Windshield fit.......again

Gerry:

email me at speedstahguy at gmail.com and I'll send you Dr. Clock's install instructions (with a couple of edits by me).

That should help you a bit.

Gordon

The Speedstah Guy from Grafton.

Ah, screw it.  Here you go:

Windshield Installation

Disclaimer:

These instructions are a guide only, many applications require variation(s) from this guide. The installer assumes all risk.

I welcome any comments or suggestions to improve on this guide.

Alan

drclock@pa.net

New Kit Build Windshield Installation

Do not stretch the rubber molding while fitting them to the glass......by doing so, you'll wind up short as the rubber returns to the original length.

Always start drilling into fiberglass with the drill bit in reverse to allow for penetration through the gelcoat, then you can change the direction

of the drill to complete the hole without creating a chip in the surface of the gelcoat.

Do a search here to locate post template measurements that have been previously posted here.

It is important to allow the entire windshield frame to slightly float as a unit rather than over tighten it............. It Will Break

Corner Post Installation

* Start by drilling the windshield post holes into the top of the L & R fender area .....It is critical that you drill the holes only slightly

larger than the actual diameter of the female threaded post .... you can open them up if need be with a file if necessary.

Be sure to drill the holes at a forward angle that is the same as the female threaded post nipples. Again, do a search here to locate

template measurements that have been previously posted. ( Post mock up models are available for loan from Alan Merklin)

* Dry fit the upper rubber U channel to the top of the windshield, ....Do Not Stretch It...carefully cutting off any excess evenly at the windshield

bottom.

* Dry fit the lower rubber molding to the base of the windshield (tap it into place with a rubber mallet) cut the ends of the rubber the same

angle as the vertical edge of the windshield post against the U channel....leaving a bit extra here as you can trim it back later.

Do Not Stretch It.

Dry-fit the upper trim channel into the corresponding area of the windshield corner posts,  If it does not seat into the corner post channels, the U-frame must be crimped, slightly until it fits into the corner posts.  Once it fits, the channel may be opened slightly by fitting the u channel into the corner post, lay the post and channel on a bench cushioned with several clean rags and lay a 3/8” deep-style socket into the opening of the U-channel and tap it into opening of the channel until it drops in.  Do this for the length of the corner post channel to get the shape of the U-channel back to “normal”.

Cementing rubber gaskets to the glass

* Remove the prefit rubber pieces and cement them back onto the glass as you had positioned them above with a

good grade of contact adhesive.

* Drill a 1/4" hole centered in the rearward top of the upper aluminum windshield frame for the support rod.

Assembling the Upper U-Frame

* Slide the upper windshield frame over the rubber U channel you have glued to the glass, tapping it with a rubber mallet as you push it on.  alternatly, you may place the bottom of the windshield against your chest and pull firmly on the upper channel to get it to slide over the rubber.  Dawn dishwashing liquid may be used (liberally) as a lubricant, or aerosol tire black.

If there is too much resistance , remove the frame and gently ......tweek - bend the frame over your knee to obtain a better fit.

Once you have the best fit to the windshield glass, mark the frame where it meets the base of the glass. ( You will find that to fit correctly

and allowing for the windshield to "lay back", you'll have to taper the cut off higher on the back side of the frame, clean cut with a fine file).

Assembling the bottom trim to the cowl

* Starting where the windshield wiper posts come thru the cowl, cover the area between the post pods and back 4" -5" with blue masking tape

(be generous and double up the tape) to avoid paint scratches.

* Bend the windshield bottom frame along the windshield base to copy the radius for a good fit.

* Cut 1/4" off the edges of the bottom frame tabs (shorten) on the windshield base molding , this hides the edge of the tabs under the rubber  base molding, the tabs will bend a bit as you snip them away but can easily be flattened back to shape with a hammer on a

hard surface.  Alternately, you can cut off the tabs with a Dremel and a cut-off wheel.

* Drill 3/16"holes centered in every other tab of the windshield base molding.

* With the upper frame set onto the windshield, set the windshield on to the body cowl area 1/2 " rearward of the windshield wiper pod (Any less of a distance and you will have a wiper arm to windshield base rubber interference and too far back, you will not be able to get a socket onto the bolt head under the windshield post.)

* Starting at the center, slide the aluminum base frame tabs under the rubber base pushing it snugly against the rubber base. Mark the tape, every inch where the forward edge of the frame is at. Cut any excess at the windshield post, this cut is also done at the the same angle as the leading edge of the post.

* Remove the windshield assembly from the cowl and set it aside in a safe area.

Alternately, you can place the windshield assembly on the colw and draw a continuous line along the forward, lower edge of the bottom gasket and use that line as a reference for positioning the bottom trim.

* Carefully place the forward edge of the windshield base molding along the marks you just made, drill thru the 3/16" holes you made

previously and continue to drill through the fiberglass cowl area. As you drill each hole, loosely set a rivet into the hole you just made

to temporarly secure the frame base before you more on to the next hole.

* Fit and glue the dash vinyl into place with the forward edge trimmed 1/2" rearward of the line you marked on the tape to reference the

windshield base placement. ( This is done so that the 3M windshield adhesive adheres to the aluminum and not the dash vinyl.)

* Cut a piece of rubber, VW fender welting 8" longer on each side of measured distance from the outer edges of the windshield posts.

* Starting at the passenger side, remove a few of the temporary rivets at a time and sandwich the rubber fender welting "seal" between

the aluminum base molding and the cowl and gently push an awl into the rubber to open the holes into the rubber being careful that

it doesn't move or stretch as you go along. Again replace the temporary rivets without affixing them to the body

* Start at the center of the base windshield molding, begin to rivet it to the cowl alternating Left then Right being careful not to move

the molding away from the line you marked on the taped cowl area.

* Set the windshield assembly back on and confirm that the base molding fits evenly against the base rubber without any gaps. If you do

have a gap, drill out the rivet(s) nearest to the gap, redrilling close by on the same tab and set a new rivet. ( The old hole will be hidden

under the rubber base molding.)

Remove the windshield assembly and place a dab of silicon caulk into the center hole of each rivet to seal them and let the caulk set up for 24 hours.

Preparing the center support rod

* On the top end the support rod there is a slot cut into it to allow the rod to hook in the windshield frame , the cut is too far back from the

end causing the rod to pertrude too far into the windshield frame and possibly hitting against the glass, my fix is to grind off the excess

until you have no more than a 1/32" thickness forward of the cut slot.

* Place the center support rod into the hole in the center of the upper frame allowing it to seat in the slot on the rod pass it down through the

dash hole, don't put a nut and washer on it yet.

Final Install of the windshield

* Run a 30" bead of 3M windshield adhesive placing it 1/8" back from the vertical edge of the windshield base frame...the base rubber will be placed on to this and when dry, will secure the windshield to the cowl and keep it from pulling away from the base frame by tipping back slightly when the top is latched to the upper windshield frame....Do Not get this stuff on your skin because, as it begins to dry it is absolutely impossible to remove and can only wear off naturally with time.

* Take a 1/4" washer and elongate the hole to allow the washer to set flush on the underside of the dash thread a nut onto the rod and hand

tighten only.

* Cut a piece of 1/2" ID tubing to fit over the post nipple, this can be cut to the same length as the nipple.  Elongate the holes in two 1/2” fender washers such that they can be placed on the corner post nipples and will fit flush against the bottom of the corner posts.

* Slide the windshield posts along the upper frame and down into the holes in the upper fenders. Use a large fender washer over the post

nipple and against the underside of the fender, fit a standard washer under the head of the bolt that gets screwed into the post nipple.

Take the extra end portion of the rubber fender welting and place the flat edge under the windshield post and the beading up against the post..... As you wrap it around the post, start to force the bead under the rear and inner portion of the post , this will fill in the gap on the back side of the windshield post , tuck any extra up under the back side of the rubber

windshield rubber . With a socket extension and swivel, hand tighten only. (One edge of the fender washer will need to be filed off to

allow for clearance on the back corner of the dash area)

* Have a helper gently push down with slight pressure on the upper windshield frame, mark the position of the two corner post holes onto the windshield frame, remove the frame, drill and tap for the mounting screws ....Be sure that you tap the holes on the same angle as they are drilled

into the posts or the stainless screws will not thread in correctly and strip out the aluminum. Replace the upper frame, 10 x 24 x 3/4" oval stainless steel screws go in the bottom holes and 10 x 24x 1/4" screws into the upper holes.  Don't use screws that arew any longer, and do not over tighten as you will very easily strip out the aluminum.

* Remove a post bolt, add a dab of silicone to the threads and reinstall into the post nipple, Gently tighten the post bolts and the center

support rod, alternating 1/4 of a turn on each one....Just snug them, allowing for the windshield frame assembly to slightly float in the frame.

Add a dab of silicone to the center support rod nut so that it cannot work loose. Do not use a nyloc nut as you will not be able to "feel " as the nut becomes snug.

A fine dissertation as usual, Gordon. If this is saved somewhere on this site in some retrievable archive, could you please advise where ? If not, would you pls emal me copy when you have a chance? thanks.  Dstroud at xplornet.com

Dang.   That should have been all lower case.  dstroud at xplornet.com

Thanks Dr. Clock and Gordon - this belongs in the knowledge base!

As an aside and supportive of the article, I also have the full-size corner post location templates as a scan which can be emailed and then printed on your end (whoever you are).  The templates (left and right) fit the top of the cowl over near the door edges and conveniently locate the corner post holes where they are supposed to be, no muss, no fuss.

With the new site format, I'll have to look a bit to see if they are save-able on here intact.  If not, I'll find someplace else to store them online.

Dave:  I just sent both to you at all-lower-case dave.  Stand back!

gn

Thank you chaps !

Now......a little more info.  The screen was in previously and I took it out for paint, so everything is located already, what I don't recall is.....How was the fit before I took it out !!

I'm guessing that since all factors are the same, it was always a crap fit and I just didn't notice

Its a CMC kit, is the cowl known to be out?

RE this part.... "Have a helper gently push down with slight pressure on the upper windshield frame, mark the position of the two corner post holes onto the windshield frame, remove the frame, drill and tap for the mounting screws....."

What did occur to me is that it could be that the top frame is drilled wrong at the drivers side.......drilling the securing screws a little higher and trimming a fraction off of the frame would bring everything down, wouldn't it??

I'll get some more pics for a second opinion on here before I do anything !

I have to take the glass back out in any case....I need to drill for the hood 'snaps'..

Thanks for all input !

Cheers

GErry

"What did occur to me is that it could be that the top frame is drilled wrong at the drivers side.......drilling the securing screws a little higher and trimming a fraction off of the frame would bring everything down, wouldn't it??"

Yup.....

OK, so.....If I trim the frame a little and push down into the rubber, mark the new screw positions, what are my options if there is not enough meat in the frame for drilling and retapping, (ie the new position for the screws overlaps the old holes....) Do I need to get them welded up?? any other options?

Anything look obviously wrong here?? (apart from the big gap......)

David.

Caps don't matter in an email address.  Just emailed you with all caps as a test.  Hope you don't get confused and think the email is from Gerd.  

Ger, some people put the rubber on the bottom of the glass behind the bottom aluminum instead of lapping over it. This will eliminate the gap.

Ger:

Mike brings up a very pertinent point.  That is, it's a real bugger to get the bottom windscreen rubber forward lip to fit over/onto the vertical lip of the metal bottom trim.  I know some people do it, and I know I did (just once) out of many attempts, but it is far easier to just push it in behind the metal trim piece, otherwise it tends to flex both the front and back of the rubber in unexpected places (and I've never had the patience to deal with it).  

I've been most successful in running a generous bead  (say, 1/4" dia) of black, silicon caulk along the flat side of the metal trim piece, center-justified towards the front, and then, with the lower rubber in place on the windshield (I've been known to use black silicon to "glue" the glass into the rubber, too) push the windshield in place down and forward and up against the vertical part of the trim and then center it left/right vs the corner posts (just slide it back and forth til it's right).  THAT should eliminate the rise in the bottom rubber at the back toward the cockpit.  You may get a small gap or two along the front as the metal trim might not precisely match the shape of the glass, so just shoot a little black silicon in the gaps and smooth it with a wet finger.  It'll look factory when done and is, essentially, glued in. 

OK on relocating the holes on the bottom of the driver's side top frame piece.  I had to do that on one after installing a new windscreen AND new (and slightly different shape) top rubber.  The stack-up of the two new pieces was less than before, causing a BIG gap at the top corner on both sides (like, slide a popsicle stick through it, big).  I trimmed both sides of the frame about 3/8" and drilled new holes about 1/4"+ higher than before and everything pulled in nicely.

All of this is dependent on the exact placement (left/right/front/back) of the damn windscreen.  A little movement one way or t'other can screw you up.  A second opinion is always good.  Might I suggest Billy Connoly????   Might as well have fun whilst your at it.

ok, first, thanks for all of the input !

Been working away this week, so not been  able to do anything,,,,,,But just come in from the garage.

Conclusion, either the cowl is wrong or the glass is wrong.....see the pics.

I tried grinding the glass, but with little success.......away in Finland all next week, will try some Pro glass folks when I'm back

Blue tape indicates what needs to go !

Alternative seal may be an option.....

for some reason I cant edit post....

Pics show glass with no seal so summit is wrong !!!!