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I live in Southern Ca. so I took the opportunity to go and tour Vintage and JPS last week.

These are just my opinions and observations.

Both Kirk and John are great gentelmen and they both seem to operate well run businesses and I found both to be very easy to talk to.








Vintage is clearly a larger operation and seemed to be setup better for "production". This can be seen in the organization and fairly tiddy shop. Kirk was very busy but took the time to show me around and answer my questions and to educate. I liked the fact that Vintage replaces all the panels in the floor pans. I was not that impressed with what I read as a common complaint with Vintage was the paint jobs. I think they could use a little more finish sanding and perhaps another coat of paint. Overall I think Kirk produces a good product at a good price.








JPS appeared to be more of a hotrod shop that has found itself making Speedsters. John seems to be very flexible and will "do whatever you desire". While his shop had less of a "production" feel and more of a less tidy old autoshop vibe. His cars seem to be works of art. He freely admits that he gets his bodies from Kirk. John's paint from what I saw is superior to that of Vintage. He described the process and I saw a couple of finished cars that were very nice paint jobs. I don't think JPS takes the time to refresh the Pans as nice as vintage does however and John will only replace the floor pans if they are rusted. He stated that the older German steel is much higher quality than the new steel, which may be true. I don't know, but what I do know is I liked the way Vintage had the pan nicely painted and sharp.

I took some digital pictures of both places but JPS is so much smaller I didn't have a lot to take pictures of. At JPS they were building a speedster and I got to see how they put on the dash and they also had a sharp silver Speedster in for it's 100 mile "tighten everything" check up. I arrived at Vintage around lunch time so most of the workers were out of the shop.

I have posted pictures in the file area under two folders.

Vintage Tour
JPS Tour


James Abella
Original Post

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I live in Southern Ca. so I took the opportunity to go and tour Vintage and JPS last week.

These are just my opinions and observations.

Both Kirk and John are great gentelmen and they both seem to operate well run businesses and I found both to be very easy to talk to.








Vintage is clearly a larger operation and seemed to be setup better for "production". This can be seen in the organization and fairly tiddy shop. Kirk was very busy but took the time to show me around and answer my questions and to educate. I liked the fact that Vintage replaces all the panels in the floor pans. I was not that impressed with what I read as a common complaint with Vintage was the paint jobs. I think they could use a little more finish sanding and perhaps another coat of paint. Overall I think Kirk produces a good product at a good price.








JPS appeared to be more of a hotrod shop that has found itself making Speedsters. John seems to be very flexible and will "do whatever you desire". While his shop had less of a "production" feel and more of a less tidy old autoshop vibe. His cars seem to be works of art. He freely admits that he gets his bodies from Kirk. John's paint from what I saw is superior to that of Vintage. He described the process and I saw a couple of finished cars that were very nice paint jobs. I don't think JPS takes the time to refresh the Pans as nice as vintage does however and John will only replace the floor pans if they are rusted. He stated that the older German steel is much higher quality than the new steel, which may be true. I don't know, but what I do know is I liked the way Vintage had the pan nicely painted and sharp.

I took some digital pictures of both places but JPS is so much smaller I didn't have a lot to take pictures of. At JPS they were building a speedster and I got to see how they put on the dash and they also had a sharp silver Speedster in for it's 100 mile "tighten everything" check up. I arrived at Vintage around lunch time so most of the workers were out of the shop.

I have posted pictures in the file area under two folders.

Vintage Tour
JPS Tour


James Abella
Now, if you can, fly to Vancouver and take a tour of Intermeccanica's operation. Intermeccanicas bodies are made by a fiberglass specialty company using ISO resins to a specific catalyst ratio and IM's molds. This is a carefully controlled chopper gun layup as opposed to hand layup with cloth and mat. Correct chopper gun layup can be stronger and lighter than most hand laid glass cloth/mat layups because of the multi-directional fibre orientation. ISO resins are stronger and more resistant to moisture and solvents (fibreglass layups can be hydroscopic), and controlling the catalyst ratio gives best resin cure properties and adds to strength.

The bodies and related body parts are then heat cured to eliminate shrinkage. Then the bodies are hand and machine block sanded for 150 hours or more as paint prep. IM then sends the body/chassis assembly outside for painting to a local, very high quality paint shop which uses Glasurite paints exclusively on IM's.

IM also has their upholstery done by another local high quality. Henry feels that this outside approach offers the best finished product, e.g., use pros for what they do well instead of trying to do everything yourself. This is just another reason why IM quality is so high and price is thus higher.

IM makes the tube frames, fits the body to the frame, and finally installs transaxle, engine, suspension, brake components, transaxle, windshield, interior components, top, auxilliary systems, and trim. Then they test drive each car for a couple of hundred miles to shake out and correct any minor problems.
(Message Edited 7/31/2003 5:41:54 PM)
Just an observation and curiosity.....many people visit JPS and VS and then take some time and order the car best suited for their budget and needs, but if you add in a visit to IM they seem to always order IM.......makes you think...has anyone gone to see IM and then decided to go buy someone elses replica???
No, I haven't made a decision but I would be happy with either car. I was really impressed with the heavy duty framing that goes into place. I wasn't expecting that, I asked both John and Kirk about how there Speedster fair in wrecks and it sounds like they hold up pretty well. You have a pretty heavy duty steel frame surrounding you. The biggest problem I saw would be an SUV coming over the top which I don't think any of the makers can protect you from that.

Both shops were totally open to me to roam around. Neither minded me taking pictures of whatever I wanted. Yes those pans outside where just freshly stripped. Kirk had half a dozen inside and ready for assembly.






I am planning to try and make the So. Cal meet this weekend in Camarillo and will hopefully get to see some other builds.

As far as which car for me, I would feel comfortable with either. I seem to find some beautiful Vintage speedsters around here for sale with less than 5000 miles on them priced from 10-13 so for me I think I will likely go for one of those.

James
James,

Don't rule out the new Beck Speedsters or IM. There's also a high dollar first gen IM Speedster on E-bay (silver car) that may be nearly as good as any JPS/VS except... well, I'm not sure. Heck it may be more bang for the buck than ANY brand turn-key you can buy right now. I would definitely check it out. Pics are on Mulholland so I assume it's in the LA area. This car turns me on for the price. All things being based on getting a great car for minimal bucks! The owner sounds quite a buff based on his ad.

Jim Ward
(Message Edited 8/1/2003 12:37:03 AM)
A great paint job isn't what VS is known for but consider this...Kirk could easily put a great prep and paint and make you pay for a $25,000 car. In other threads you will note that there is much talk about rock or pebble nicks and damage to the front end of these cars, and the use of bras. I would hate to pay $5000 for a great paint job only to be ruined by road debris a few months down the line. I opt for the so-so paint that you can redo every 2-3 years if so desired.




Paint issues and concerns

I was taught by watching and asking questions by what I consider some of the best "finish artists" I've done quite a few paint jobs on fiberglass i.e Speedsters etc so I'll throw in my two cents worth

First and most importantly is surface prep this includes detecting any air bubbles that may be hidden under a gelcoat finish later to rise up to the occasion...easy to find by lightly tapping on the entire surface in a grid fashion as to not miss an area and listening for a hollow / dull difference, once found it needs to be opened and filled. Followed by two good coats of epoxy primer, then sanded for any remaining imperfections to show themselves. Urethane is the best overall paint (yep I'll get replys to this one !) as by adding a third coat it can be 1000 sanded followed by 1500 sanding and a light machine buff. The final step is to hand polish with 3M swirl remover that makes it come out as a beautiful show finish. This process does not entail excessive man hours and should a road rash occur it can be very easily blended

Alan M
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