Hi everybody,
I just talked to Kirk from Vintage Speedsters.
I said that he can install a CB Performance engine
for my Speedster, however he was a little scared
about it because CB uses Weber Carburetors.
He said that Webers catch on fire and that freaks
him out a little bit. Any thoughts on that?
Thank you for your input.
Blasco.
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There are thousands of VW's (and a whole pile of European cars which came with them originally) with dual Weber carb kits running around, and like every other car on the planet, engine fires only happen when the install isn't right or maintenance isn't kept up. Kirk's full of it.
Well, when fuel lines are ran through sheet metal with no rubber grommets bad things do happen��
Also, using a fuel filter helps out greatly with plugged idle jets�� A plugged idle jet is the #1 reason for carb fires. Never drive your car if the engine is idling rough/backfiring at idle.
You probably should check this out first but I believe Kirk is now using
Kadron Solex 44 Carbs
Available through; http://www.shop.kaddieshack.co...rburetor-Kits_c3.htm
http://www-cartersaircooled-co...rons-carburetor-kits
I've seen thousands of Weber IDFs installed on VW engines and have never heard of issues to them catching fire. And if there was a fire, it was most likely to do errors of the installer.
Cheap fuel line
Plastic Tee
No clamps
I've had Weber IDAs for 10 years and never had a problem. Before that I had Dellorto since 1978.
For a performance engine you do not want to use Kadrons. They are single barrel and you just get more power and tuning from dual throat carbs.
BullS#it alarm is going off!
Wow. It's getting deep in here.
Kirk has a lot of opinions, this doesn't sound like him to me.
Flag ....on the play
out of bounds!
Wondering if Kirk is thinking of a different carb manufacture and did not here Webers?
Pat Downs and Glenn Ring - Many thanks, great advice.
Oh and Pat, expect a call from me tomorrow.
Wolf, Stan, Alan, and Will - Gentlemen, I respect your advice. After all the due diligence I've done the past few months, this newby would have been the first to assume that Kirk was only looking out for (both Blanco and) me when he recommended not installing Weber's for fear of possible fire issues.
whoa: KIRK SAID WHAT? noooooooo way!! ummmm I think this was a one time incident.. Pat builds a great motor!! I can vouch for that!!
tebs
Teby S posted:whoa: KIRK SAID WHAT? noooooooo way!! ummmm I think this was a one time incident.. Pat builds a great motor!! I can vouch for that!!
tebs
Tebs,
I would like to say something. When I talked to Kirk about building my 2110cc engine I told him I wanted Weber's installed, but at no time did we ever discuss Pat Downs. We only talked about Kirk's fear of Weber carb "fire" issues.
Cliff
Oh sorry Cliff I thought you were having CB build you a 2110...
I get confused on these posts
Tebs
Cliff and Blasco (first name?)- If you enjoy the idea of roaring around in your car at all (if it will be used for more than just going for ice cream or down to the beach) think seriously about a stroker engine (bigger than 2 liters). These cars are just so much more fun when there's a little more power on tap. You don't have to use it all the time, but just knowing it's there when you want it...
Al
Hello ALB,
Oh I'm definitely going to get a 2110 cc engine. The problem I'm faced with now is trying to figure out just who should be the one to build it, and can it be purchased through VS.
I had hoped to firm the whole deal up yesterday (Monday). . . but it should get resolved soon.
Anyway, I appreciate the tip.
cp 
You can have any builders motor you want to put in it! You are the buyer...
Cliff, choosing an engine builder may be the most important part of this whole process. Take your time and make sure you're asking all the important questions. Don't let anyone rush you, and don't hurry yourself through this.
A good builder will have a lot of questions for you - what are your expectations, what are your driving habits, where do you live, what's the climate like where you intend to drive, etc, etc. And make sure they know the engine's going into a Speedster - the tight engine bay makes different demands on an engine than a bug or dune buggy.
If the builder doesn't have time to discuss all of this at length, find one who does. There are some well-known builders with national reputations who will do a fine job, but there are lots of local builders who do quality work, too, and who choose to run lower-volume and lower-profile operations.
After finding out how you will use the engine, the builder should discuss at length exactly which parts he'll be using and why he's suggesting each one. Make sure you understand the options.
The builder and Kirk should be able to work out how the engine will be installed - either at Kirk's shop or the engine builder's. And everyone should be clear on who's responsible for what after the sale.
Spending the time it takes to do this right can be frustrating when you're anxious to be in the car and driving, but you will thank yourself a thousand times down the road.
theres bad blood between kirk and pat,, I ordered a 2232 stroker from Roland, great engine, get a 125 cam if you dare.
barncobob posted:theres bad blood between kirk and pat,, I ordered a 2232 stroker from Roland, great engine, get a 125 cam if you dare.
That's too bad because Pat is one of the top 5 builders.
Bob, I'm new here, who is Roland?
Alot of speculation...Webers or any carbs don't catch fire without a cause.....leaks...hoses...clamps...timing.....valves....out of adjustment and more are contributing factors.
barncobob posted:theres bad blood between kirk and pat,, I ordered a 2232 stroker from Roland, great engine, get a 125 cam if you dare.
Are you running an Engle W125? That thing must go like a raped ape! So it's a 2332- carbs? heads? exhaust? compression? Are you running 1.1 or 1.25 rockers? At what rpm does power "really" start? How high does it rev? What's driveability in the bottom end/lower midrange like? I once ran a W125 in a 1750 and have always thought that it would make a great street cam in a stroker engine, as the short stroke (or lack of displacement) didn't give it enough torque in a full weight street bug (2,000 lbs) to make up for cam duration. It was perfectly fine in the bottom end/lower midrange (drove like a stocker in traffic), but (as I said earlier) a healthy increase in stroke (displacement) would have made it a fantastic street engine (think HUGE evil laugh here!) .
Cliff- a 2110 is a great choice- enough displacement to have a big flat torque curve (so important for 95% of our driving!), and with some properly ported 40x35 heads, 44IDF's (or HPMX's), 1 5/8" exhaust, and a cam/rocker combo that will take it to 6,000 rpm (keeping the redline fairly low will keep it trouble free) it will be a blast to drive! As mentioned, Pat Downs builds a great engine, but there are others around as well. Roland (Rascon?) is another California engine builder that apparently builds some nice engines. Al
Hummm, unfortunately the website for Rascon Motorsports in Huntington Beach, CA is not up and running.
If you're looking for a SoCal builder, talk to Gary Berg. He's one of the top 5 and built my Berg 5 tranny.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/cla...etail.php?id=1027343
Give a call 808-640-6799
E-mail: garyvwguy@hotmail.com
Glenn's right- Gary Berg would be a great choice as well!
cant remember much about engine from Roland,,this was years ago...it did rev extremely fast,,i had to get a heavy duty special fan in doghouse as the stock one would go from square hole to rounded hole, couldn't keep up with engine rpms so quick.
kirk might know where roland is or isnt
barncobob posted:cant remember much about engine from Roland,,this was years ago...it did rev extremely fast,,i had to get a heavy duty special fan in doghouse as the stock one would go from square hole to rounded hole, couldn't keep up with engine rpms so quick.
Not sure what you mean?
I have a stock VW fan that was tig welded and balanced. The reason for welding so the fan doesn't explode when quickly accelerated.
The only way the hole will round out is if you don't torque the 36mm nut correctly.
Alb:
Since my 2,110 has an Engle 125 in it I thought I might answer some of your questions:
So it's a 2,110 with a CB forged crank, Dell 40mm carbs, CB intakes hand-opened and matched to the head oval ports, 044 MOFOCO heads (touch-up porting done by me and flowed on a friends flow-bench but I would have to look up the valve sizes) and a Berg "dual quiet pack" 932 extractor, 1-1/2" zoomies, I think (not sure). I'm running 1.1 rockers with single HD springs (I think my brother got them from an Audi 1.8 liter, but they fit nicely and are stiff), lightened fly wheel and a Magna Spark system in a Bosch 009 set at 30 degrees at 3K rpm.
Torque comes on comfortably below 2,500 rpm for bopping around town, but the power "really" starts around 3,200 and it'll rev past 6,500 in 3'rd, still pulling. Driveability in the bottom end is nice, with no lugging below 2,250 but I hardly ever get below 3,000 (just me, but I find myself dipping into the 2,500-3,000 range now, with the 3:88 rear). Midrange between 2,500 and 3,500 is seamless and almost instantaneous as power is asked for. As you suspected, it drives like a stocker in traffic but is an absolute joy on twisty back roads here in New England, mostly in 3'rd gear up to around 4,500.
Hope that's what you wanted. gn
Saying you shouldn't get a CB engine because they use Webers and Webers catch fire is like saying you shouldn't get a Ford because Fords use Pirellis and you got a flat.
I found much the same in the 1750, Gordon; while you didn't want to lug it (and you never really want to lug an aircooled VW), power once you hit about 3500 just took off! You know the combo is right when an engine like this goes to 6500+ with power. With enough head, carb intake and exhaust, the thing idled as smooth as stock, behaved extremely well in traffic, got decent mileage, and yet (with close 3rd and 4th gears) propelled the car to mid 14 second quarter mile times. Friends were surprised at how easy it was to drive in town when they learned how much duration the camshaft had.
PS- Do you remember what you set the compression at, and are you running aluminum or chrome moly pushrods? Have you ever thought about putting 1.25 rockers on it? You'd definitely have to move up to dual springs... Al
Cliff Presley - Charlotte, NC posted:Bob, I'm new here, who is Roland?
That is the question that everyone asks. "Who is Roland?" Some may say that he is a myth, a mysterious engine builder that builds 4 cylinder engines that produce 1000 hp - at least for a couple of seconds. Some say that he is an elusive recluse who hates people who ask him questions about vw motors. Some say that this mythical engine builder would throw you out of his shop for saying the wrong thing and finding your engine thrown on top of you. Who really is this Roland person? Does he exist? If he does then does he want to be found? Some say that only a select few know his real whereabouts and even fewer know what he really looks like, that is, if he really exists.
The name Roland in todays VW industry directly correlates to the words mythical, mysterious, Dos Equis, and Corona. From the blind depths of blurred reality you seek to find the answer to your equation. Be careful what it is that you are seeking. De profundis inferni unus est homo.
HA Rusty - You're confused with the STIG!
I have personally met Roland and bought him a beer. His good friend lives near here and was helping me with weber sync(can u believe it).Roland came all the way here to Placerville(1/2 way between Sacratomato and Tahoe) and got his motor dialed in,,,motor was fine, its the dammn webers(Italian ones too).
barncobob posted:its the dammn webers(Italian ones too).
They burn cars down! (see what I did there?)
The longer I'm on this site, the more I believe that I'm like a Neanderthal: a highly evolved hominid on the leafy end of a horizontal branch that leads to nowhere.
The above quoted statement from barncobob as well as, "I won't put a CB engine in your car, beacuse they have Webers and Webers burn cars down" from the largest manufacturer of replica speedsters in the world, really does speak to the mechanical anxieties of the great majority of potential (and actual) buyers for these cars.
Simply put, an air-cooled engine needs more care and feeding than the average buyer has the ability or desire to give it. I've got Dellortos, and I run a big fuel filter right after the electric pump up by the tank. I almost never plug idle jets (one every couple seasons?). But when I do, my CHT gauge tells me which one it is before I ever leave the driver's seat. I'm cleaned out and back on the road in 5 minutes or less. It's easy/peasy, because I've got an IM with a wide engine compartment, DLRAs with idle jet access from the top of the carbs, CHT gauges on every cylinder to tell me where to go, and sync-link so I "set it and forget it" on synchronization. Probably most importantly, I have a bottomless well of will to learn how to tune, and a love for the antiquity of an analog engine. In the absence of any one component of this stuff, a guy goes through barncobob's or Lane's frustrations.
I used to think that the world needed a nice stand-alone EFI/crank-fire ECU set-up for a Type 1, but I think that we've passed that point. The hobby seems to want an affordable Subaru flat 4 Type 1 replacement. If it all came in one handy package, and bolted up to a Type 1 transaxle, and wired up with a hot, a tach wire, and a fuel line, I think evolutionary dead-enders like me would be obsolete in 5 years.
I wouldn't mind that so much. ECU-controlled Subarus being the default engine might make the hobby more accessible for non-gearheads.
It might even end the need to make silly statements about particular carburetors (Webers) that are pretty universally acknowledged as the high-water mark (Dellortos are just better Webers) for what is possible to achieve with carburetors.
Roland built my 1915 and I have not heard from Jeff Calhoun of any problems since he bought the car. When the motor was being built,Roland was accessible and answered any questions I had.
If I were to buy an air-cooled car again, I would not hesitate to use Roland.
Well stated Stan. I too like things that need me to run well.
Roland built my 2275cc and shipped from CA to IL. Had it installed and I ran it 1500 miles to Carlisle and back with Zero problems back in 2009. He is semi-elusive but he knows his VW stuff.
