Vintage Pre A Coupe Build

That looks like a fantastic start to a fun journey!  I look forward to following this thread to seeing your progress.  

I agree about your comments on Greg Leach; I’ve had but a few conversations with him but I cant say enough!  He’s a wonderful source of information and a great contact to have while building, buying, or modifying a Speedster!

Congratulations! I assume that air conditioning is part of the plan. Living in the Florida Panhandle, I can't imagine a coupe without it, particularly further south.

Look forward to the thread!

Very cool, Stephen. Are the wheels aluminum Vintage 190's? Do you know what color it will be, and what you'll put in it for an engine?

@Panhandle Bob Yes, Sir... Believe it or not my speedster has air in it now... I am debating to just remove the air from it and install in the coupe as it really not necessary in the speedster.  In stop and go traffic it's been nice with the full taneau cover on.  

@ALB  Yes, had Greg put some Vintage 190s on for the trip to FL. Pulling them off first thing and throwing on some used vw wide fives I have in the shop for rolling it around and painting.   Motor will be aircooled vw and the aquamarine metallic is in the lead for paint but not locked in yet...

Sooo.......what size aircooled VW watchwinder are you thinking about?

I like it, I like it, did I say I like it

AllnuttS posted:

@ALB  Yes, had Greg put some Vintage 190s on for the trip to FL. Pulling them off first thing and throwing on some used vw wide fives I have in the shop for rolling it around and painting.   Motor will be aircooled vw and the aquamarine metallic is in the lead for paint but not locked in yet...

Good plan. Do you have any idea how big (and what state of tune) you'd like to go with the engine?

Love the idea of beehives...

Hey Al, How did I know that question was coming. Then it opens up cam size, and large thread of spec questions .  I haven't made a final call. I have a spare/backup 1600 on a test bench that I will use for set up.  I tend go with a mild 1835cc reliable cruiser with a nice sounding exhaust but I know other will always say bigger!  

@Bob: IM S6,  Total agree!  No offense to my teardrop speedie but I am looking forward to the cool look of beehives. 

AllnuttS posted:

Hey Al, How did I know that question was coming. Then it opens up cam size, and large thread of spec questions .  I haven't made a final call. I have a spare/backup 1600 on a test bench that I will use for set up.  I tend go with a mild 1835cc reliable cruiser with a nice sounding exhaust but I know other will always say bigger!  

If you've been around here (and paying attention) for any length of time (and you've certainly been hanging out here long enough), of course you knew I'd ask! And there's nothing wrong with that plan, Stephen. It'll be a fun, drive anywhere, any time car. Look out, though, first time you go north for the September drive and get left behind by Stan, Carlos and the rest of the gang; you may start thinking that stroking it (just a little) and (you know, just a little more) breathing might not be such a bad idea. Then next trip (after talking with Uncle Stan) you'll realize close gears and a 5th gear are so essential for this type of driving! This hobby/obsession (which it is, I know not- you decide! It's not called THE MADNESS for nothing...)  is such a slippery slope. Al

Either a larger engine, or drill more holes...  

Bob: IM S6 posted:

Either a larger engine, or drill more holes...  

Of course, as my illustrious colleague has pointed out, another way to make it faster is to make it lighter. It just takes time. Lots and lots (and lots and lots!) of time. And if you start making things out of aluminum or titanium (to feed the "everything's gotta be lighter" jones) you could be spending some money too. I have managed to stay away from that part of it, although rear axle bearing covers out of aluminum (over 60% weight saving)

 https://www.csp-shop.com/en/br...311-113a-27945c.html

and rear axle castle nuts out of titanium (almost 40% weight saving- couldn't find them, but I know they're out there!) would just be stupid cool...

Al - surprised you haven't discovered carbon fiber yet!  You could make an entire replica out of it.

In the Miata world - they saved 250# with the 2016 MX-5 ND over the 2015 NC car.  That's a lot when you consider it has all the modern features folks expect.  They even went from 5 lug to 4 lug wheel nuts to save a gram or 2.

WOLFGANG posted:

Al - surprised you haven't discovered carbon fiber yet!  You could make an entire replica out of it.

I do have experience with fiberglass, Greg, but I've never had the opportunity to work with cf. Unless you redid the whole body I don't think there's too much you could do. I don't think it's worthwhile to do a front hood (as I've said before, I don't think the front of the car is the first place to be removing weight, as it will make the front/rear weight bias even worse). Re-doing the body shell would mean starting from scratch, and the body I have has been in the garage long enough already. A carbon fiber engine lid would be cool, but I'm guessing the weight loss would only be about 5 lbs, so unless I could do it myself it wouldn't be worth it.

Although, if I redid the whole body I could start with an aluminum sub-frame, and I'll bet that between the 2 (al frame and cf shell) the car would drop 150 lbs! Now wouldn't that be cool... Al

AllnuttS posted:

 Happy Thanksgiving All!  I have enjoyed the wealth of knowledge imparted by so many members and hope to join some gatherings soon, to meet some of you in person.  Thanks to Brian's @*LongFella response to a posting and PMs quite a ways back on coupe builders, I have a new Vintage Motorcars project in my garage.  Greg has been great to work with and has been very responsive to my many questions as I was looking to balance having a project that I could do as much work as possible in building but made sense to ship From CA to FL.  I ended up with a rolling 1955 Pre-A coupe, with just enough to chassis under it to make it transportable by truck and not crate.  I know nothing happens without pics on this site so here is one to start the thread.  I look forward to posting more information, pics and progress as the build is completed. I hope many of you will follow, lend your advice and encouragement.  Brian's coupe is a bit further along than mine as he is in paint already, so I am definitely following his.  

Let the madness continue as I enjoy my silver VS and wrench on the wallet and coupe ,

Stephen

Glad I was able to help! Looking forward to how the coupe turns out

So I was able to get a little bit of time on the coupe this weekend after eating some turkey and hauling out all of the Christmas decorations out of the workshop and up to the house.  Pulled the vintage 190s off to be stored while body prep and paint is being completed.  I have a set of wide-5 smoothies to roll it around as needed. Greg graciously threw in a set of old VW drums to make it a roller.  I began pulling this apart to install disc brakes, lines etc.  just waiting on a few parts.  Picked up the square tubing today to notch the front bumper brackets to clear the new sway bar.  As I continue to roll around and under,  I am more than happy with quality of work from Greg's team. 

They do fine work at VM, don't they?

@AllnuttS- Just so you know, Stephen, the adjustable spring plates will add 6-8 lbs of extra and unnecessary weight to the rear of your car. I know the idea of fine tuning or later on changing the rear ride height without having to take it all apart to re-set the torsion bars is attractive (I'm going through this right now- this week I'll be doing it for the 3rd time in the last month and a half!) but the fact of the matter is once you decide on ride height you'll probably never look at it again. Spring plates are suspension pieces so are sprung weight (exactly where you don't want the car to be heavier, if at all possible) and they've burned up the better part of  a hundred dollar bill of your hard earned money. _{(the thread can go back to it's regular programming now)}

Drill some holes in anything on the car that isn't already filled with holes. That is the answer!

You know, if you never get in it, you are keeping a lot of weight from it as well.

ALB posted:

... the fact of the matter is once you decide on ride height you'll probably never look at it again. 

I've found this to be not necessarily true.

Driving around town takes one height adjustment, driving loaded across several state lines or time-zones requires something else.

I appreciate the concern for unsprung weight, but at least the adjustable spring plates (which I don't have, because IMs are height adjustable by means of grub-screws on the torsion bars) are not rotating unsprung weight.

If I had a pan car, or a car without the grub screws, I'd probably use them.

Al's advice is excellent for serious racers. 

Appreciate the feedback...I have the ajustable plates on my VS and liked them. As Edsnova noted, I'm not looking to race.  If anything, I need to add weight in the front based on my speedster. 

ALB posted:

@AllnuttS- Just so you know, Stephen, the adjustable spring plates will add 6-8 lbs of extra and unnecessary weight to the rear of your car. I know the idea of fine tuning or later on changing the rear ride height without having to take it all apart to re-set the torsion bars is attractive (I'm going through this right now- this week I'll be doing it for the 3rd time in the last month and a half!) but the fact of the matter is once you decide on ride height you'll probably never look at it again. Spring plates are suspension pieces so are sprung weight (exactly where you don't want the car to be heavier, if at all possible) and they've burned up the better part of  a hundred dollar bill of your hard earned money. _{(the thread can go back to it's regular programming now)}

I'm going to respectfully disagree on this one. Saving a couple pounds does not offset the adjustability. Dialing your car in via corner weighting is essential for on-limit and hi-speed side-to-side response. The only way to corner weight a VW-based car is via the rear axle, whether adjustable spring-plates(almost all Speedsters and Spyders) or coilovers(my Spyder). In other words, the car does the same thing whether you turn left or right when properly corner-weighted. 

It means a lot near or at the limit. If you toodle around it won't matter. But it does matter to me and a few others like me.

Not a ton of progress.   Spent some time cleaning interior to begin installing sound deading mat.  Added some extra silicone around the pan and body mating areas.  It was already sealed really well.  See pics. The first one is at the tunnel where the vin is stamped on pan.  No light can be seen.  2nd photo is from underneath.  I know there has been many notes about checking this area for it's a main case for wet floor boards.  

There is enough steel running under the rear deck to tie in a nice roll bar system with harness tabs.  How many holes would I have to drill to offset this added weight. 

Also drilled for a pin to hold engine lid up and disassembled the door frames and glass so they didn't get damaged.  

Hi All,

It's been awhile since I've posted an update.  With the holidays, holiday travel, business travel and building a new house (with contractor), it's been a bit crazy lately.  Fortunately, it's all good stuff. I have been tinkering every chance I get.

 As you know, I ordered the project as a roller from Greg.  He threw on some old drums to mount the vintage 190s, so finishing up the brakes is one of the first major projects.  I decided on using drum brakes in rear so I started pulling the backing plates and wide five drums off an old 66 vw pan I had.  36mm nuts were no problems with the right tools but one drum was major stuck on the splines and I ended up ordering a puller on-line to assist removal. See first pic.  

Even though time in the shop was limited, time on the interweb ordering parts wasn't.  My kind of Black Friday shopping.   Everything has arrived to finish up the rear brakes including German swingaxle seals, new e-brake cables and shortening kit. Also received a package from Anna Clause at Vintage with hood prop rod, new fuel tank, horn grilles, front lights and couple other parts.  Gauges and rear beehives are on back order.  

After getting everything off the old pan and moving it back out of the shop, I was able to get one side cleaned up, backing plate painted and reassembled.  The plan is to get the other side finished next week and everything installed on rear along with new shocks.  This includes setting up the new e-brake handle and shortening the cables.   Then on to the front brakes, steering stabilizer and drilling holes to mount tank and hood rod. 

I hoped to get more done on the coupe this weekend but I also had to seal/finish a beautiful reclaimed sinker cypress mantle that my wife picked out from our local sawmill for the new house. The mason is finishing up the fireplace this week and needs to grout around it.  (included pics).

My daughter and I also had a father/daughter date to go see the new Transformers Bumblebee movie.  I have to take every chance I can to spend time with my middle schooler while she still wants to hangout with her dear old dad.  She still likes to tinker with me in the garage on occasion.  Last pic is of her helping me clean up the old vw pan.  They grow up so quick... I say this as I just hugged my college junior as he headed back to school from being home for winter break.  He starts back to classed tomorrow morning. 

Happy New Year Everyone! 

Stephen

The most important thing I see here is you and your daughter spending time on the build !    Years ago I taught Auto Shop at a facility for "At Risk Youth", it was Co Ed group and we had three girls in the shop class. One went on to being a certified GM mechanic and the last I knew she was the lead Tech at a Chevy dealer

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Didn't see this before, so here goes-

@AllnuttS said- "There is enough steel running under the rear deck to tie in a nice roll bar system with harness tabs.  How many holes would I have to drill to offset this added weight."

Having a little experience recently with drilling holes to remove weight I'd say about 8-10,000 to compensate for a roll bar and supports (I have come to the conclusion that I will probably not completely offset the added weight of a roll bar, no matter how many holes I drill!)

Regarding using 5x205 drums on the back of your car- you can upgrade to 40 mm (later, the shoes on your car right now are 30 mm wide) shoes, which I've been told makes a marked difference in braking. If this interests you, pm me and I'll tell you how to do it. It's pretty easy. Al  

@AllnuttS, if you haven't met Yoda (@ALB) we believe the poor guy has had a few "lightening holes" drilled in his skull.  Just sayin'... 

Some say he "whistles in the wind" when going down the road!

@Lane Anderson, Holes or not... @ALB asks some good questions and provides good feedback.      Hope to post some progress soon.  Just received CO on the new house and working on the move.   Lots of new parts still in the boxes from Greg. 

Oh yeah, Al is smarter than we give him credit for in public.  We just don't want it to go to his head.