere really.

Marker lights, running lights, tail lights, parking lights, rear lights. Whatever. Buggy? Shopping cart? Tomato tomay'toe. Cats'up , ketchup.. You knew what marker lights were.

Maybe I have led a sheltered existence or or it is a regional thing.

 

I have never heard tail lights called marker lights.

 

I know that non-Speedsters have side marker lights.

I thought you probably meant tail lights, but I wasn't sure either.  My BMW has marker lights on the side of the car, but the lights on the rear are tail lights or turn signals.

Guess it's either an old school term or southern term. Markers, brake lights, turn signals and headlights. Haha

Maybe it's an east coast thing, because I knew what you were talking about.