Roll bar

People have. Some do a show bar, some actually tie it into the frame.

I might suggest the search function, it seems that you have a lot of questions you could get answered by reading rather than starting a new thread every time you have a question. Not trying to dismiss you, we all welcome new members with open arms, just suggesting you do a little reading first, then ask questions.

Here's some info on the roll bar I built and installed Michael. A little more work to do if your car is finished already but doable and removable.

Looks great!  Thanks, I’ll look into it!

Roll bars are for race cars, where a helmet is always worn.  In street cars they can be a death trap.  

Some people are more afraid of haircuts than others. 

If your afraid of what might happen to you if you crashed or got hit in one of these cars, then maybe this isn't the car for you.

BTW, cool roll bar Bruce. I'm not a fan of how they usually look but I like that one.

LI-Rick posted:

Roll bars are for race cars, where a helmet is always worn.  In street cars they can be a death trap.  

I have a bolt-in 4 point bar for my Spyder. I only bolt it in for track use with a helmet.

I can recommend to have good belts installed, with proper framework to support them. A lap belt keeps you in the car, but does your back, neck, and shoulders no favors in a crash. I know this having survived a crash in a Spyder. My new car has 5 point belts, which I use every time I drive. They are slightly inconvenient, take an extra 10 seconds, but keep you planted in your seat for the amusement park ride LOL!

I was far luckier than Lane who smacked his face pretty hard on his steering wheel. It is rare that the face doesn't get it in a crash.

As much more comfortable as the lap belts were, I won’t do less that 3-point belts again.

Danny...I named my roll bar "The LA Roll Bar" after lane's photo of his face.

Carlos...Yup, I had the same dilemma!   Usually a single hoop looks ugly and most don't follow the contour of the windshield. The double hoop helps a lot with the look but I still think they aren't all that great looking.. The just look out of place and really ruin the lines of the whole profile of the Speedster ! But...... I like having it  along with 5 pt belts and a helmet when I'm playing at Irwindale drag strip on Thur. nights. I can't wait to get the Spyder out there one day !................Bruce

Bruce, have Greg do a bolt-in roll bar for you. I have a 4-point which gives the same protection to driver and passenger. You need that to drive Lime Rock with an instructor, plus arm restraints.

Of course, you could do the 3-point bar if you'll only be doing drags.

I have both, but haven't used the 3-point in the new car.

DannyP posted:

I was far luckier than Lane who smacked his face pretty hard on his steering wheel. It is rare that the face doesn't get it in a crash.

I know. Face meets fist on steering wheel or face meets steering wheel directly.

Three points installed in new car. Actually no one really knows how my mouth got injured in the crash in the old Speedster. My not at fault accident was a hard hit glancing broadside while steering to the left to avoid impact ( hitting hard on my right side ) against the offending party's  ( 58 year old woman in a borrowed SUV ) at about 45 mph . If I had a passenger that day they likely would  have sustained very serious head injuries or worse not having more adequate restraint or driving in a larger vehicle. I launched up and to the right on impact and the passenger that I did not have would have whacked the offending vehicle violently with their right side of the head and shoulder. The helpful witness to the accident right behind me explained that he thought the injuries to my face was either impact on the center windshield area or upon my right hand on the steering wheel on recoil. I feel lucky that day for only suffering loose teeth, glued lips and X rays needed on one femur from the underside of the steering wheel while in launch. 

I've ridden/rode ? street motorcycles since about age 12 and  cars since 16 and have never had an at fault accident, in fact only one minor one ( not at fault ) until this one smash noted above. With the abundance of more traffic and especially distracted driving these days I'm event more vigilant.   

I have a four point roll bar, securely engineered into the frame, and four point seat belts.  Maybe it's for style, but I am optimistic that both would provide some modicum of safety if needed. 

I know that, psychologically, I feel more secure having the bar and the belts.

@Michael Balastrieri it's also important to remember that you're essentially riding around in a thin plastic egg shell with little to no side impact protection (for most of us), an engine with literally no protection from a rear impact and the gas tank just above our feet.  

The people running the NHTSA crash tests would probably laugh at us.......

We all learn to drive like everyone's out to get us.

Mine was like the Hokie Pokie. I took the roll bar out, I put the roll in (repeat). I got a sweet tan tonneau from Wolfgang and it has the holes so it's back in. 

As some have said, the "mouse trap" won't do you much good but it's better than the top of your head. Mine is just there to fill the holes. 

I had the same question when I started my "40 hour" speedster 5 or 6 or 7 years ago. Next chicken or the egg topic? 

Sorry, got mine from Alan. 

Speedsters with the 2 x 4  - 20 gauge steel sub frame tend to hold up fairly well in an accident . IMHO a rear impact would provide the best so called protection, side impact would be concerning and in a frontal impact there is see  MUSBJIM, Lane or Freeman's accident photos

Some years ago I traded Kevin Hines a 67 Convertible Beetle for what I called the "Blow it up" Spyder. Some on here might remember it. I don't know all of how it came to be but Kevin Hines and Jake Raby teamed up and donated?? or were paid to build a Beck Spyder for a TV pilot for I think the Speed Channel. They built this Spyder with some unique parts and it was made to draq race another unique car over and over until one of the engines failed or blew up. Stupid right? The show was not picked to be a regular show, no surprise. So I am assuming Jake Raby took his monster type 4 engine back and the drag prepped Spyder came back to Special Edition and they had it for sale on their website as a roller. The Spyder had a 6 point roll cage and a hydraulic shifter that you pulled back once for each upshift and forward once for each downshift.  I set the Spyder up at first for a track day car using a 2387cc engine with Super flow heads and a 911 type fan shroud. After that I cut the cage and made it so you could run it in or out, it was ugly but race safe to pass track inspection . I eventually sold the car to someone in Washington State. If Carey or Kevin want to Chime in I would love to hear more about the car and the failed TV show. Sorry I don't have better pictures. The car came covered with race sponsor stickers which I was able to remove to have the car in the condition of the last picture. I think I sold the car for $21K back in 2007 or so.

did it win?

I don't know. Maybe Carey or Kevin knows. I am not sure the show was ever shown. There is a trailer for the show online but it has different cars https://www.metacafe.com/watch...speed_tv_s_new_show/

I remember something about that show, Jimmy- I think I read about Jake's preparations on his website. I don't remember ever seeing the show broadcast either

Pretty cool story!

I remember that "Blow-it-up" show and story also. I remember Jake talked about it quite a bit, then nothing. 

I had no idea you had that car for a while, Jimmy, that's cool.

Speed channel, then Velocity, now Motor Trend..........

I thought I remembered something about Jake not liking the way the producers wanted to do the show and how they judged the winner. I don't think the Raby/Beck car won the challenge. My memory may not be correct but I know Carey remembers something because he told me some of the story way back in 2007 when I picked the Spyder up at Special Edition.  It is another car I wish I had now. The 2008 "great recession" hit my business and finances hard and the selling off of some of my car collection helped my family get through. Pics of some of the cars I sold in 2008-2009.

Wow Jimmy, that must have hurt to get rid of all of those cars... more to the point how the heck did you service all of those and still have time to do business... lol  

I know, I know, that too can be purchased  

Jimmy- the Mustang. That was the one.

When fabricating the frame for my spyder, I included bending-up a multi point attached rollover bar.  However, I decided to wait on welding it onto the frame until later in the project because:  A. It was not period correct.  B. It was aesthetically ugly.

When the time came to either go or no-go, I fitted it in place and realized I had another determining factor altogether:  With the rollover bar, I had a bigger chance of getting killed in a minor collision due to the likelihood my head smacked the rollover bar, than getting saved in the relatively unlikelihood of a rollover.  And, in the event of a rollover, the rollover bar probably wouldn't save me anyway, because my head would smack into it then too!  In my case there was no positioning of the rollover bar that would get it far enough away from my head, so I opted to no-go.

That decision led to the next decision; lap belts only, or full 5-point harness.  In this case, my research led me to believe I'm better off in a rollover with a lap belt than with a full harness (which would most assuredly kill me).  So I went with lap belts and figure I'm at least better-off than on a motorcycle.

Everyone comes to their decisions based on their own conclusions.  I concluded to accept the spyder for what it is, an unaltered throw-back to the way it used to be, 60 years ago.  That was my original intention, and that's the whole fun of it.  If I had a speedster, I'd feel the same.

I guess that is why so many driving them have less hair on top

Mark, I used to think exactly like you about belts and rollbars and accidents, until I met some Armco at 60 mph wearing lap belts.

I also do not like the way the rollbar looks on my car, but it is tall enough to actually do some good on the track IF needed.

Like I said, I was extremely lucky to NOT smash my face. I do have a nice permanent click in my neck every single time I move though. And I also totally agree about rollbars for the street with no helmet versus rollbar and helmet.

But, the chance of a rollover on the street is 10% or less. It's probably about 90% facial/neck/back/shoulder damage when wearing only lap belts. And if it happens to you, you'll maybe come to the same conclusion. Of course, I'm lucky enough to have a Vintage with a nice 1.5" tube to wrap the shoulder belts around at the right height. And the submarine belt wasn't too hard to anchor either, but routing it through the seat was a bit of a hassle. All worth it, and I'll take the deviation from 1950s feel to save my butt.

Danny...Yeah, Irwindale Dragstrip always insisted on the roll bar, 5point belts, Helmet (up to date) and hand restraints in my Speedster. The hand restraints took some getting used to. Greg is putting a four poster in the Spyder. I have to tell him to make it removable next time I see him...............Bruce

Bruce, I'll bet he will make it removable no problem. Two 3-bolt plates on the floor by the front wheel wells and slip over short stubs to the sides of the seats by the firewall/door latch area. It made the LRP safety people happy.

Bruce, yes, it does take a bit of time to get used to the arm restraints, I slid mine onto the waist belt. I used a modern Cam-lock quick release latch rather than the older latch and link. I ended up safety-wiring the accelerator Morse cable, it kept popping off AFTER I was completely strapped in with everything.

I did a bit more rollover research, one source says only 2-3% of collisions are rollovers, and of that the vast majority are pickups and SUVs. I'm thinking it is a pretty minimal risk of a rollover in such low center of gravity cars like ours. I'm really feeling pretty good about my harness choice, even without a rollbar on the street.

https://www.willenslaw.com/rollover-car-accidents/

aircooled posted:

Danny...Yeah, Irwindale Dragstrip always insisted on the roll bar, 5point belts, Helmet (up to date) and hand restraints in my Speedster. The hand restraints took some getting used to. Greg is putting a four poster in the Spyder. I have to tell him to make it removable next time I see him...............Bruce

What sort of times were you running?

Not to butt in on the drag strip times but I was running low 12's with the "Blow it up" Beck Spyder running a 2276 engine with 10:1 compression, super flow heads and leaded 110 octane race fuel, man do I love the smell of race fuel in the morning LOL.. , If I would have done some work to get more traction the times would have easily dropped into the high 11's I think. I didn't get to far involved with the drag racing end, I converted to car from a race car to a street car.

That's pretty quick, Jimmy! How high above sea level are you?

Al...Irwindale is a 1/8 mile strip.  Low 8's with a good reaction time. You can ask for a random time on the yellow pre lights but when I do, my reaction times are all over the place. As soon as I go back to a consistent pre start light time, my reaction times get much better. DUH !  My best reaction time was .019 but I missed 3rd.  Still gets my heart pumping when staging !  Still fun too !  Going tonight.........Bruce

aircooled posted:

Al...Irwindale is a 1/8 mile strip.  Low 8's...

That's pretty good, Bruce- in the 12's in the quarter. Drag racing's always a thrill!

Muncie dragway in Muncie Indiana is 958 ft. above sea level

Jimmy V. posted:

Muncie dragway in Muncie Indiana is 958 ft. above sea level

I thought it would have been higher than that, but what do I know? (obviously, not as much as I thought!).  The local drag strip here (Mission Raceway) is known as a record setter- it's about 20 ft. above sea level and right beside the Fraser River, so the air is cool and dense...

Tonight I'm taking my 2017 GMC Canyon. It's a V6 with an 8 sp. So far my best has been 10.50 (1/8 mile again) and a whole 72mph !  They have a drifting court now as well so I thought I would try that out since all my tires are down to 3/16" and need replacing. Never done it before. Anyone out there ever done it ?  I could / need some hints on what to be aware of or not do..........Bruce