Show me your gaps!

Since I'll be removing the engine in the next week or so I figured I'd clean up the engine compartment all nice nice and redo my tins.
I did a search on this and there were some threads but very little in the way of pics. I'm looking to do the walls with something but I have no idea of feasability etc... I don't want the louvered look, but I want something cool (no pun intended). Sound deadening is a bonus but not necessary.
I also am a little confused on the whole "front of the engine gap / bus seal" thing. I have what, to me, looks like a bit too much of an opening there. I just don't know how much opening is too much. Is there supposed to be ANY openings in the engine compartment? I would assume none is best, but I don't know. If you have any pics of your engine compartment I'd like to see what you've done. Thanks.

HERE ARE A LOT OF GAPS

You and Vince are always there for me Gerd. You're the best.

Mickey,
I used a heat-shield, sound deadening material to cover the engine compartment. It's a bit thicker than dynomat and more pliable. I applied it with the 3m high-temp spray adhesive. The material is sandwiched between layers of aluminum foil, so it comes silver. I painted it black - I wasn't going for the space shuttle look.
As far as the gap between the firewall and the engine tin, I left the material long at the arch and it plugged the gap nicely.
I'll get the name of the product if you're interested. It's relatively cheap and seems to be working very well.

Mickey,

I am sorry I missed you at Carlisle.

I plan to use the bus seal all around. The only opening I will have is one right in front of the fan intake.

On the sides I just have painted fiberglass.

Mickey - just keep your eye on the ball - NO GAP is the only desired result. Elegant and visual is good, but functional is absolutely necessary.

OK, no gaps it is then. What about a small hole (3"?) in the firewall aligned with the fan and having the oil cooler on the other side? It would pull a little extra cool air into the engine compartment and keep a steady flow over the cooler, just a thought.

What is the material that insulates and has the foil? (I think someone used the term Space Shuttle) Where would I find High Temp spray adhesive?

I'm more interested in functionality than looks with this one so whatever is most recommended it the way I'm going.

Terry,

What is the name of the product you used? I am interested.
My old IM has that diamond quilted vinyl product that might be changed out some time.

Mickey, no gaps is best. Use the H shaped bus foam to seal the engine tin to the engine compartment.

Dave

Dave,
The product is called "The Insulator". I purchased it at Competition Products: www.competitionproducts.com
It is 4'X6', enough to do the engine compartment and most of the interior. With shipping and handling it came to $40.90.
Mickey,
I put a 3"X4" hole in the firewall and installed a louvered dryer vent cover. It stays closed unless the engine is revving high or the temps hit 190. That's when the blower kicks in and provides 160 cubic ft./minute.
Definitely the "H" foam gasket around the apron.

Though I admire the posted pic (possibly, too much since it is blown up and hanging in a respectable place), I, too would like to see some pics of engine tins, gaskets, etc.
I'm a little cornfused re: front, back, bus, etc.

Thanks,

GG

Terry,

That looks like good stuff, thanks for the tip. Mickey, looks like a possible winner. Here is a link to Terry's recommendation. http://www.competitionproducts.com/prodinfo.asp?number=12406

Sounds like a very cool set up on the dryer vent and fan. I have used those louvered vents for a lot of applications in custom homes.

The fan (type?) is in the dead space between the rear seat and engine compartment? Then a duct down to scoop up cool air? Wiring connections are a mystery.

Sorry I did not see that setup at Morro, would love to have checked it out.

Dave

Dave,
It's in the dead spot. I actually have another set up if you're interested. It's a 3" Detmar blower with rubber flex ducting. It's connected to the thermostat that controls the oil cooler fan.

Mickey, the oil cooler shouldnt be near the fan inlet.
something to do with sucking hot...

Terry,

Always interested in ways to cool down, if you care to share, that would be great.

Mickey, at Morro I looked close at Henry's new IM's and he had the coolers in the dead space up front where the horns are.

Dave

Dave,
The coolers in the dead spots where the horns are are on Henry's 911 cars. You might have also noticed his air conditioner condensers.

Dale,

Exactly right. I was quizzing Henry about locations. Retro fitting AC is my next project (I think) I am gathering parts and info. Condensers and oil coolers up front per Henry.
I put in the lower valance just before Morro along with a CHT. Thanks to Will P. I have the engine compressor mounting setup along with a compressor from a late model IM. As funds allow I will get the rest of the gear from IM later this summer.

Dave

Dave, Dave, Dave... Why in the world would you need to complicate your lovely car with A/C in the Sandy Eggo climate? As Colin Chapman said, "Simplicate (sic) and add lightness."

Yeah, and ask Lane how much he drives his Speedster in July and August....

Weekend early mornings/evenings only. Heck, I don't even like to drive the Acura in July and August. But I don't live in Sandy Eggo where it's almost always nice.

A little useless knowledge here for George and Dave; hope it helps.
Oil coolers come in a lot of shapes and sizes, and there's probably one out there for everybody. I think Carey still swears by Setrab.
Tom DeWalt's green coupe (Miss June in the 2009 SOC calendar) and the Hoopty have the same type of multi-pass cooler, but they're mounted in different places.
I don't remember the brands, but I don't think either was a Setrab. Carey's smarter than me.
The first picture is the Hoopty's cooler, mounted an inch and a half off of the cockpit tins on flat stock. The fan is run by the thermostatic cutout switch on the sending-side oil line. The cooler is always a conduit for oil, but the fan isn't always running until the switch makes it so. (Teresa told me this setup has changed since I last saw the car, but the idea is the same.)
The second picture shows the cooler located inside Tom's rear, driver's side wheel well, behind the tire. I'm not sure that's the best place for it, but it was opposed to the throw pattern of rocks, and we were a little pressed for time that weekend. The vanes were not exposed to debris, but the side of the cooler was.
It's important to not mount the cooler directly to a surface. It should stand off enough that air can flow around to the back side after it's bolted, so using standoff bushings or stout rubber hose cut to a half-inch are a great idea. No air, no cooling benefit.
The tins in his car (third picture) were made from materials on hand, and only took a couple hours. They started as cardboard templates, and got transferred to roofing tin. They were in four parts; one for each side of the engine (growing out from the box-tubing frame), and two more pieces for the apron toward the back of the car.
Really not a daunting project, and making your own tins requires only a metal straight-edge, tin snips, a rubber mallet and something to smooth the edges of the tins with; Scotchbrite pads work fine, but a disc works even better. If they curl, whack 'em with the hammer on both sides and flatten 'em right back out. Very not hard.
Use a high-temperature rubber, as everyone else has suggested. The rubber bus seal we're speaking of is not pictured, but it's a channeled seal intended for use around the engine gaps on a VW Microbus. Cake to find.

(And a little useFUL knowledge for Lane, too. You should drive your Beck ALL year, Mister. It's a good car like that!)

Oh I do! Just not all day, all year.

Actually that's not true. I've been known to drive it in the middle of the day in the hottest months. I just sweat a lot.

Cory,

Thanks, your machine is really fine. Truly hand built and well sorted. Its always a pleasure to see real craftsmanship. Very helpful post.

Lane, I know AC not totally necessary but my right seater has made it known after a mountain cruise last year in a Santa Ana (heat wave) where she almost melted, that a little more climate control was desired.
I think I'm not alone in this and others have had passenger issues also. In the summer our mountain roads can easily get 95 to 105 degrees we are a desert after all.

The IM AC set up has always looked so elegant and stealth to me. I've wanted to install this mod from day 1 and just to see if I can and the power drain is small.
For me I don't suffer because its so darn fun to drive one of these air cooled hot rods.

Dave

Any more pics like that third one Cory posted? Maybe even one with an engine in the car? I found one Joe Soltis posted a while back, but I need MOAR!

Also, can someone post a link to this bus seal for sale somewhere? Apparently, I'm incapable of googling properly.

Is the point of the firewall to completely isolate the top of the engine from the bottom? Should there be a hole at the front of the engine compartment to act as an intake for the cooling fan? (I don't have an external oil cooler). Or does the shroud in the deck lid suffice?

Thanks,
Adam

Is this the stuff? http://www.busdepot.com/details.jsp?partnumber=111813705A

That isn't what I was visualizing, but if that's it, I already have some.

Adam,

The bus seal that is usually used isn't the one in your link.

It is H-shaped foam.

I don't think sealing the engine firewall is that critical - the CMC build manual has you cutting out the circular moon fan piece (good 7" section) and using a rubber skirt across the rest (to deflect water and mud mostly I suspect).

https://www.speedsterowners.com/library/fiberfaba/images/fiberfaba042.jpg

It's the heat from the headers/heat exchanger and exhaust that you don't want in the engine compartment. I'd think having the front open would be a help in cooling.