Wiper install

That looks like the same mechanism in my car, Carlos.  I have never looked at the install, but your're more than welcome to check it out next week.  If you need it before then I can crawl under there once I've gotten the car back together and take a look.

EDIT: Is your Spyder a Beck or a Vintage?  I'd suggest calling the manufacturer and asking them.  If it's a Thunder Ranch you're out of luck, but I'll bet they're pretty much the same.

Carlos, I ended up using an old ball joint front shock bushing between the mounting bushing and the fiberglass. I think I zip-tied it to the wiper assembly.

I got a set of the older arms(which are 9" both sides) and some 10" blades. The arms have a smaller inset for the aluminum nuts. Looks like the nuts on your mechanism. I took the blades apart and painted nuts, arms, and blades in hammertone silver. I don't think that long arm will work that you have. Also, I had to bend the passenger side about 20 degrees to make it rest near the windshield base.

Who did the wiring on that, looks very sanitary! No relay needed, just a switched ignition or accessory lead. I have it on a 15amp  along with the horn.

Lane, that mechanism can only go in one of two ways, I'm sure I can figure which way. The forecast for the Tour weekend is looking better. If I don't get it installed by then, I'll take a peek at yours for sure. I'll be peeking at every ones cars anyway.

Danny, too bad your not going to make it. I definitely wanted to meet you and check your car out. I do want to meet everyone. I don't want anyone getting butt hurt. Heal up, and we meet some other time.

I was thinking of a similar solution for that tab. I'll test fit it to see what I can do with it.

My car is a Vintage built by Seduction Motorsports. The wiring is pretty clean. I could get nitpicky, but I'll save that for another post. Maybe a "My first two year Seduction Spyder ownership review" at some point.

the 10" blades are rear glass blades from various cars

With the right switch you can get an intermittent phase as well.. just saying. 

So I got the mechanism installed. It took about 6 dry fits before I was happy. The passenger side shaft sticks out of the cowling about 1/16" more than the drivers side. On the inside, the nut and washer on the drivers side wiper shaft, isn't exactly flat with the fiber glass.  The passenger side is pretty close. I don't know if this is going to matter yet.

I grounded the two brown wires and supplied power to the red one. I wrapped a piece of wire to each of the wiper arm shafts to simulate the wiper arms, and turned it on. This unit wants to nest on the right side of the car. It did also seem to struggle while it was operating, like it was binding. The motion wasn't smooth. Not sure what to think of that. Maybe it was wired backwards and the mechanism doesn't like that direction???

The way it's wired, it seems to want to get power from the ignition switch. I initially touched the red end to one of the red posts on the ignition switch, and when I turned on the wiper, it shorted a 30amp fuse in the fuse box. Maybe due to the binding? This is when I supplied power from a different source for testing.

Well I'm tired of laying on my back with my head under the dash for now. Just wondering what your thoughts were?

Does the mechanism self-park? Mine parks with the arms toward the driver's side. Yes, power from the key, you only want it to work with the key on.

Follow a Bug wiring diagram and double check the wiring from the motor to the switch. I ended up taking the motor apart, cleaning it and greasing it up. Works fine now, but popped a few fuses until I sorted it. I only had one power and one ground.

Yeah, it sucks getting under a Spyder dash, I AGREE!

You need to put your yoga pants on first before trying to get under the dash!!

You can make it park on either side, depending on how you put the pieces together.

Carlos, hopefully after you get back from NC this will help you sort it out.

Thanks, Danny.

Get back from NC? I live an hour South of Waynesville over the mountain. It's supposed to be in the 40s at my house Saturday morning. I'm sure when I crest the mountain on the way to Waynesville, it'll be in the 30s. I won't be thinking of wipers, I'll be wanting a heater. lol    I do have heated seats.

I've already figured out how to change parking sides. Like Michael says, I just have to put it together that way.

I also have an idea why it's binding. I'll check this all out after this weekend.

Yes, I hear you. When we went to Lime Rock Park, it was 45 in the morning. Hats, gloves, and jackets helped a lot. But Michelle was actually OK, she is usually cold, especially with the Webasto cranking! Since we added the Carbon Fiber seat heaters, she can be even warmer.

I'm sure you'll get the wipers sorted. Be careful over the crest of the mountain, the windshield mists on the inside instantaneously. Bring a towel!

I like a little squeegee for the inside...

That's funny, I just got a shower squeegee for that very purpose. I also carry a towel or two.

I got a chance to remove my wiper assembly and do some testing. I ran the motor with out the arm that moves the wiper mechanism, and the hesitation is not in the mechanism.

Every once in a few turns, the motor would hesitate at the same location that it parks at and I noticed a spark through the hole shown by the arrow when this happens.

I removed this cover and this is what it looks like.

Has anyone had this happen? Should I wipe off the grease to see if I can find some kind of fault?

BTW, I checked the wiring and everything seems to be where it should.

Carlos G posted:

I got a chance to remove my wiper assembly and do some testing. I ran the motor with out the arm that moves the wiper mechanism, and the hesitation is not in the mechanism.

Every once in a few turns, the motor would hesitate at the same location that it parks at and I noticed a spark through the hole shown by the arrow when this happens.

I removed this cover and this is what it looks like.

Has anyone had this happen? Should I wipe off the grease to see if I can find some kind of fault?

The sparking is probably normal. As the motor turns, that cam opens and closes electrical contacts necessary for the park function. When the switch is On, the motor is powered for about 95% of its rotation, the other 5%, when it rotates past the park position, power is cut off and the motor has to coast through that dead zone on inertia before it can get power again. If the mechanism is sticky or binding, it can cause hesitation as it passes through that point.

When the switch is turned Off, if the motor is not in the park position, the switch continues to supply power to the motor through a different path. As the motor reaches the park position, the switch and cam short the power and ground connections of the motor together and the reverse EMF from that acts as a brake and stops the motor in the park position.

What is not standard on your setup is those two large yellow capacitors someone has wired to the High and Low motor terminals. As a test, undo that one screw and move their ring terminal up out of the way so they aren't connected any more and see if has any effect on your results. In theory, they should just be acting as noise suppression for your radio, but would increase the sparking as the contacts close.

So I did some more trouble shooting.

I disconnected those capacitors. No effect, still hesitates and sparks.

I took it apart again and wiped off the grease to get a better look. I found where it was arcing, making that spark and thus causing the hesitation and blowing fuses.

I also noticed that the copper finger that was running furthest out looked like it might not be making contact at 100%. I bent it in a touch. It actually swiveled in. The finger that was arcing also looked like it wasn't sticking out as far as the others, so I bent that out a bit.

I reapplied some of the grease I had removed, and put it back together. Still does it.

I then started disconnecting the leads and when I disconnected 31b, it stopped that sparking/hesitation crap. I was wondering why there were two grounds???? Anyway, it works, low, high and park.

Does this make sense? The way Justin explained it, one of the features should not work? Maybe I should be happy it works and stop overthinking it.

Carlos,

Total aside (and I hesitate to ask)... but your car has no top, nor provision for one, and you are legally registered in NC. Why do you want wipers at all?

Wipers help in the event of unexpected rain, top or not, it happens...

I've been caught in a couple of down pours and as kick ass as Rain X is, it's just not enough. I had the assembly sitting in a box anyway.

I also have an idea for a bikini top that can be stored in the trunk. Not that I'm ever planning to drive while it's raining, but just in case I get caught again. Which I will, I'm sure. If I were to ever entertain the thought of hooking up with you all in a distant location, I'm going to need something. The bikini top, if it'll even work, would be great for a sun and wind shade on long runs. I'll take pictures when I get the first prototype done.

Very much looking forward to this. Still pondering weather gear on my project. Plan to install wipers from the jump tho. 

"Maybe I should be happy it works and stop overthinking it."

Absolutely.  

It works.  Enjoy it that way.

This is basic way I do it....I run an independent ground to the wiper motor case then lightly power each wire with low amp 12v it either moves the mech or its ground. I find the low and high speed wires then find the park wire that is 12v hot until the points disconnect in the wiper motor, the remaining wire is ground...

My wipers go so slow its not even worth turning them on. One day I will dig into that project.

I can vouch for the wipers on a topless Spyder. I ran that way for a few years before I had a top. They DO work, even in the pouring rain they help vision. That and a towel to wipe the inside makes it survivable. Definitely not fun or comfortable though.

When I got my car the wipers had no park feature, but Hi and Low worked(only 2 wires to the switch). I played with the wiring and took it apart just like Carlos and popped a bunch of fuses until I figured it out. Mine is wired like the diagram I posted above. I cleaned it, re-greased it, and re-assembled. Works great now.

Carlos, say thanks to yourself and don't over analyze it. Accept that it works!

I am also working on a top design, but similar to the Boxster Spyder design, with upright rear window, plexi side curtains, and cloth flying buttresses to the rear clamshell. The top should roll up flat and store in the front trunk with no frame to speak of, plus three flat windows. 

I reconfigured mine and they park on the drivers side now. It's installed and doesn't blow fuses. Now I just need to order another arm and two 10" blades.

My bikini top will be similar to yours in design, but will have a frame that can be collapsed that will support a bow above your head.

I need to work on my cool weather tonneau cover first. I have the pattern and material, I just need to get to it.

Before I installed the wiper assembly, I installed a little something to pop the trunk lid up a bit so that I can fit my fingers under the edge to open it. I used a piece of aluminum angle, a spring from a D cell flashlight, and the grommet that came on my wiper assembly.

Carlos G posted:

I reconfigured mine and they park on the drivers side now. It's installed and doesn't blow fuses. Now I just need to order another arm and two 10" blades.

My bikini top will be similar to yours in design, but will have a frame that can be collapsed that will support a bow above your head.

I need to work on my cool weather tonneau cover first. I have the pattern and material, I just need to get to it.

Before I installed the wiper assembly, I installed a little something to pop the trunk lid up a bit so that I can fit my fingers under the edge to open it. I used a piece of aluminum angle, a spring from a D cell flashlight, and the grommet that came on my wiper assembly.

 

Gentlemen of the SOC:

That, right there is a very nice quality fabrication. Stainless button-head hardware with washers. AL angle, rounded at the corners

... and the genius spring arrangement. Carlos, you sir, are the man.

X2, that is some sweet fab work, Carlos!

I'm stealing that!

Thanks you two. I didn't get to check Stan's car out and there are a few things on Danny's car that I want to see.

I'd love to be able to check your rides out with some detail. I'm pretty new to these cars, but love seeing those little things that make something just that much better. Maybe next year.

The bolt that holds the spring will be replaced. That's just what I had in my can of stainless hardware. I might even get a stainless spring from McMaster Carr. The grommet is perfect. I also added a round piece of Shelter Tape to the trunk lid where the grommet meets paint. It's a thick clear plastic with industrial sticky on one side. We use it at the shop to protect carbon fiber bike frames from rocks.

Impressive work, Carlos.  Maybe you should convince the owners of your bike shop to branch out into Speedster/Spyder repair.  Hey, it could work!

Carlos G posted:

So I did some more trouble shooting.

I disconnected those capacitors. No effect, still hesitates and sparks.

I took it apart again and wiped off the grease to get a better look. I found where it was arcing, making that spark and thus causing the hesitation and blowing fuses.

I also noticed that the copper finger that was running furthest out looked like it might not be making contact at 100%. I bent it in a touch. It actually swiveled in. The finger that was arcing also looked like it wasn't sticking out as far as the others, so I bent that out a bit.

I reapplied some of the grease I had removed, and put it back together. Still does it.

I then started disconnecting the leads and when I disconnected 31b, it stopped that sparking/hesitation crap. I was wondering why there were two grounds???? Anyway, it works, low, high and park.

Does this make sense? The way Justin explained it, one of the features should not work? Maybe I should be happy it works and stop overthinking it.

When the switch is in the Low or High position, the 31b terminal on the switch is (or rather supposed to be) physically disconnected internally. Removing the wire from the 31b terminal on the motor should have had no effect when running. That leads me to believe that either the wiring is mixed up or the switch is bad. Doubly so when you say the motor can still park with that wire disconnected.

On the motor in the picture above, the terminals from left to right are 53a, 31b, 53, and 53b. All four should go to the corresponding terminal on the switch. The single terminal below those four is 31. That should be a permanent connection to ground, that is one of the two ground wires in your harness with ring terminals.

On the switch, if you pull the connections off, you should see the terminal numbers printed next to the six posts. 53a, 31b, 53, and 53b should go to the corresponding terminals on the motor. 30 is for power (red wire). 31 is a permanent connection to ground, that is one of the two ground wires in your harness with ring terminals.

My best guess is that they mixed up the two brown wires on the motor. If the motor's 31b terminal were connected to a permanent ground instead of correctly through the switch, that would cause a short whenever the switch is in the Low speed position and every time the motor passes the park position. It would also cause hesitation as most of the current is dumped through the short instead of powering the motor. I recommend you double check the wires are going to the correct places.

Am I missing something here. I test fit the wiper arms in various positions in it's stroke. The wiper arm on the drivers side comes in contact with the rubber windshield seal, and the wiper is a few inches off of the glass.

Do I need to bend a ridiculous arch in the arm to make it clear?

Do I have the wrong arms?

Do my posts not extend far enough out?

BTW, I removed the spring for test fitting.

Well for one, this wiper arm is not made for a spyder or speedster for that matter.

You might have room to put a spacer in or grind some arm off to clear the rubber. Or both.

You've got the wrong arms, Carlos. I initially thought the windshield was too far forward on yours, but mine is in the same exact location. 

I figured that at least one of the arms that was sent to me by Seduction was correct, so I ordered another one to match. Oh well.

What is the part number for those arms?

Thanks.

On all my projects 70 - 72 wiper arms ( both are right hand side) These fit the tapered spline shafts that use OEM VW acorn nuts to secure the arm

Carlos, check with @chines1 to see what the Beck folks use.

I don't know what year mine are. They were sent to me by a fellow Spydeclub member, and I painted the blades, arms, and acorn nuts in hammertone silver. Bug City in Berlin(appropriately!), CT is a great place to call and talk to. It's a one-man band run by a man named Dave. I have bought lots of stuff from him, and he supplied me with new blades and used acorn nuts to fit my arms. Give him a call Carlos, he knows his stuff. I think you want two right side arms like Alan suggested.

https://www.bugcity.com/