Whine

Hi All

I need a little help once again. I have a high pitched whine when I rev the engine, it starts about 3,000 RPM. I we disconnected the generator belt and the whine when away. This leads me to beleive that the whine has to do with fan or the generator. I heard of people putting in a welded and balanced fan, will this cure the problem? Where can I get a balanced fan ? ]

Dick

It may be the fan, but are you running a generator or alternator? Is it a whine or more of a squeak? VW Generators are notorious for dry rear (v-belt pulley end) bearings which squeak under even moderate acceleration. Only cure is to replace the bearing. If it's an alternator it may be whining from either a poor rear bearing or I have heard some whine when one of the diodes starts to fail, causing it to work a bit harder.

Lastly, pull the fan/generator mounting plate out (a clamp and four screws - leave the generator/fan attached and have it out in 30 minutes) and take a look at the fan itself, along with the inside of the housing, to make sure there isn't something foreign in there (like a leaf or some other debris) touching the fan as it spins, thus, causing the whine.

Let us know what you find........gn

Make sure you don't have a dead mouse in the fan or a small peace of trash.

I've got the same problem. No mouse, just a whine. Let me know about your solution.

With the belt off, spin the Alt/Gen and you should be able to hear if the fan is hitting the shroud. This will help determine if it is the fan or the alt/generator. My money is on the alt/generator. If you have an older Motorola then for sure.

Thanks. The fan is not hitting the shroud-no question. That leaves the alternator (12 V) which I beleive is a Bosch. Now what?

Ditto on my whine. Would a welded balanced fan help and if so where can I get one and how much?

Sounds like you both need an alternator rebuild. Check your areas in the phone book and see if there is a company nearby that does starter/generator/alternator rebuilds. If there's nothing (and even if there is) go to a knowlegeble auto part store and ask them who nearby does alternator rebuilds and tek it there. You'll have to remove the fan before you give it to them.

On the welded/balanced fans, Gene Berg sells them and I understand that they are pretty high quality. Don't know who else sells them.

Ralphie- Did you ever determine what is causing the whine ?

We removed the fan belt and the whine was gone and sounded great. So it can only be The alternator, or the fan! It starts at about 2500 -3000 rpm. I think its the fan. I was thinking of putting in a Gene Berg Balanced fan but their a bit pricey and it looks like a lot of work. Any suggestions? Gordon the Alternator lookS new.

California Whiner

I used to work with a guy named Dave Winer - poor guy took a lot of abuse.

I would pull the fan/alternator assembly out of the shroud and look in there to see if there is something being sucked into the fan when it spins up. Leaves, twigs, all that sort of stuff can get in there and get stuck and then they get pulled toward the fan.

At th same time that you have it out, you can spin the alternator assy to see if it makes any noise (although, admittedly, it'll be spinning pretty slowly relative to running in the engine).

You could always throw a little cheese in with the whine to quiet that mouse. Just kiddin! I would suggest trying to find the source. It can be easliy done by using an old mechanic's trick. With the engine running-Take a very long screwdrive and touch the metal tip a possible whining sound source. Place your ear on the platic end. Listen for the noise. Make sure you do not have any loose clothing or jewelry while performing this task. There are mechanics stethascopes that can be purchased. You will be able to tell if the generator bearings have gone bad. good luck.
Joe S

if you do remove the fan/alt assy to inspect. just look up
a gen/alt./starter rebuilder in your area they have a test bench
where they spin up the alt. to check output/condition.
no cost. its worth a try. good luck.

What kind of shroud are you using? Some of the shrouds seem to produce a whine due to airflow. A new fan and alternator won't stop that.

First the easy assessment. Have someone run it up and push and pull on the dog house. How does that affect the whine? If it does, then a simple adjustment in the dog house will do. (I have actually heard a motor sound like it had a knock and this was the problem.) Next, loosen the four bolts holding the fan to the housing. Try to adjust this while the motor is at the whining RPM. Does it change? Finally, just pull the alternator and the fan and replace them both out of desperation.

Henry

I think you may be on to something. I'm using the dog house that came with the engine that Vintage supplied , could it be blowing thru a place in the housing?

I installed a new doghouse shroud, alternator, and welded/balanced fan this weekend (don't ask). I am AMAZED at how the shroud attaches- really, the alternator pretty much holds the whole thing on the motor. It seems entirely possible that there could be air leaking around the shrouds.

I don't know if other people who have your VS shroud and exhaust configuration have the same problems because I have a different set up. Although since that is an aftermarket shroud, there is a higher probability it is involved than if you said you had an OEM shroud. I do know I get a noise that I would call a whistle and that it has nothing to do with the fan or the alternator because I replaced both. The reason I replaced them was because at one point something moved and the fan rubbed up against the shroud. If that is your problem, its going to sound bad, and not going to be present only during a certain RPM band, like the whistle noise. If you pull the fan and see wear around the edge of the fan, you better replace it.

I'm still looking for THE cause of the whine. Anybody?

This will sound, well, uh.... but do you have straight cut cam crank gears? That could be your whine (or more of a whirring). Some people like the sound, others find it irratating, like a whine.

The problem may just be your cooling fan..

The fan has been replaced. Still have the whine. Can't stand it.

I had a whine, more of a whistle when I bought my used speedster. I'm running dual Dels and had to put a no-whistle gasket between the carbs and intake manifold. Could be your problem.

Michael

Moike: Can you give more detail on your "no-whistle" gasket?

Please tell us more about the gasket!!!! Maybe my noise is more of a whistle than a whine. It happens at 2500 rpm up which is my highway rpm then it drives me CRAZY. A Bottle of fine California wine (not whine )to person that find the answer.

Yeah.....the reason I asked, is that I have dual Dells, and on hard acceleration it squeaks in a pulsing kind-of way, almost like it has a partial or very small vacuum leak. Getting less over time (or I'm getting used to it) and I've tried tightening the manifold nuts at the head but it may be somewhere else or they may just squeak......

That's not my problem I took off the fan belt and ran it for a short time with out the belt and it sounded wonderful. So mine has to be the fan or the Altenator maybe the dog house.

Dick

Some aftermarket shrouds do not have Eipper style airfoils inside them.. The air is actually cut by the weird shape of the vane..

If that is the case the only way to solve the issue is with a shroud swap..

I purchased the no-whistle gaskets from BugFormance in Sacramento. 916-929-4320

The gasket was thick and had a bump about 3/16 inches in diameter on one surface, otherwise it just looked normal. The scream or whistle started about 2500 rpm, just like the man said. If I was real gentle it would not whistle. I fooled around with the fan belt and had no sucess. The gasket solved the problem totally. Remember these are Dels, I don't know if other carbs are the same.

Michael

would you say the "whistle" was like a chirping bird that had way to much coffee? my whistle starts about 2500 rpm with med pedal and goes away when I back off or floor it.

Angus:

Yup, that's exactly what I've got, too......but the darn thing idles beautifully, so I didn't think I had a vacuum leak.

Maybe we should get some of these and try them out?

Does this anti-squeak gasket go between the carb and the manifold, or between the manifold and the head?

Shorty says the gasket is between the carb and manifold.

Wow! Shorty looks like he would be a heck of a lot more helpful than my Jack Russell Terriers back there!

Plus, they've got no place to hold their wrenches.........

The anti-squeak gasket only works with Del carbs I was told.

Dick

Perhaps its the fan belt and pulley. A belt can slip and squeal.
My gives a quick squeak when started. A second or less. I know it is the 1915 high proformancer engine fast start, and a cold belt.

RWBecker

Went out and played around with mine yesterday, and the squeak comes on with about 1/3 throttle at anything above 2K rpm and gets slightly louder if I give it more throttle. Then when I get beyond about 3/4 throttle it goes away until I throttle back to between 1/3 and 3/4's.

Seems to run OK, so I'll put up with the squeak until I get the new gaskets.

could it be the butterflies vibrating in the throttle bore due to missadjustment, as opposed to a vaccume leak or the need for spacers,as i know my "chirping" has gradually become worse over time,just a thought...

My whine is not the gasket. We covered the air intake for a short time and the noise went away and disconnected the belt and it went away. We then changed the fan with a German one and the noise was a lower pitch one I can live with . I think a louder exhaust or a good sound system will take care of it completely. Thanks everyone for all the help.

Dick

_shorty was right in my case michael