Steering Shaft Repair

Mike....What do you think caused the "crush basket" to fail ?...........Bruce

I think it was 95% age, and a small possibility of a VERY slight angle on the column/steering box alignment.

If my car had a crush-cage, I'd surely sleeve it just like Mike did here. Looks awesome, Mike!

@aircooled posted:

Mike....What do you think caused the "crush basket" to fail ?...........Bruce

There were millions of late model Beetles running around with the later columns and they don't just randomly 'fall apart'.  Only Beetles with previous collision damage and dune buggies/replicars seem to have this problem.  I think with our cars it's either a case of damage that was not noticed when the column was installed or it was installed ever so slightly out of line with the input shaft on the steering box.

@aircooled posted:

Mike....What do you think caused the "crush basket" to fail ?...........Bruce

It was age (1975) and I was running lower tire pressure on the first day and pushing the car hard and on day two I increased tire pressure which definitely took pressure of the steering as the car was behaving nicely. The torque has to be multiplied on the twisting moment of that cage when it was designed for a 155 series tire vs a 185 tire I would think.

I noticed that Super Beetles and the 914 (70-76) used the knuckle joints and no crush tube.  The knuckle solves any slight misalignment and still give "anti-skewer" protection.

Common with the home cobbled speedsters was the wrong orientation of the steering box clamp ( Beetle - Ghia ) this caused a misalignment of the steering column, the assembler would just push up on the column until it made contact with the underside of the dash and bolted it to the CMC FF supplied brackets. The rag joint would take up the mis-alignment, it continually flexed and wore over time. However this also caused lateral stress ...metal fatigue to the crush cage and or welds.

Looks great Mike.

Don't ever want relive that moment after ripping through the mountains to find you had lost steering in the last 50 yards of the trip. Wow!

Still gives me chills.

Just so we can stop coming back to this again and again...

I would hardly call Mike's car "home cobbled". It's thoughtfully and carefully built and well maintained. @MikelB knows what he is doing.

As such, I'm not sure why we're having trouble accepting his explanation. I think those that have not been to the "Tour De Smo" have no idea the stresses we put these cars under in the mountains. It's not cruising up the highway to the show field at a stately pace-- it's tight and technical and "8 to 10/10ths" pace fast for 3 solid days. It's easily the fastest driving I've done on public roads.

Do as you wish-- but I saw enough that it would wave me off relying on a 50+ year old piece of highly stressed expanded metal.

Amen to that Stan! I have a home cobbled speedster and I wish it were as well built as Mike's!

I'm wrenching on the home cobbled mini today. SU carbs are lame.

Ted

Just so we can come back to this again and again:  yes, lots of Speedsters are 'home cobbled' - some are just cobbled better than others... 

@Stan Galat posted:

Just so we can stop coming back to this again and again...

I would hardly call Mike's car "home cobbled". It's thoughtfully and carefully built and well maintained. @MikelB knows what he is doing.

As such, I'm not sure why we're having trouble accepting his explanation. I think those that have not been to the "Tour De Smo" have no idea the stresses we put these cars under in the mountains. It's not cruising up the highway to the show field at a stately pace-- it's tight and technical and "8 to 10/10ths" pace fast for 3 solid days.

---

Do as you wish-- but I saw enough that it would wave me off relying on a 50+ year old piece of highly stressed expanded metal.

I can't agree with this enough. I was there, behind and in front of Mike on all 2 days he romped on his car. There was no "misalignment" on his car, or any cobbling together of any components.

That there highlighted part? EVERY single bit of that. I have driven that hard before a few times on public roads. But the roads where I live aren't that curvy, dangerous, or smooth.

I didn't say or Mike's car was cobbled. I was stating that, many of the speedsters I have done were cobbled by a PO and that is being polite in the description. I'll just read the posts for now on ....

It must be jump on Alan day or something.  The guy has built/rescued enough speedsters to know what he is talking about, so how about we give him a break.

His observation was general, and was not directed at Mike's situation.

FWIW, Alan comments were 100% spot on for my Spyder. I've spent 5 years rebuilding it to Special Editions spec. It was a kit which was "restored" prior to my purchase. I think I've mostly got all the Home Depot plumbing hardware replaced with metric SS.

Ditto to Bob. I did not read Alan's post as a dis on Mike's car. Just a recounting of well-earned expertise.

@Alan Merklin posted:

I didn't say or Mike's car was cobbled. I was stating that, many of the speedsters I have done were cobbled by a PO and that is being polite in the description. I'll just read the posts for now on ....

I'm sure you've seen plenty of cob-jobs in your day. I'm also sure you meant no disrespect to Mike. I sometimes say things that are misconstrued on here, there's no expression or inflection in the written word.

But when you say "home cobbled" in a post by a specific guy about a specific issue......

There are times I stick my foot right in and down my throat. Maybe next time say "I've seen blah blah blah x times, but not in this case".

Cheers.

Friday and Saturday was the fastest I've ever driven my car on those roads. The girls opted out for these days, so the BOYS were letting it all hang out. (This was actually the original plan anyway.) I learned a few things about my car's handling those two days.

The roads we ran are very "backroads". Any other road coming into them were mostly gravel. Throw in some single lane bridges, no tourist traffic, significant elevation changes, and VERY sharp turns.

Stan was off the hook, chasing Danny was a lesson, and Mike was right there the whole time.

IT WAS A FREAKIN BLAST!

I loaded high res so you zoom in.

@Alan Merklin posted:

I didn't say or Mike's car was cobbled. I was stating that, many of the speedsters I have done were cobbled by a PO and that is being polite in the description. I'll just read the posts for now on ....

No you didn't Alan, I didn't read it that way and I think apart from getting the pan joined after cutting the steering shaft alignment is also critical as you explained.

But in all fairness to those that practice the art of cobbling it probably has alot to do with meeting that 40 hour build mark, kind of like the Monday Friday build cars  off of the assembly line in years past.lol.

That was one of the best driving experiences I've had. I brought up the rear in a Cayman S and watched the leaders run away from me in their Spyders and Speedsters.

True, I'm not as likely to hang it out there like I would have 25 years ago, and my skills have diminished, but my car performed admirably and could have done better in the hands of someone else. This was truly a driver's weekend. If you don't like to haul butt for several hours at a stretch, this probably wouldn't be much fun for you.

Still, Carlos, Danny, Stan, Michael, Chris and Lane were very tough to hang with and several times I lost sight of them and had to turn it up a bit past my comfort level.

Lenny is a great right seater and a real gentleman.

Carlos designed a spectacular course!

Anna and I can't wait for next year.

Me neither, Bob.  Hopefully I’ll have something more interesting next year.

You certainly will,  Lane.  That's going to be one sweet coupe.

When I arrived, I was but a novice driver. Not only did I not really put together what the weekend would entail until halfway up the first mountain road, it became pretty obvious that I was clearly the best driver there. I would have blown by everyone if I wasn't stuck behind Mike

Glad you get it sorted Mike.

Aw, man, I (clearly) did not mean to slap anybody down. In both the first thread about Mike's crush cage and then this one, the trend was to talk about "parts not just failing" and misalignment. If you look at both threads, there are multiple posts in this vein. The "cobbled together" part in a thread about Mike's problem is probably why I responded the way I did.

I may be way out in left field, but it read like Mike was the guy getting "piled on". He didn't feel that way, which is great-- no harm, no foul. It's me that must have put two and two together and got 22.

Again-- I'm sorry to offend. I'll just slink back into my hole now.

Regarding the weekend, and it's focus (real driving), and the camaraderie-- all I can say is that as long as there are guys with sportscars who want to drive them with haste and vigor, I'll be there. That those guys are friends (to a man) made this easily the best week in this strange year, and by a wide margin.

That the weekend was held in these unprecedented times made it the tonic I need to face what is trying to pass for a "normal" world. Cars in the mountains in the early autumn are medicine to me.

Mike has his crush-cage situation resolved. Lane will have his new car soon. Danny will have his transaxle regeared by next year. I'll (hopefully) have the "real" engine in my car. I would suspect that Bob and Chris will figure out how to get their plastic-fantastics up to the next event. I can't wait to do it again.

The Tour De Smo (COVID Edition) is over. Long live the Tour De Smo.

And maybe next year more of us will be able to join in...I'd love to be down there in the  Fall (or anytime, really, as part of the SOC group).  I need to see what my car would do on those roads....

You'll find it well worth the drive, Bob.