There are a lot of people that consider $70K chump change and that's the target market...They'll sell a few here and a few there until the novelty wears off.
meh, What's the price? $100K? Nope. Rather buy a new P speedster and still have $$$ for a boat cruise.
and...despite all assertions to the contrary...it's still a replica!
I deleted my comment since it was not constructive... I'll just sum it up in a much shorter and nicer way... not for me.
chines1 posted:I deleted my comment since it was not constructive... I'll just sum it up in a much shorter and nicer way... not for me.
DITTO...and original critique was TOO KIND....you are, of course, a GENTLEMAN
SF-Speedster posted:Wishing STARKE the best of luck. They delivered a product ahead of when they first informed this group, and kept true to their word.
As STAN mentioned, I don’t suspect many in this group will rush out to purchase one, but I’m sure a number of people outside this group will certainly purchase one.
To me, they did a much better job than WCC did on their 356 coupe/Convertible humpback concoction. And I’d take this over that ‘Eleanor’ bastardization in the background of the reveal.
Good luck STARKE! I hope to see a number of these on the road!
-Kevin
WCC used a cayman, the engine is closer to driver's seat than a Stark which looks like a stretched Boxster's passenger section. Not sure.
anybody has dimensions of Starke speedster?
Is it my imagine but are the rear grills looking disproportionate to the back lid ? It's kind of cool but windshield and mirrors are a bit of a missfit. Still striking. I think we can assume that instead of the visceral early feel you will have a highway cruiser ala Boxter which it is and this makes it a whole different experience to our cars... Just saying.
Banzai Pipeline posted:Banzai Pipeline posted:
not a chance....
Pretty much what we expected...yes? Their uphill battle is to get somebody to buy this as opposed to all other options in context with a PREVIOUSLY OWNED drivetrain....as it is NOT a new car. Many enthusiasts know their options including where to but a very luxurious flat six or SUBY monster SPPEDSTER/ROADSTER
with all the trimmings.
They could easily sell 6 to 8 cars per year but I have no idea what their projections are or at what point their business model becomes viable/thriving. I wish them well and will be watching the evolution of the revolution
I can all but guarantee you they will sell more of these than "a very luxurious flat six monster SPPEDSTER/ROADSTER with all the trimmings"
Why do you think that is?
WNGD;
I would imagine that the best you could expect is a car that drives like a boxster but looks like, well.......looks like that. I'm not aware if they automatically do some magic to change or improve the fundamentals of the car, just the cosmetic changes.
Somebody buy one and let us know.
If they start building production cars in December, have they announced initial delivery dates?
Double-bagger
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Actually my son summed it up quite nicely when he went from a stick older BMW to a newer 3 series coupe with DSG auto... One was an experience and the newer one was a cruiser...
Truth is he liked his old car better, more fun, more visceral to drive at all speeds.
IaM-Ray posted:Actually my son summed it up quite nicely when he went from a stick older BMW to a newer 3 series coupe with DSG auto... One was an experience and the newer one was a cruiser...
Truth is he liked his old car better, more fun, more visceral to drive at all speeds.
DITTO....like the old early 80s 911s you get to feel the road in your hands, under your ass, and in your bones. Some new cars drive themselves and you can take a knap
Yes a knap can Kill you 
There's a couple of things I think I would have done differently, but I like it. I can't afford to buy one, but I hope they sell a bunch. It would be interesting to see 1 up close.
I like it. I don't want one, will never be able to afford one, but I think (if Starke can deliver a production line product) that they hit the sweet spot.
Expensive means exclusive, so most buyers will be happy to have the only one around.
The desire should be there. The styling is what modern drivers want: comfy and retro.
Size is also something modern drivers want. I'll refer you gentlemen to the BMW Mini which, as an original Austin Mini owner I once overheard groused (and which is obvious to anyone who has ever seen the originals), "there's nothing Mini about it."
Something like 5 million of the Austin variants were sold over 40+ years of production.
I believe (not sure) that the new Minis, recently selling at over 350,000 copies a year, may have already exceeded that. It's only been 16 years since its introduction.
ALB posted:There's a couple of things I think I would have done differently, but I like it. I can't afford to buy one, but I hope they sell a bunch. It would be interesting to see 1 up close.
If you had the(discretionary) 70K plus another 9 to 15K for a donor, are you buying this for 70 to 85K?
Banzai what is the price point for an new IM6? How many resto mod corvettes, camaros and mustangs are cracking the six figure mark. At the end of the day there is a large population of folks who don’t want to tinker with carbs or other 60:year old technology. Team that with airbags, abs, nav, air, heat, etc, you now cater to a much larger pool of people. Maybe not the the majority of the SOC but they are out there.
I went the Suby route because I am not a mechanic nor do I have the time to fiddle endlessly, I like getting in my car and driving to Starbucks or pick up my son from school. Is it bullet prof, nope but I’m more comftable with it
We all like different stuff, it’s what makes this hobby so fun. Not one of us is right, we just like what we like. For my $$$$ a slightly used 911 or a new vette, hard to beat bang for the buck.
Banzai Pipeline posted:ALB posted:There's a couple of things I think I would have done differently, but I like it. I can't afford to buy one, but I hope they sell a bunch. It would be interesting to see 1 up close.
If you had the(discretionary) 70K plus another 9 to 15K for a donor, are you buying this for 70 to 85K?
You keep on harping about this; let it go already! I've already stated (a long time ago in this discussion) that I am not the intended market for these cars. I do believe, though (as do several other people here) that there is a market for this sort of thing, so why don't you can it (I'm more than a little tired of listening to you spout your opinion again and again and again and I'm sure others are as well...oh gee, surprise, I've already said that) so we can sit back and see if there is a market and if they can build more than 1 car?
Joe Fortino posted:Banzai what is the price point for an new IM6? How many resto mod corvettes, camaros and mustangs are cracking the six figure mark. At the end of the day there is a large population of folks who don’t want to tinker with carbs or other 60:year old technology. Team that with airbags, abs, nav, air, heat, etc, you now cater to a much larger pool of people. Maybe not the the majority of the SOC but they are out there.
I went the Suby route because I am not a mechanic nor do I have the time to fiddle endlessly, I like getting in my car and driving to Starbucks or pick up my son from school. Is it bullet prof, nope but I’m more comftable with it
We all like different stuff, it’s what makes this hobby so fun. Not one of us is right, we just like what we like. For my $$$$ a slightly used 911 or a new vette, hard to beat bang for the buck.
I agree JOE...but a new IM6 with a 3.6 FUEL INJECTED Porsche motor, essentially bulletproof along with 911 tranny/brakes/etc approaches $130K including DONOR CAR......vey little tinkering. That includes full leather, $4K for overriders, stereo, WEVO shifter....all bells and whistles. You can buy a 1998 993 CABRIO/low mileage for 75K or as you suggested a VETTE or even a Ferrari 328 or similar.
I would say a new IM6 is NOT 60s technology.....my car, a 2008 2.7RS, is a bit more in the hot rod mode with WEBERS but I would have preferred EFI, but grateful for what I have. I have power windows, power locks, automatic fire extinguisher rig, but no power top, NO airbags, NO WARRANTY.
Your SUBY is beautiful and low maintenance but had to be big bucks also with all the bells and whistles, and overriders although hard to say whether a 3.6EFI 6 is less of a pain than a SUBY but both fairly CIVIL compared to any carb4 1915/2332. I am similarly UNABLE to tinker with my car......
But you are right about airbags, etc...and warranty. I just see them buying a slightly used 911, or Lotus, Ferrari.....just dont see them buying a used BOXSTER/STARKE in big numbers at 70 to 140K. YES INDEED they will sell some cars but not sure about a viable business model although I am ignorant of their startup costs, debt service, etc.
Well if your looking for more bang for your buck... you can run a spreadsheet as to when the depreciation and condition of a car meet your cost or budget then calculate the value of the vehicle and what you might like to have in it then buy a used vehicle of your liking, boxter, vette, mustang etc etc... and since it is only driven less than 5K per year you could get away with less money presuposes you do not hit an unfortunate engine or tranny issue.
But if you must have an old car or a 356 tribute replica.... then your here on this list...
SOC madness is simply the fact that you willing to put up with old car technology for the most part and the nuances of a hand built vehicle with it's potential failures all of it to be smitten by the 356 historical shape..
If it is a weekend joy rider you'll be fine with whatever you choose.
ALB posted:Banzai Pipeline posted:ALB posted:There's a couple of things I think I would have done differently, but I like it. I can't afford to buy one, but I hope they sell a bunch. It would be interesting to see 1 up close.
If you had the(discretionary) 70K plus another 9 to 15K for a donor, are you buying this for 70 to 85K?
You keep on harping about this; let it go already! I've already stated (a long time ago in this discussion) that I am not the intended market for these cars. I do believe, though (as do several other people here) that there is a market for this sort of thing, so why don't you can it (I'm more than a little tired of listening to you spout your opinion again and again and again and I'm sure others are as well...oh gee, surprise, I've already said that) so we can sit back and see if there is a market and if they can build more than 1 car?
Just asked you a simple question.....
I'm pretty sure I spend too much time here.
It used to be a pleasant diversion from the day-to-day grind. We'd hang out with (mostly) like-minded guys and make fun of ourselves. It's not nearly as much fun lately.
It was like this wayyyyy back when St. George ran down any car that didn't come from his preferred builder. The only time he wasn't looking down on the little people who bought other cars was when he was regaling us all with tales of his super-interesting life.
He was generally right (and he had led an interesting life, as most of us have)... but almost nobody could get past the bloviating. It was impossible to identify with somebody as full of themselves as he was, who could never see anything from anybody else's point of view. There were a dozen or more good guys who stopped posting here because of his incessant blather. He passed suddenly, and we sainted him.
Things run in cycles, and this could turn a corner again. I was just about finished a few years back when it seemed as if the site was devolving into a frat-party. The SOC turned around (at least in my opinion), and has been enjoyable for nice stretch.
But a decent online forum doesn't just happen, it takes a lot of work. This site could very easily implode on itself, much in the same way that Facebook has become an unusable echo-chamber of arguments and memes. On this site at present, there are only about 10 or so guys posting regularly, and we seem to put a beatdown on anybody we can't immediately identify with (witness what happens in almost every single for sale post that isn't a fire-sale).
Starke came in here swinging his manhood, and putting down all the established builders. It was bad form. But that was 6 months ago, and we can't seem to let it go. That's not a good way to build up a community. Every day I log on, hoping to find sparkling dialog, and I find.... this.
I'm kind've beyond caring at this point. The battle-lines have long since been drawn. If you want to defend your little hills, I invite you to knock yourselves out.
"It's not enough that we succeed. Everyone else must fail". Genghis Khan
Starke vs spy shot...hmmmmmmmmmmm
S
I like the car and quite frankly, if I had the money I'd probably buy one. I like the look of the 356 and even though this one is a 357 it'd fill a niche. There are times (many times actually) here in Fresno when it's 104 and I'd like to hit the freeway and head to the coast where it'd be about 72 degrees. But I can't. Driving on the freeway in 104 degree weather is miserable, even with the emergency top up. So I had a custom made trailer built so I can haul it to the coast to drive around. It'd sure be nice to put the top up, blast the A/C, get on the freeway and drop the top when I arrive at the coast.
Stan Galat posted:I'm pretty sure I spend too much time here.
It used to be a pleasant diversion from the day-to-day grind. We'd hang out with (mostly) like-minded guys and make fun of ourselves. It's not nearly as much fun lately.
It was like this wayyyyy back when St. George ran down any car that didn't come from his preferred builder. The only time he wasn't looking down on the little people who bought other cars was when he was regaling us all with tales of his super-interesting life.
He was generally right (and he had led an interesting life, as most of us have)... but almost nobody could get past the bloviating. It was impossible to identify with somebody as full of themselves as he was, who could never see anything from anybody else's point of view. There were a dozen or more good guys who stopped posting here because of his incessant blather. He passed suddenly, and we sainted him.
Things run in cycles, and this could turn a corner again. I was just about finished a few years back when it seemed as if the site was devolving into a frat-party. The SOC turned around (at least in my opinion), and has been enjoyable for nice stretch.
But a decent online forum doesn't just happen, it takes a lot of work. This site could very easily implode on itself, much in the same way that Facebook has become an unusable echo-chamber of arguments and memes. On this site at present, there are only about 10 or so guys posting regularly, and we seem to put a beatdown on anybody we can't immediately identify with (witness what happens in almost every single for sale post that isn't a fire-sale).
Starke came in here swinging his manhood, and putting down all the established builders. It was bad form. But that was 6 months ago, and we can't seem to let it go. That's not a good way to build up a community. Every day I log on, hoping to find sparkling dialog, and I find.... this.
I'm kind've beyond caring at this point. The battle-lines have long since been drawn. If you want to defend your little hills, I invite you to knock yourselves out.
"It's not enough that we succeed. Everyone else must fail". Genghis Khan
SORRY to have contributed to any crumbles.....will leave well enough alone.....hope you soon regain your enthusiasm and laughs....BE WELL.
I was at the unveiling today. Very nice looking car! I’ve got several pictures and a video of the unveiling on my phone, will try to post later.
Also watched a brand new Vintage Speedster sell for $47k before buyers premium! Nice car but I’m sure it could have been purchased direct from VS for a lot less.
Mike
I like it. Though I would change some design features... something which could be done as this is a bestspoke car builder.
It has a nice modern car look built on the classic line foundations of the 356. Like modern Chargers, Mustangs or the 911, a new car with nostalgia to remind you where it came from.
Generally speaking- in a world where new cars are shaped more and more like soap bars, and OEM design decisions are made on "selling millions of units", it's getting harder to tell individual models appart from 30yrds away, This is a nice concept... too bad Porsche didn't take a shot at it first. Anyone who still craves to differentiate themselves from the "Johnneses" , and likes porsches old and new iMHO I think could like this modern tribute car.
As much as I like my 2015 911S, it's not uncommon to find 15 just just just like it in a downtown parking lot on a Saturday night... even more in the office Mon-FR... kind of stinks.... hard to personalize something mass produced without detracting from its perceived value. And one of the reasons why I love my VS... its got my flavor and fingerprints all over it, and pays tribute to a design I love.
Kudos for WWC and Starke for thinking out of the box.
Would love to see pctures with the top up, or even a hard top version... maybe WWC and Starke should collaborate, as the WWC hard top was slick looking.
Maybe Porches proposed baby boxster will have some retro body lines.
Check out dnaautomotive.com
Stan, I could not agree more. It is just good table manners to refrain from saying hurtful and negative things to people.....and that is precisely why I have not said...
" I know pimps that would not be seen in that car ."
Somehow the Starke speedster just reminds me too much of Ford’s attempt to bring back the Thunderbird. The looks just don’t do it, especially with that sloped back windshield.
I am sure they will sell, but not to me. I’d buy a Cayman instead.
Bob: IM S6 posted:Somehow the Starke speedster just reminds me too much of Ford’s attempt to bring back the Thunderbird. The looks just don’t do it, especially with that sloped back windshield.
I am sure they will sell, but not to me. I’d buy a Cayman instead.
Thansks for sharing the DNA link
Bob: IM S6 posted:Somehow the Starke speedster just reminds me too much of Ford’s attempt to bring back the Thunderbird. The looks just don’t do it, especially with that sloped back windshield.
I am sure they will sell, but not to me. I’d buy a Cayman instead.
I don't necessarily disagree with you Bob but as someone else said, you'd be just like the other 4 Caymans in the parking lot....the Starke is for someone who yearns for the 356 nostalgia over a modern motor and drive train (and brakes and shocks and A/C and heat and power windows and .....) and almost never see another one no matter where you drive.
I do like the color. Again the wheels... I can't get past those. They did a good job at putting a bigger Speedster body on a modern chassis.
It reminds me of this: 
or
This concept has been around for a while. The proportions are all sort of there... in most of the right places... but it's just off enough to make your eyes burn. If those C5 Corvette revolution guys are selling units (and based on their website they are...) I imagine Starke will to.
Just think of the turned up noses those guys get at the Corvette shows?! Corvette snobs make Porsche Replica snobs look like the Welcome Wagon. I do not envy their disappointment.
But for the windshield....
If Starke had utlized an aftermarket street rod stainless windshield frame and picked seats that don't look like they were from Pat Boone's Miata it would have better eye appeal...but, it still would look like someone requested to have it "super sized"
Alan Merklin posted:If Starke had utlized an aftermarket street rod stainless windshield frame and picked seats that don't look like they were from Pat Boone's Miata it would have better eye appeal...but, it still would look like someone requested to have it "super sized"
PAT BOONE...I love it...very funny. I could easily see him driving one of those GRANDMA mutants
TRP posted:I do like the color. Again the wheels... I can't get past those. They did a good job at putting a bigger Speedster body on a modern chassis.
It reminds me of this:
or
This concept has been around for a while. The proportions are all sort of there... in most of the right places... but it's just off enough to make your eyes burn. If those C5 Corvette revolution guys are selling units (and based on their website they are...) I imagine Starke will to.
Just think of the turned up noses those guys get at the Corvette shows?! Corvette snobs make Porsche Replica snobs look like the Welcome Wagon. I do not envy their disappointment.
First couple photos no postie!!