I started looking at that JDM Racing Motors. Com website and realized that I don't know what the differences are in all the Subaru engine line up. They list EJ . . . . and wrx . . .
I get the SC and the DOHC stuff but that's about all. Can someone "splane" some of this. As you can tell, I'm starting from scratch with 0 knowledge. Oh... how do I determine the HP of all these models ?.............Bruce
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I normally would not lead someone to Wikipedia, however in this case it is MUCH easier than writing it out, so check here for the full list of EJ series motors. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_EJ_engine
My preference for NA motors is the USDM EJ253 and my preference for the turbo motors is the USDM EJ257, just FYI.
If you are running standalone engine management, then it won't matter much what engine you choose, however if you want to run a stock ECU then you'll have to be careful since many of the JDM ECUs can be hard to find and use a JDM specific harness. There are also some components that will cross to USDM parts. For example, you can run a JDM EJ201 with a USDM EJ251 ECU as long as you swap the intake and driver's side cam gear from the USDM motor to the JDM motor. There are many examples like this...
My one word of caution, and one of the main reasons we do not use JDM motors (besides the legality) is... before you pull the trigger, do some homework on simple replacement parts for the particular engine you want. I know I have mentioned it before, but it can be a PAIN to get some JDM specific parts. A good example of this is a 2.5L DOHC motor I used once that needed a new valve cover gasket... simple enough right? Well, NO, Subaru happened to change valve covers gaskets 5 times that year and you need the VIN of the donor vehicle to determine the month of manufacture in order to get the correct part (or buy 5 sets of gaskets from Japan). Its not the end of the world, but still enough of a PITA for me to stay away.
And WRX is a subaru model, not sure how they designate the engine
This JDM WRX EJ205 engine showed up on local Pensacola CL $1450 with ECU, Turbo and partial wiring harness. AVCS is active valve control system or variable valve timing. Apparently, this is world wide WRX engine "after 2001, all WRXs use the EJ205"
http://pensacola.craigslist.org/pts/5947301295.html
AVCS active valve control system, Subaru's variable valve timing
Hi Bruce,
I think you would benefit from buying Jeff Zurschmeide's book: HIGH PERFORMANCE SUBARU BUILDERS GUIDE. For $20 from Amazon, you are introduced to LOTS of Subi information. It's a really good spot to start when you are new to Subi engines. Also lists all the arcane data, such as VIN # meanings, model codes, etc., points out lots of Subi-specific parts. I got lots of use out of mine, and still use it.
Greg tried to simplify engine usage by Subaru, in a post above, but got it wrong. EJ205 engines were used in WRX models until 2004, or 2005, depending on model, when they switched to the 2.5 liter models, namely EJ255, then later the hot rod version, EJ257. There's nothing wrong with the 205, but they are not as prolific as Greg said. This can be important in your search. There are over 25 Subi engine models, but many of them are becoming uncommon, since they haven't been made in over 20 years.
As in all things with cars, there are lots of details that most of us don't really care about. Many of the Subi engines models also have further subdivisions, like version 1 and version 2, etc. One thing you will want to know is how many model years used the block you interested in, and how many of them are still being used. In general terms, if you can find 2 long blocks, one that was used until 1992, and one that was used until 2012, you know which model will have more parts availability. Of course, lots of Subi parts are interchangeable, but it's nice to know if certain model engines had inherent design flaws, like HG problems. There are also lots of Subi sites, such as wwwdotnasiocdotcom that have a wealth of info.
Stock ECU to me makes maintenance sense. 
Jim Kelly posted:There are over 25 Subi engine models, but many of them are becoming uncommon, since they haven't been made in over 20 years.
This, right here, is the one thing that would give me pause before declaring a Subaru mill to be the final solution.
There's no "perfect" engine, IMHO. Everything has strengths and weaknesses.
True, how long has the A/Cooled been around for?
Now, how long has Subie engines been around for? So my guess is in your choice of engines you weigh a lot of factors one is supply of materials but then your not tinkering quite as much with a N/A or a Turbo engine.
A big factor for a 3-5K miles per season car is maintenance and I think it is fair to say that the Subie has it there if not also in the torque dept and the modern engine injection and ECU. Just saying.
You can always get it rebuilt if it fails or go for a complete newly rebuilt engine and it's stock ECU. Same parameters in my books.
Now some guys choose to use a P Flat Six and they too may or may not have weighed all the issues but they are at liberty to choose too.
Finally, maybe in another 20 years we will have to choose another engine platform or a newer engine platform but then that is life.
It is hard to not like the torque of a Subie engine...even if it could always use another 40 hp in normal aspirated mode... And you don't even mind the extra weigh around the middle. .... Of the car that is
Please don't misunderstand, Subaru guys. I know you love your engines, and their strengths have been made pretty clear.
The EJ2X is a great platform-- it's just that parts down the road (especially ECUs) may not be as easy as we think. Most people, even most of us, think in terms of several years of ownership. I plan to own my car (or one substantially like it) until I die. Since some common Subaru engines have not been in production for 20 years, it's not unfair to question whether these platforms will still have the parts availability we've come to expect in another 20.
Strangely, I believe that if the platforms are still relevant in 20 years, it'll be the VW conversions that keep them that way. The tuner crowd is pretty much all turbo now, and are not going to put much more effort into the N/A EJ2X platforms. Subaru itself will have long-since moved on to other things, and will not likely be providing crate engines (ala LS engines) or be doing current EPA certifications for engines they haven't used in a very long time.
The ACVW is far from perfect. But even accepting that east Asian parts of questionable quality make screwing something decent together a challenge-- three different cases (Auto-Linea "bubble-top" aluminum, "AS" magnesium, and Todd Francis' TF-1 aluminum) and about 6 different head castings can all be purchased new. Parts support will continue for the duration of my life.
I'm not saying ACVWs don't take more work (they do). I'm not saying they are better than a Subaru EJ2X motor (they aren't). I'm saying that Subaru EJ2X engines may not be the one-size-fits-all-for-all-time solution to every single question that may arise in this hobby.
They have a place. So do air-cooled motors of all types (Type 1, Type 4, Porsche 6). There's a trade-off for each, and it's good to keep it in mind.
My car is under the knife if Bremen right now. In spring it shall emerge with water running in its veins. Same setup as Tom's....
Stan Galat, '05 IM, 2276, Nowhere, USA posted:Please don't misunderstand, Subaru guys. I know you love your engines, and their strengths have been made pretty clear.
The EJ2X is a great platform-- it's just that parts down the road (especially ECUs) may not be as easy as we think. Most people, even most of us, think in terms of several years of ownership. I plan to own my car (or one substantially like it) until I die. Since some common Subaru engines have not been in production for 20 years, it's not unfair to question whether these platforms will still have the parts availability we've come to expect in another 20.
Strangely, I believe that if the platforms are still relevant in 20 years, it'll be the VW conversions that keep them that way. The tuner crowd is pretty much all turbo now, and are not going to put much more effort into the N/A EJ2X platforms. Subaru itself will have long-since moved on to other things, and will not likely be providing crate engines (ala LS engines) or be doing current EPA certifications for engines they haven't used in a very long time.
The ACVW is far from perfect. But even accepting that east Asian parts of questionable quality make screwing something decent together a challenge-- three different cases (Auto-Linea "bubble-top" aluminum, "AS" magnesium, and Todd Francis' TF-1 aluminum) and about 6 different head castings can all be purchased new. Parts support will continue for the duration of my life.
I'm not saying ACVWs don't take more work (they do). I'm not saying they are better than a Subaru EJ2X motor (they aren't). I'm saying that Subaru EJ2X engines may not be the one-size-fits-all-for-all-time solution to every single question that may arise in this hobby.
They have a place. So do air-cooled motors of all types (Type 1, Type 4, Porsche 6). There's a trade-off for each, and it's good to keep it in mind.
Good points, Stan but at about any time a person could just "dumb down" to my level of Soob if some critical parts become extinct or serious bucks need to be injected to keep everything running. I've got a stand alone Ford Escort ignition system, one center mounted Weber 32/36 carb and no ECU's to play with. My conversion is certainly not at the level that a pro would provide to a customer but it might work for me for as long as I want the car.
We'd still like to do one more MEGA trip out to the US West and then settle down to shorter trips like Key West and back now and then. :-) Hopefully I'll be in some groove where just regular maintenance will get it done. I've had five engines in six years on the way to getting it right.
One of my favourite pics attached...somewhere near the Grand Canyon in 2012. I know....that's almost 5 years ago. Pic taken by a crotch rocket biker from Texas who met us at the Grand Canyon and followed us East for a bit.
I don't do much "cars 'n' coffee" stuff and prefer to keep my hands busy or just drive the car.
I forgot to mention we can get all the JDM motors we want within 10 miles for about $900 CAD per crack. A good base to start with.
While there may be availability of VW parts for a long long time surely Subies can continue for at least the next 20 years to be more than able to supply directly or indirecly replacement parts at least as easy as finding older VW parts I would think should a person need an ECU stock or after market.
In the end it's the drivebility, and the lack of maintenance that sold me on it.
On the other hand the madness might get to me and I could be on engine no 3 or 4 in a few years ... insanity could strike me at any moment
Jim Kelly...I ordered the book from Amazon.
To all you others...Thank You...i just got another drink from the fire hydrant ! I guess i'll have to learn how to swim now.
Carey.... Thank You for taking the time for your input as well. Do you sell these engines that you recommend (NA or Turbo) new, and/or used and what is the cost.
Thinking ahead...maybe that's not the right question but please do your best....Bruce
And at a grand or so for a salvage yard replacement engine (that you could use its own ECU or "go commando" and use a carburetor setup), it is STILL way cheaper in the long run to just trash your faulty engine and go with a "new" salvage engine every so many years for the next 20 or so. After that, you'll probably want to go electric, anyway.
Subaru engines have come a long way in recent years. Both my brother and dad each had new 1978 4WD Subbie wagons - both needed new heads within first 2 years. Son had used 1996 2.5 DOHC 2.5L - known to have head/head gasket and timing belt issues. It got 16-18 mpg. Was wrecked before I could change timing belts - but next owner had head gasket issues. It did have lots of miles on it. I think a newer Subaru engine could easily go 150-200k miles if maintained. That's more than a lifetime for a Speedster owner.
The lady who cuts my hair had an outback that she finally parted with after over 275,000 miles. All sh ever had done was the timing belt, twice. She upgraded to an Outback, but got that monster, flat 6-cyl engine. Same deal - now has over 120,000 on it and just got the belts changed, although she says she's going through a quart of oil every 1,800-2,000 miles (which Subaru says is "normal").
Yeah funny how they seem to have reports of a higher level of oil consumption and the company thinks that is normal when newer cars ie VW go 7000 miles no oil consumption ... go figure.
