wheel studs

anyone know of a good source for wheel studs? I want to get rid of the lug bolts and go with the studs, it makes taking wheels off and putting them back on much easier.
Or if anyone has a set sitting around they'd like to sell I'd be more than happy to take them off your hands.

CIP1 has them - ya really only need 1 per wheel to hang the rim from.

I got mine at "Autozone"!

The first studs I used were the kind that screw in. The part that the lug nuts screws on is inch type threads and you have to use special washers with a rounded side under the conical lug nuts.

They are easy to install but I didn't like having to mess with the washers.

Then I got press-in studs. You have to drill out the threaded holes in your drums or disks.

The first time I tried this I used a hand drill and every now and then the drill bit would catch in the hole and fling the drum around - not fun. Also, some of the holes wound up not quite perpendicular to the drum face. This time I tapped the studs in with a hammer.

I did the press-in studs again with new drums. This time I used a drill press and pulled the studs in with a nut and stack of washers.

I got the studs from aircooled.net.

I don't think I still have the screw in studs but I still have the funny washers and lug nuts. I would be willing to give them to a worthy cause.

I just bought threaded rod of the right hardness from McMaster I think. They wouldn't ship to me up here but did ship to Corey who forwarded them on to me. Was a LOT cheaper than buying the studs...I think it was M14 1.5 but not sure. Just use the double nut method and screw then in using red locktite.

http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=686

hey Brian - do you mean holding them in with double nut, or jsut doing that to get them in? what is holding them from simply unscrewing? Just the locktight?

I went the same route as Brian.

Just bought a 4' M14 rod from McMaster Carr and got on with it. Cut it off with my trusty Sawzall, buffed the ends with a Dremel, double-nutted them and treaded them in.

Oh....I needed to do this because of the 1.25" spacers I run (even though everyone told me not to run them because I would be displacing the CL of the hub bearings. 18,000 miles later the bearings are doing fine!)

BTW: McMaster Carr delivered in two days....

Yes Paul, that's what you do with the threaded studs they sell for more.

Hey, Brian!

When are you Nomads leaving the Great White north for the nicer side of Niagara?? thought you were supposed to be there by now (or is the snow too deep, still, to get out of Yellowknife??)

Don't suppose it would be remotely conceivable to join us at Carlisle, or would it?

gn

sorry - just to clarify Brian - locktight only?

That's it, the red locktite not the blue.

Gordon, perhaps this summer. I'm sure you noticed that things are a little crappy now. We'd be counting on our government pensions which I suppose are as secure as anything else these days. Wife is already finished...they laid her off and she's on full pay for 13 months then reduced pension. She's currently contracted to do work for one of the cabinet ministers so she gets that plus full pay. Its going to be hard to leave that income for a reduced pension.

Lots of snow still of course but finally warming up. Been a long, cold winter. I'll be taking time off work this PM to go kite skiing on Great Slave lake as its pretty windy and going up to minus 4C today...warmest its been since probably last Oct.

Here's a friend's weather site up here...if his web cam is up you can likely see us kite skiing in the afternoons and evenings here. Finally staying light out till 8:30 or so now too. Soon it'll be pretty much light all day.

http://www.rallarvegen.com/Monument/

As far as Carlisle goes, not this year. Car is apart anyway waiting for the A arm front end from the UK and for me to get around to installing the rebuilt 2.4S and transaxle. Just been too damn cold.

Brian - You don't need the car to come to Carlisle. Lots of west coasters are flying in this year. There should be enough right seats open that you could occupy.

This M14 stuff; in addition to the loc-tite should I run it through the drums and rotors a bit (1/16th") and beat the end with a ball peen just to insure it doesnt' run out? Isn't the red loc-tite the softer of the two?
What to do about lug nuts?

i don't know about you guys - i want a lot more holding my wheel lugs in than just locktight. i love the look of (wheel) studs, but i couldn't do that mod.

Don't know what the problem is. I lock-tited my Gorilla studs in and haven't had a problem 12k miles running. Remember, when you load the lugs/studs with about 100 lbs. of torque, I don't believe they are going any where soon.

~WB

If you use the press-in studs they have a head on the back side and you don't have to worry about loctite.

Mickey,

If you use the screw-in studs you probably will need lug nuts and special washers I describe above.

If you use metric studs you will need lug nuts with a spherical face with steel wheels. I got these from aircooled.net

What's the big deal here??

I've been running wheel studs for over 16,000 miles, since day one on Pearl. Never used locktite on them until this year (I had it kicking around when I replaced all my suspension bushings and figured it couldn't hurt).

I am running 1.25" thick, 4-lug to 5-lug spacer/adapters, where the adapter is attached to the wheel hub with three original VW wheel bolts and one new stud (with a nut), and then the adapters have M14 studs in them (now locktited in). I bought a full set of M14 Porsche alloy lug nuts from Tweeks/Mid-America (pricey, but they look oh, so cool!). I set lug nut torque to around 60 ft/lbs. (hey...the car is light.) There are no lockwashers, or any other kind of washers, on my wheels.

I drive my car at least as hard as any of you, probably more than most:

I've run Hot Laps at New Hampshire international Speedway's road course (over 100mph at times for lots of laps).

I've run fast parade laps at Watkins Glen (Chris was driving, and complaining all the way 'round about my tires being too soft).

I've run Hot laps at Roebling Road Track near Savannah maybe a dozen times (usually chasing or being chased by Cobras).

I've run parade laps at Lime Rock, but pushing the corners for all it was worth.

I'll be running hot laps at Hutchinson Road Course in Savannah in a couple of weeks - should be fun....

I have checked lug nut tightness and stud length above the spacers after each of these events and have NEVER seen anything loosen up or the studs creep out, even without locktite. I've also checked my old, Taiwanese, cast aluminum spacer/adapters for cracks around the studs (never saw any) and have checked my latest billet spacer/adapters (from Pelican Parts and made for a 914) for cracks around the studs (never saw any).

People told me running spacers would ruin my wheel bearings, so when I was replacing the suspension bushings I pulled them all and checked them - perfect.

So, again....What's the big deal, here??

Mickey,
http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=719

These are very close to the original porsche press in studs. If installed correctly, there's never a concern about them coming loose or pulling through.

Greg

The red loctite is the one that you have to heat up to remove the fastener. Its the one you use on the gland nut that holds the flywheel on. I'm sure its up to the task but you could run the stud through and then perhaps use a cold chisel and peen the threads or something like that.

Gordon - i'm not saying you can't i'm just not sure i understand what is holding it in other than the shear strength of Locktight.

say you tighten your lugs with this setup. you mount the wheel, put on a few lugs - tighten them down by hand, then - with a socket & ratchet / air gun - when you "torque" them down (or undoing them for that matter) - what is stopping them from unscrewing from the original position? Just the lock tight right?

I personally would tack weld them or something - this just seems like playing with fire. a lot of risk for a visual / convenience enhancement IMO.

When I use the "stud" material from McMaster Carr, it is a tight fit. That's why you need to double-nut them to get them in. They'll thread by hand for 2-3 turns and then they get harder to turn. Putting locktite on them is more than enough to make sure they won't walk out when you remove a lug nut, especially if the drum/hub bolt holes are worn a little.

I would suggest, though, that you remove a hub or drum, assemble a wheel to it and see how far the current bolts protrude on the back side. Use that as a reference and then measure how long the studs must be to equal that protrusion and accept the lug nuts with a depth into the lug nut of at least the diameter of the stud. I.E.; if the stud is 3/4" diameter, the lug nut should "capture at least 3/4" of threads when tight, preferably more. If I remember right, I have about 1/4" protruding on the back, and about 2" to accept the 1-1/4" thick wheel, leaving 3/4" for the lug nut. The overall stud length is something like 3-1/4 inches.

I would use the press-in studs that Greg mentioned long before I would weld a stud in place.

If you do use the press-in studs, MAKE SURE of the following:

1. That the stud shaft is knurled or ribbed where it inserts into the drum.

2. That the hole in the drum/hub is UNDERSIZED to the correct dimension for the knurled stud. It's supposed to be a press fit, not loose.

3. That the drum/hub is as thick as the knurled portion of the stud where they intersect. Some drums/hubs are thicker/thinner than others where the studs/bolts go through. Thicker is better, especially with a 4-bolt pattern.

4. Use a press to press the studs in. I've seen too many drums with cracks around the stud holes from whale-ing on the stud with a hammer to get them in. They aren't designed for that kind of impact.

sounds like you are using a different pitch thread in the stock hole (drum/rotor). depending on the pitch it will be really tight - or break off.

i know you're a do-it-yourself kind of guy and i respect that, so if you say / think it's safe - i'm sure it is. from my end of the computer - i sure as heck ain't doing this mod.

OK, fine!