Weight distribution

Has anyone acually weighed the front axle weight and rear axle weight separately for their car? I'm looking for a reasonably close total weight distribution.

I know some IM have their engine pushed forward about three inches, so I don't want their weights. Looking for numbers on a standard pan-based car.

Many Thanks.

Danny Piperato is bringing his scales to carlisle. We should have some representative numbers soon.

A fully loaded Beck Speedster with AC, a gas heater, Pro street transaxle, CB 2110cc and all fluids is 1677 lbs. 659 front and 1018 rear, or 39.2/60.7. The 4 corner weights break down to 321 LF, 338 RF, 503 RR, 515 LR.
The overall distribution is nearly 5% more balanced without air or a gas heater... not to mention nearly 150 lbs lighter.

Oh, and I know you asked about pan based cars, but I just felt like sharing this morning. :)

I wonder if anyone has ever experimented with filling the spare tire well up front with a couple of inches of concrete to balance things out. I'm just sayin'...

Lane:

I'll bring a bag of Quikrete along with me - we can fill yours at the Hotel before we head to the Caddy Shack.

You want the Masonry Mix or Gravel Mix??

gn

When I got my IM it had 2 lead blocks in the front each weighing in at about 80 lbs. I checked with Henry and he said that he didn't do that so I took them out.

I'll bet either one would be OK as long as it can be painted red.

My VS ia 1654 pounds, 40% front and 60 % rear.

"Sakrete". I laughed out loud and my wife asked what was I laughing at. Too funny.----Jack

Lane, you can easily do this experiment with forward weight.
Bag some gravel, weight it on a bathroom scale, drop it in the spare tire wheel and go for a ride adding or removing gravel for the best handling. Re-weight the rocks and convert that weight to a like piece of steel.
Mount to either the spare well or affix it to the axle beam

Eureka! I hit pay dirt well kinds sorta....back in the 70's there were Pet "Rocks"
Now I'll market "Speedster Stones"... $9.99 coming soon at "Carlisle" ~Alan

I've actually thought seriously about doing that very thing. I will need to make sure I can still get the spare tire in there, though. It's amazing how much space there actually is up there with the tire out. I'm sure I could fit everything (except my lawn chair) up there, but I just wouldn't feel safe without the spare. Plus, it's pretty heavy, so it must help out the balance some.

Not a problem!

We can mold the Quikrete right around your spare!!

Hey! I've built a brick bottomed greenhouse.....dumping a little concrete in a battery/spare well is nothing!

DAVE! Haven't forgotten you, either!

We'll weigh a few cars at Carlisle and let you know.....

gordon
The mortar-mixing Speedstah Guy from Beaufort

"Mortar mixer" is that like a "morter-forker"?


--Jack

Hey David...distribute your weight around this....

Good one Jack ! We're going to have to allow Jack 10 minutes at the dinner for his comedy !

Whaaaa.....Jack does Comedy??

Great information ! I will need this type of data for my much mentioned UK test.......

Am I correct in assuming that these weights and distribution will be pretty similar for my pan based CMC???

Cheers
Gerry

Gerry:

Probably close, but if you can wait a week, we'll be able to weigh a few pan-based cars at Carlisle next week.

gn

No rush Gordon....I'm way off completion :)

Thanks for "all" the input guys. I can use "some" of it. I look forward to your Carlisle data - hope it don't rain this year.

Let's see now, at roughly 60%/40% distribution, the center of gravity would be approximately - where my butt is parked! And the on-road handling should be roughly the same (taking into account the weight increase) with or without a passenger. Very good Dr. Porsche!

As for adding front end weight, many years ago I raced a 62 Corvair on frozen Lake St Clair in Detroit. I put over 100 pounds of books in the front trunk. Made no discernable difference on glare ice. Out of perhaps 15 cars, a Pontiac Bonneville came in first and a Nash Metropolitan came in second - go figure????

Add weight to a sports car! Perhaps our weight distribution is not what the experts say is best, there are not too many cars with our sort of traction, With my scooby powered setup I have to be pretty brutal with the clutch to break traction. Braking, i beleive have enough weight transfer to have effective brakes. Cornering, well with the motor out back it is always going to be interesting when it breaks free, adding more weight to the front is not going to make a difference, in fact it will slow down your lap times.

Colin Chapman founder of Lotus had a design mantra of "Performance Through Light Weight.

Greg writes: "well with the motor out back it is always going to be interesting when it breaks free, adding more weight to the front is not going to make a difference"

Ain't that the truth......back in my youth..... in a real 356 when it
broke free I ended up out of control and hit a tree. Having some more weight in front certainly wasn't the issue. Driving too fast going into the turn was!

Arthur - enthusiasm should never exceed ability! But that knowledge don't come from text books does it?

As for surprising people with our speedsters, you should see the looks I get by leaving rubber on a hard launch. Easy to do with our first gear ratios. Of course, it also helps that the car actually accelerates pretty quick when doing that.

"You don't know what I got!"

Yeah....my other ride was front wheel drive.......still have it.
1964 Chapron bodied Citroen DS Cabriolet. Drives a tad different the FWD pulling you through the turns. When a 356 really breaks loose in the back, you're in trouble

I know I said so before, Arthur, but I STILL love that car. That's just gorgeous!

The man from South Carolina clearly has good taste in classic cars!

Attention Dave Klipfel!!

I had the honor of having one of the heaviest Speedsters on Danny P's scales at Carlisle. Remember that mine is a CMC and probably has fiberglass 3/4" thick in some places (the dash, alone, is almost 1/2" thick in places), plus I have a full spare wheel/tire and had a bunch of other stuff in there (remember my road spares list?) along with a left-justified bit of extra weight (Oil cooler/filter, electronics, jack, registration, etc).

At the time of weighing, I had about 2/3'rds of a tank of gas, and these were taken without a driver:

Overall weight: 2002 lbs.

Left front = 397

Right front = 451

Left rear = 628

Right rear = 524

Obviously, I need to raise the right rear just a bit to even things off. That's what Summer nights are for ;>)

CMC's tend to be heavier than Becks and others, so I'll let others post their weights for you and Gerry's benefit.

Bill Drayer's car was so perfectly balanced it was spooky. His comment was "Well, sometimes even a blind squirrel finds a nut!"

Hope this helps!

Gordon

And I had the honor of having the lightest Speedster at a svelte 1700 lbs (beating Paul Rich's TR by a whopping 8 lbs ;-). The weight distribution was 326 LF/340 RF and 526 LR/508 RR. That calculates to a 39/61 front/rear weight distribution (better than I expected). This was with all of the additional Carlisle cargo removed and about 1/2 tank of gas.

Lane:

I wonder how much quicker Pearl would be if I could drop 300 pounds?

Many thanks Gordon and Lane! Your data is much appreciated!

The unequal loading left to right leads to some interesting contemplation. I guess we all knew that weight balancing can be a big factor (NASCAR and dirt track knowledge) but never really thought much about it.

Many years ago I had a pickup camper in my driveway, I used some carefully measured steel beams as levers and fulcrums with an old 300 pound bathroom scale. I measured the camper weight at all four corners. This clarified that I needed a truck that would take a 1500 pound payload in the bed. Years later, I found I was within 50 pounds of what the camper actual weighed.

Trouble is, my wife threw out the bathroom scales years ago!

I think I could get everything balanced by bringing the right rear side up maybe 1/4" - 3/8" or so, or by dropping the left rear the same amount. Unfortunately, that is counter to what I see for wheel arch heights right now, so I'll be thinking about the best approach which, right now is no approach.

Of course, if I were to move the body alone up by pulling the rear body frame rivets and pushing things around, THAT would be a whole different matter, right? Then I could move the body UP on the left rear, then drop it back down by dropping the spring rate on the left rear and the both actions should make the rear more balanced while keeping the body to ground measurements about the same.

Sounds like a lot of work when I could just be driving the damn thing...

gn

Maybe it's a good thing that most of us DON'T know what our wheel to wheel weight difference is. If it conflicts with the body ride height - and we are all in this for the visual - what to do? I'm now thinkin' -ignorance is bliss!

Hi Gordon,

I'm building a CMC as well! Excellent information, Stored away for the test :)

Thanks to all concerned !!

Cheers
Gerry

Yeah, Gerry, I figure my CMC has about 200 pounds of extra fiberglass lurking around in there somewhere, compared to a Beck (or another CMC, for that matter).

Either that, or I have very heavy air in my tyres!

gn

It's those Chrysler seats, Gordon. And those flares... And those big tires... And that big engine... And all those rolls of blue tape ;-)

Except for trying to shed a few pounds....I ain't changing a thing.
Sure wish I'd have written down those numbers, though.

~WB

Was there another thread re members weigh-in results @ Carlisle ?

Danny ; How many did you get on the scales?
Did you record them ?

Only GN and Lane posted their results here.

Lane and me

We be cool......

I told y'all to write them down!

I think Lane was pretty light, or maybe Barry was lightest, somewhere in the 1700 range. The heaviest was Rob's turbo SAS, at 2300 plus. My Spyder weighs in at 1450 with a half tank, and 45% front, 55% rear.

I think I weighed 8-10 cars that day. One Spyder and the rest Speedsters, CMC, Vintage, Beck, TR, and SAS among them. Don't think there was an IM in the bunch. Did Pete weigh his Envemo? I don't remember. I guess I should have recorded it all, but hey, I was busy(and sweaty, yech!)

My TR weighed in at 1708 lbs. I have the numbers back at the house (I was told to right them down) but remember it being really close to 40% front and 60% rear.