Sway bar

While lubricating the front beam in my VS (read "Front beam lube" post), I've noticed that the car doesn't have a sway bar as all stock VW's have. Is it that the infamous bumper brackets that are fastened to the front beam prevent the use of the sway bar? Any of you have front sway bars on your VS (or any, for that matter) Speedster? How would they be mounted considering this clearance problem? Thanks!

I have mine mounted upside down.

Yep; I was checking previous posts and I've seen that. I've also seen that you can get a Sway-a-Way and mount it as forward as it will go to clear the bumper brackets. I'll check on those options with my VW shop.

Ricardo,

I just bought a "Lowered Sway Bar" from Empi and even upside down, it still comes in contact with the Bumper bracket Mounts.(88 CMC on 69 Pan)

Its real "Close" when attempting to mount but it still comes in contact with the forward mounts that extend from the Front Torsion Bar Tube/brackets.

It appears the only method of mounting the Empi Bar is to modify/releave the front bumper mounts that extend forward.

The Empi Bar is 3/4" and "Poly-Eurothane" brackets/mounts.

Good Luck; I'll make a post regarding the final installation.

Good Luck,

Jack Blake

Ricardo:

A bunch of us have modified our front bumper mounts to clear the sway bar after it's installed. I think my pictures are still up under nichols1, or you can browse the photo section to see what others have done (I think I got my ideas from Glenn Pablo).

It's not a hard mod, but there's the usual cutting and welding involved.

Here are photos of the mods I made to bumper brackets when adding a sway bar to my VS Speedster.


Greg B

I can't believe that VS sells their cars with no anti-sway bars on the front. My car was a death trap when I bought it.

The combination of no front bar and those slippery Kelly 165 metric tires, is asking for trouble.

I have mine mounted upside down as well. The only time it contacts the
bumper mounts is when I jack the front end up off the ground and only then the bar rests on the bumper mounts. No big deal.

BD

Greg/ Eric,
Can one of you post a pic of the sway bar clamps ( A pic from an angle showing the clamps on the arms and sway bar)...curious to see how they are able to set as you have them ...for some reason I have trouble installing these.
Many thanks .... Alan M

Bill; is yours the regular stock one or the 3/4" one?

I will try to remember when I get home to take a picture.

God bless the anti-sway bar. With no progressive camber gain on the front tires during cornering, the next best thing is to just eliminate front body roll and thereby keep both tires square to the road surface for max traction. A 3/4 inch anti sway bar works admirably. To clear the front bumper supports, purchase two six inch lengths of square tubing, same size and wall as the bumper supports. Mark your bumper supports where you need to cut them for clearance. Weld your new tubing on top of the existing support, and bridging the cut you require. Cut out the original support and WALLA . . install the bar as designed (with the part parallel to the front beam kicking up). Installing with the kick pointing down can interfere with the shock tower metal, depending how how your vehicle was lowered. If you are deeply concerned about loosing front bumper support strength by making this modification, I sugggest you stick with your current SUV for sporting driving.

Alan,
My sway bar is the 19MM one for lowered beams. They say you can use the stock rubbers and clamps... but it's a reeeeeeal tight squeeze.
or
You can use the urethane mounts and the aftermarket clamps.
The after market clamps are just a superwide hose clamp.
So... That's sorta what I used. I used (3 on each end) regular hose clamps.

Greg B

Gregg, Keep an eye on those regular hose clamps. I have seen them break when used for mechanical connections. Failure usually occurs in the area where the sheet metal is crimped around the drive worm gear. It kinda unfolds and then the gear falls out. Also, the gear itself is frequently NOT stainless and rusts badly causing failure.
Just keep an eye on them.

I suppose then that the bar I need to get is the lowered variety right?

Ricardo: Mine is for a reg. beetle. I don't know how it is now, but no one had any bars of the lowered variety. All were out of stock. I bought the clamp kit to mount it. While up on the stands, I had to put a floorjack under each tire to raise the arms a tad to mount the bar(upside down) due to the above mentioned clearance with the bumper mounts.The only time it hits the mounts is when the suspension is hanging when on jack stands. On the ground the bar hangs 3 inches or so below the bumper brackets.

BD

Hey Gang; bought the lowered 3/4" Sway-a-way and bushing/clamp set from Bugpack. Now I need to modify the bumper brackets to install it finally. I've seen the pictures some of you have posted here but have reservations in the sense that somehow the modified brackets look weaker. I need to find alternative bracing. Any ideas?

I used the straight "Sway-Away" front anti roll bar. 3/4". No clearence problems.

Anybody try a rear swaybar for a swing axle type car?
J-P

J-P: What you want for a swing-arm rear end is a "Camber Compensator" which is basically a spring leaf that attaches across the frame and goes between the wheels under the transaxle. It performs similar to a sway bar, but the geometry is slightly different.

Once installed, they work pretty well, or at least the few I used to run on dune buggies worked well in autocrosses. They tend to reduce body roll and make the rear end flatter in the curves by making the wheels stay more parallel to each other, rather than allowing them to swing down (and thereby pitch "in" at the bottoms). They're worth the money/effort to put them in.

Eric; how did you specify your Sway-a-Way bar? Is it a stock version? The one I bought is lowered version and it bends upward but the stock VW's also bend upward; I haven't seen a straight version before. I'm planning to install it next weekend but the less I have to modify the bumper brackets the better and your looks neat. How close is it to the ground? Does it hit bumps, etc. a lot?

Greetings;
Mine is 1993 C.A.R. from Advanced Plastics Int Corp on a 1971 pan with adjustable front torsion bar suspension. It had the stabilizer bar mounted upside down, the ride was jumpy and rough until I installed it correctly. Still have to mount the brackets, u-bolts and bumpers... this subject is getting interesting!

Ahhh, I remember the SWAY BAR. A strip joint in Carlisle where East Coast Bruce was indulging in egg sandwiches.... ah the memories, short term but there nonetheless.

He still owes me a hand full of dollar bills he kept borrowing for one reason .........or another :)

Hola JJ! Hopefully we'll find out how it goes this next weekend when we try to install it....

I bought the bar from JC Whitney. The bar does not have a bend going up. It does hang low if I lower the front too much, using the beam adjusters.

Talking about beam adjusters; has anyone noticed that VS cars only have one beam adjuster instead of the two I've seen forever? Is it fine to do it like that or what?

Yeah, having a beam adjuster on just one front beam is OK - it makes it kind-of like a progressive spring rate.

As the adjustable bar is adjusted lower, it makes the un-adjusted one wind up a bit more trying to hold the car up, and then the adjusted one starts to work as the suspension gets down to the adjuster's level. Overall, it tends to make the suspension feel a bit softer and less harsh, as opposed to the dual adjuster versions.

Thanks for the lesson Gord! I knew you'd come through! I really appreciate it as I'm learning as we go.

I believe that the single adjuster will pose a problem when I install the lowered spindles. I will have to stiffen the suspension to get the correct height. If I had two adjusters I could raise just one adjuster and leave the other softer. This would give me full control of stiffness and height.

Try it with one first - you might be pleasently surprised.

An update: JJR and myself installed Sway-a-Ways with Bugpack clamps and urethane bushings for lowered cars on both our Speedsters. We're working on getting the bumper mounting brackets modified to clear the sway bars. Will report back when done.

Hi Rick
I was observing the pix posted and just had the thought of what happens when you hit a deep bump, would the sway bay touch the bottom of the modified lower beam? Well Iguess it works for nicols it will for us. Im seeing the welder tomorrow, lets see what happens, I cant wait for the weekend... finally front bumper and looking good

Im sorry... Greg's pix ... thanks

JJ: I don't think it'll be a problem. We need to be certain that there's enough clearance for the bar when the car is jacked up though, although I don't think that's such a big deal.....Left you an email; call me if you need to...

Allrighty BCNU on the weekend...

JJ got the brackets back from the shop. We prepped them for paint and painted them last night with some Rust Oleum. I installed them this afternoon and drove the car with the sway bar for the first time. There's a difference in feel: the car rides smoother and feels more stable as compared to the way it did before. After doing this I wonder why doesn't Kirk re-engineer the front brackets so that he can leave in the sway bar (I guess even the stock VW would be acceptable as compared to none). That way, the cars would handle better and be less dangerous to use.

Thanks Greg & Rick - Success!

It looks great!! Congrats & thanks for your help JJ! Let's see if we can get together next weekend to try the oil temp gauge Steve lent me and check the oil temp on our cars. I don't want to keep it for too long.