Your thoughts on this Speedster....

That car was discussed here a few months ago and as I recall, the consensus was something like "wow, amazing build, but not for me." It's a tough crowd. 

Nice build,I suspect it will find a home, but probably not at the asking price, unless they are really patient.

too much bling

My wife and I are going to be at Monterey Car Week Aug 12-18 and will try to go on Saturday to see what the Outlaw goes for. We have been to this auction during Car Week before and a lot of cars don’t sell because of the reserve, at least not on the block but maybe later. We are going to put a small For Sale sign where ever we park our speedster and our phone number and if the price is right we will sell it down there and rent a car for rest of the week.  People looking for cars during Car Week have lots of money and going to spend way more than some cars are worth.  I am going to put $30,000 on my small For Sale sign, just for fun, but I am bringing all the paperwork and build receipts with me, and we are also attending all the Porsche events. In fact, on Monday night I have tickets to the Porsche Monterey Classic Porsche Party and I let them know already that I have a reproduction fiberglass ‘56 Speedster with a Porsche 912 engine and they wrote me back and said they look forward to meeting me and my wife.

Color me confused.  It is titled as a 1970 VW, but I could find no mention of that in the ebay ad; only that it was a 1956 Porsche Outlaw.  The Mecum ad seems to be more honest and transparent.

"Custom One-off Build"? - Absolutely.  As in, built to one person's preferences, not mine.

Turbocharged air-cooled stroked and bored VW engine?  Sounds unreliable, hot, and expensive to fix or replace.  Should have gone with Subaru or 6 cylinder for more power.

I much prefer the look of a stock speedster to custom.  I like most of Emory's outlaws, but not his outlaws with the more radical body mods.

If titled as 1970 VW, I would guess that it is built with a Type 1 and and suspension?  Nothing wrong with that, but if you are going to spend $140,000, wouldn't you go with a modern tube frame and modern, more advanced, better handling suspension than 70 year old technology?

Bottom line: it is a highly customized, not improved, fiberglass replica speedster, and I don't see why anybody would pay more than any other replica speedster.  Actually, I would pay less for this car than I would for a nice IM or Beck.

Thank you all for your input.  I will be in Monterey during car-week looking.  Perhaps I will see yours down there.  

I have heard the build on the one in question is spectacular.  It will be nice to see it on person.

Not sure why you are confused.  The vast majority of Speedster replicas in the US are titled as VW's, since Vintage built most of the replicas built in the last 25 years, and routinely had them registered as VW's.  Titled as a 1970 VW merely means it was built on a 1970 VW pan with VW VIN.  I read nothing about suspension, so you may be right about stock suspension, but, since they upgraded the brakes and tranny, you would expect an upgraded suspension as well.

Regarding "customized, not improved", I know of no replica manufacturers that build cars on spec, so all replicas are customized, with the owner choosing body style, engine, transmission, body and interior color and seats.  Many buyers would find the engine, transmission, brakes, tires, wheels, paint, seats, and interior to be improvements.

A 2387 cc, turbo'd Type 1 will never last as long as a smaller, naturally-aspirated engine, and will cost more to overhaul than a 1600, but it should be fast.  It may not be then engine you would choose, but others may find it desirable.  For most of us, factors for an engine build are cost, performance, reliability and longevity, but the relative weight we give each characteristic differs for all of us.   

I agree with Jim.  With the four wheel disk brake set up, the amount of time and money put into the Speedster in discussion, I am sure the builder would not have built on 70's technology for the suspension.  

Any thoughts and opinions on what this one will hammer for at Mecum?

iBi posted:

I agree with Jim.  With the four wheel disk brake set up, the amount of time and money put into the Speedster in discussion, I am sure the builder would not have built on 70's technology for the suspension.  

Any thoughts and opinions on what this one will hammer for at Mecum?

Very narrow niche car.....big dollars for what one might construe as a "PIMPED" out speedster, PARDON the expression....despite the fact that one might have never seen a pimp driving a speedster.

One never knows how an auction will go as "there is a seat for every tush".  One man's treasure is another man's garbage....CERTAINLY some fine craftsmanship in an unusual direction.

Probably draw a big crowd in a BEST BUY/COSTCO parking lot?

BE SAFE...

Honestly, with a VW pan there is not much you can do to improve the suspension - add anti-sway bars front and rear, lower rear torsion bar (std), front beam adjusters (pretty std fare), adjustable shocks (oil are just fine though), a 3.88 R&P beefed-up transaxle, and front and rear disc brakes are about it.  Unless you are into air suspension.

Wow!  I think I could find a better use for 90K.  If it grenades it'll be SPECTACULAR !

WOLFGANG posted:

Honestly, with a VW pan there is not much you can do to improve the suspension - add anti-sway bars front and rear, lower rear torsion bar (std), front beam adjusters (pretty std fare), adjustable shocks (oil are just fine though), a 3.88 R&P beefed-up transaxle, and front and rear disc brakes are about it.  Unless you are into air suspension.

Kevin Zagar would disagree. Just because it’s on a pan doesn’t mean it has a beam. I’ve heard mixed reviews on how well Kevin’s stuff works, but no one can argue that a pan car with full Mendeola is “just a VW suspension”.

I’m not saying this car has any suspension improvements (since the ad doesn’t seem to have any mention made of it). But just as we can’t assume it has, we can’t assume it doesn’t.

WOLFGANG posted:

Honestly, with a VW pan there is not much you can do to improve the suspension - add anti-sway bars front and rear, lower rear torsion bar (std), front beam adjusters (pretty std fare), adjustable shocks (oil are just fine though), a 3.88 R&P beefed-up transaxle, and front and rear disc brakes are about it.  Unless you are into air suspension.

Except for a full Mendeola suspension setup.

Looks pretty substantial and better than stock suspension.

I love the suspension.  The Mendeola setup is fantastic!!!  Thank you for the input!

Jim Kelly posted:

Not sure why you are confused.  The vast majority of Speedster replicas in the US are titled as VW's, since Vintage built most of the replicas built in the last 25 years, and routinely had them registered as VW's.  Titled as a 1970 VW merely means it was built on a 1970 VW pan with VW VIN.  I read nothing about suspension, so you may be right about stock suspension, but, since they upgraded the brakes and tranny, you would expect an upgraded suspension as well.

Regarding "customized, not improved", I know of no replica manufacturers that build cars on spec, so all replicas are customized, with the owner choosing body style, engine, transmission, body and interior color and seats.  Many buyers would find the engine, transmission, brakes, tires, wheels, paint, seats, and interior to be improvements.

A 2387 cc, turbo'd Type 1 will never last as long as a smaller, naturally-aspirated engine, and will cost more to overhaul than a 1600, but it should be fast.  It may not be then engine you would choose, but others may find it desirable.  For most of us, factors for an engine build are cost, performance, reliability and longevity, but the relative weight we give each characteristic differs for all of us.   

I was confused because as far as I could read, the ebay ad did not mention that it was a fiberglass replica.  It seemed to be passing it off as a 1956 Porsche Speedster, modified as an outlaw.  But, maybe I missed something in the ad that indicated it was a replica.

You are pretty much saying exactly what I was saying, "To each their own."  The original poster asked for opinions and thoughts.  I gave mine.  It would be fun for a day, maybe two.  Maybe the present owner had that experience?  Spent $130,000 and asking $90,000 after driving it 101 miles?

Maybe all replicas are custom, but most of the replicas look much more like the stock 356s than this car.  The owner spent a lot of money customizing this car to his taste, and in my opinion the more stock looking replicas are better looking.  Heck, it may not even be built to the owner's taste since he is selling it after 101 miles and taking a minimum loss of $40,000.

You can't take it on a trip, unless you get a top custom made to fit.  I don't know much, and one of the things I don't know is how would you fit at top to a windshield with no trim.

I do like the idea of an air inlet in the rear quarter panel, but I don't like the color of the inlet painted a different color than the body.  In my opinion, if adding an air inlet, it's best if it is made to look as if was stock, or something the original manufacturer would have done if they could do whatever they wanted.

The original poster gave a thank you for input and comments, so I assume he wants them.  If he had not asked for opinions and thoughts, I would not have given them.

Send me $90 large and  I will build you almost any combo you what  , this  includes a delivered  " She Shed" in choice of colors for your lady ~

iBi posted:

I agree with Jim.  With the four wheel disk brake set up, the amount of time and money put into the Speedster in discussion, I am sure the builder would not have built on 70's technology for the suspension.  

Any thoughts and opinions on what this one will hammer for at Mecum?

A "four wheel disc brake set up" and a "pro-street" transaxle do not indicate to me that the builder would use other than '70s suspension technology.  My replica has both and it says little or nothing about the suspension in my replica.  My memory says that a 1970 Bug had an IRS rear suspension.  How much upgrading can you do to a bug IRS?  That is a serious question; not sarcasm.  I guess you could go with a Mendeola.  If I had  an highly upgraded suspension in a replica that I was selling, I would mention it in the listing. Wouldn't you?  If I had an upgraded suspension, I would also include photos of the suspension.  And if I was going to build a replica with a highly upgraded suspension, I wouldn't have started with a 1970 Type 1 pan.  In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with a Type 1 pan.  I like them.  But, asking $90,000?  I don't see it, and to answer iBi's question, I have no idea what it will go for.  Will there be a reserve?  If so, I don't think it will sell.

I am sure there will be a reserve as it does not list "no reserve" on the mecum website.  However, will the reserve be the asking price on eBay?  I do not know.  I will be in Monterey at the show.  I will be a bidder.  I will see how it does and see when the reserve is pulled (if there is a reserve). 

On another note, I have been told it does have an upgraded suspension - Mendeola kit.

I know this speedster does not appeal to everyone.  However, I like it.  It looks like a spectacular build with a lot invested in it.

iBi posted:

I am sure there will be a reserve as it does not list "no reserve" on the mecum website.  However, will the reserve be the asking price on eBay?  I do not know.  I will be in Monterey at the show.  I will be a bidder.  I will see how it does and see when the reserve is pulled (if there is a reserve). 

On another note, I have been told it does have an upgraded suspension - Mendeola kit.

I know this speedster does not appeal to everyone.  However, I like it.  It looks like a spectacular build with a lot invested in it.

That's all that matters....enjoy and be safe.

iBi posted:

However, I like it. 

That's all that maters.

It looks like a spectacular build with a lot invested in it.

Personally, I have never invested in a car.  I have only spent money on them.